So you are saying that this time, they're really going to get Fred? Not without changing the law.
Fedex Ground Are Fedex Employee's. California 9th Circuit Ruling.
- Thread starter FedExcrement
- Start date
Cactus
Just telling it like it is
Sounds to me like California has made a very good start.
barnyard
KTM rider
They have. They usually win them on appeal though. There was one in Ohio for sure.
Time to pay up,Uncle Freddie!
Here is FedEx's version http://news.van.fedex.com/FedEx_Gro...essReleases+(FedEx+Newsroom+-+Press+Releases) What FedEx is going to try to do, is appeal the ruling by saying "look since 2011 we only contract with incorporated business" see we have changed so lets just forget all about this past stuff.
Personally as a FedEx Express employee I hope the courts throw the book at FedEx, they used these people to build Ground up to what it is today, they took advantage of these drivers who were willing to work for far less than what a UPS or Express employee made, and in turn undercut my pay and benefits as an Express employee.
Personally as a FedEx Express employee I hope the courts throw the book at FedEx, they used these people to build Ground up to what it is today, they took advantage of these drivers who were willing to work for far less than what a UPS or Express employee made, and in turn undercut my pay and benefits as an Express employee.
They may very well have to pay a settlement for past transgressions, but that will not change anything for them going forward. Expect finalization in 3 to 4 years depending on the appeal process.
Correct rtd, but, they don't say that Ex, a Fortune 500 company, now enters contracts with "thousands" of incorporated businesses that have ZERO business experience, and no idea how to work their business. (Tell stockholders that and nothing more, see how long they invest. Ex is the worldwide leader in taking fractured context to slant their way, as they were admonished by the judge for such practices.) Therefore, forcing us, Ex, to show these businesses how to work this endeavor right down to how to carry their keys, control their load so they won't fail, etc., all for the good of their business. Oh yeah, their business is really our business. Puppet corporations with all strings pulled by the master. Ex will never give up the excessive control, no matter how they "tweak" it, the IC/ISP will never be independent. No matter what Fred tries, ground drivers still function in the same intrinsic way Express, his original company in this industry that uses employees, does. Ex wants to call a dog's tail a leg, good for them, we all know the tail is a tail, no matter what Ex tell us
HA HA HA...not change anything? Isn't change constant? Expect? Suddenly you know when to expect, two weeks ago it was nothing will ever happen as Ex has tweaked it to be legal. Going forward.....we will see if the "control" is no longer excessive, just because you are now a corp. and pay employees doesn't change the "control" of your management service. I know you think it's a business, management service is more like it. Appeal process? Now at the level where things go MUCH faster, until the Supreme Court, if it gets there. As the judges have said previously "Pay these drivers, they have waited for THEIR money long enough" which will become the new mantra.
Wow. Your vigor is impressive but venom weak. For years Cactus, MFE, TDHE, and others around here have heralded the coming downfall of the Ground model. You simply don't understand what you are talking about. I've seen it from the inside. I've argued time and time again about what the phrase "at the discretion of the ISP" means. But that's what happens with a legal document. There are a thousand different ways that Fedex has to "exert control" without violating the overly vague contracting laws. The dirtiest part of it is that the law won't change because governments at every level take advantage of the same statutes, laws, and regulations. Why would they come to the rescue of a few thousand contractors and put their own practices at risk?
But generally government accepts bids from contractors to do a certain job and when the job is finished that independent contractor looks for other situations. FedEx Ground is an ongoing situation where "contractors" look and act and are controlled just like regular employees without the pay and benefits regular employees receive. Granted in your situation you've built up a business with your own employees, you aren't a single route contractor. But even then it could be argued you are a manager over people who look and act like regular employees, and are regulated to the point that they are employees without the pay and benefits employees receive. By the way the judge who ruled against FedEx was appointed by Reagan.
My contract with FedEx is for 5 years. What happens after that? Either side can walk away. And nowhere in any contracting law does it address such an issue. Regardless what the reality looks like, does Fedex operate within the confines of the law? In this case, this court has decided that they haven't but it I overturning a previous ruling. FedEx legal has changed the contract and since 2011, these cases seem to have dwindled. It's too bad too. The contractors have "won", but they're about to get crapped on because of it. There isn't a single ISP in our building that believes we're better off now than when we were contractors. The company is savvy, ruthless, and will use this as an opportunity to further shed cost.
Overpaid Union Thug
Well-Known Member
My thoughts exactly. This whole model has been a scam from the very beginning. But Fred S and his croney capitalist buddies in Washington, being the snakes that they are, will slither their way out of this. Just like they've always done with the RLA issue for the Express side.
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Cactus
Just telling it like it is
Welcome to our world.
But the contractors already paid those taxes. If anyone collects, it'll be the contractors, who as employees would have had their SS taxes matched by FedEx but paid all of it themselves.
You're right, if there's a way to come out on top with this they'll find it. Looks like they will give Express a raise this year, but if they do start shelling out billions I doubt we'll see another one soon.
STFXG
Well-Known Member
Most contractors pay themselves a very small salary. The majority of the money they take out in divideds. Back then it wasn't uncommon for contractors to take everything in dividends/pass through income to avoid self employment taxes.
Now that we are required to be incorporated we have to treat ourselves as employees as well. So it's now required.
Brownslave688
You want a toe? I can get you a toe.
You yourself have admitted you'll ride the wave as long as possible but expect it to come crashin down
