Myron Named to UPS Management Committee

Discussion in 'UPS Discussions' started by Hoaxster, Jan 6, 2009.

  1. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt Dark Prince of Double Standards Staff Member

    Originally Posted by Myron
    Let me know how close I am.

    Closer than we thought...Congratulations!!!

    Jim Winestock, a 40-year veteran of UPS who for the past four years has overseen all package operations in the United States, will retire in February.
    He will be succeeded as the senior vice president of U.S. operations by Myron Gray, currently the head of UPS’s regional operations in Canada and all of Latin America.
    In his new position, the 51-year-old Gray will join UPS’s Management Committee, comprised of the company’s 12 most senior executives.
    ... Davis continued. “Myron has decades of experience in the package operation, but also has worked in industrial engineering and business development in addition to his international experience heading the Americas Region. It is a testament to the strength and depth of our management team that we have such high-caliber managers who can step up.”
    Gray joined UPS in 1978 as a part-time package handler in the Tennessee District while attending the University of Memphis. He subsequently earned a degree in business administration and also has completed advanced management programs at INSEAD in Fontainebleau, France, and the Yale School of Business.
    In 1984, Gray became a package delivery driver and then was promoted to operations supervisor. He was promoted in 1989 to a package division manager in delivery operations and from 1989 to 1995, rotated through a variety of assignments in Tennessee and California.
    In 1995, he was promoted to vice president and COO of the Southeast Texas District and three years later, assumed command of UPS’s Rocky Mountain District.
    In 2001, Gray moved to Atlanta to take on a special corporate assignment and in 2002, was promoted to president of the Southwest Region. He took over
    the North Central Region in 2004, then assumed command of UPS’s Americas Region in January 2008.
    For the past 17 years, he has been an active participant in the Black Executive Exchange Program sponsored by the National Urban League. He is a member of the Dillard University Board of Trustees; the Miami-Dade United Way Board of Trustees, and serves as a director of CLADEC (Central and Latin American Express Delivery Conference).
  2. Myron

    Myron New Member

    Funny, my mom's maiden name is Myron-Grey! I always thought it was pretty humorous.
  3. Covemastah

    Covemastah Suspension Ovah !!! Tom is free FU Goodell !!

    Started in 1978 as a package handler and has 40 yrs??? Oh Yah thats UPS I.E math sorry, my bad!!!:laughing:
  4. trplnkl

    trplnkl 555

    Reading Comprehension 101....

    Jim Winestock, a 40-year veteran
    Gray joined UPS in 1978 as a part-time package handler

    Class dismissed.
  5. trickpony1

    trickpony1 Well-Known Member

    I guess I confuse easily.
    I thought the Myron Gray that posts here was a dissident who is, was or is soon to be discriminated against due to the age related issues he speaks of.
    We now have an article posted about his involvement in the hierarchy of "our" company.
    I'm confused, I could be wrong.
    Anyone wanna help me get on the same page as the rest of the world?
  6. trplnkl

    trplnkl 555

    Trick, I really don't think Myron the poster is the same as the UPS Myron Gray. I thought the same thing at first. Then figured that if it was, he was speaking out of another orifice than what is normally used.
  7. Covemastah

    Covemastah Suspension Ovah !!! Tom is free FU Goodell !!

    Thanks for clearing that up,my bad,,long night!!!!
  8. trplnkl

    trplnkl 555

    Trust me, I do unnerstan that. I was just pokin a little fun your way. Was really not trying to be rude or nuttin'
  9. Covemastah

    Covemastah Suspension Ovah !!! Tom is free FU Goodell !!

    None taken TRP//// I got thick skin!!! Guttah to work here !! lol
  10. scratch

    scratch Least Best Moderator Staff Member

    I used to work for Jim Winestock back when I was PT in the Atlanta Hub. He was a sort manager then. He had an Afro back then and I remember he had a deep, booming voice. He was a very sharp guy, he could size up problems in the operation quick and fix problems. Those of us around here that worked for him have a lot of respect for him. I don't know either Myron though....
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2009
  11. pretzel_man

    pretzel_man Well-Known Member

    I've worked with Jim many times. I also found him to be an intelligent, honest, no-nonsense guy. He is a good man and an asset to UPS.

    I've had less interaction with Myron over the years, but they have always been positive. I also found him to be very intelligent and an excellent manager.

    More changes will come. Eric Kirchner the Freight Forwarding president left UPS and will cause other changes to happen...

  12. tieguy

    tieguy Banned

    ups does age you quickly.:happy-very:
  13. Myron

    Myron New Member

    Please Trick,

    I never stated I was, or soon to be discriminated against due to age. I have only stated what I have observed in two districts I am familiar with, the age demographics of dismissal (voluntary or forced), demotion and disability claims for management seem to point toward attrition of the older management more frequently than younger management. The practice of hiring and promotion of younger individuals to fill the roles left by older employees is skewed toward younger individuals. That my friend is a potential pattern of what age discrimination truly is.

    In the districts I am familiar with, 70% of UPS management workforce is over 40 and only 30% is under, therefore it would seem you would have relatively similar attrition numbers. My observations have shown that this is not the case. The attrition situation (demotion, termination, disability) is over triple for managment employees over 40 but not yet 55 versus managment that is under 40. That is all. I urge you to see for yourself in the location you are familiar with.

    It appears now that there is massive redundancy in the districts and functions that have consolidated in terms of management and other non-union.... It would be intriguing to know of the districts consolidated, what the resulting attrition rates of the people who are over 40 versus those younger. My wager is there are proportionately more people leaving or taking lesser roles in those consolidated districts who are over 40 than under forty relative to age demographic percentages.

    I want you to take shots at what I have written based on what see in your own district. Not for me, for you! If you don't accumulate data for yourself and still consider me a dissident then you truly either don't care about the company you work for, or perhaps the others you work with. I love them both.

    Do you think we lose money in lawsuits because we are doing the right thing always? Do you know Mike Clark in Iowa help to cost us MILLIONS because of what he was doing? Get a clue. You can call me an observer. Dissident doesn't fit correctly.

    Myron-Grey is my mother's maiden name. I would hope each of you would have enough common sense to realize Myron Gray wasn't my real name. Also, trplnkl, my oral pharnyx works just fine as does my larynx. LOL.

    A good partner is a smart partner....and hopefully not blind or too stubborn or lazy to look.

  14. trplnkl

    trplnkl 555

    Myron, I'm glad you took my remark light hearted, as I meant it.

    Not that I am disputing that age discrimination is going on, I'm sure it is. But isn't most of what I quoted here just a pattern of how the world works, not just UPS or any other business...just life in general?
  15. trickpony1

    trickpony1 Well-Known Member

    Take a deep breath.
    I'm on your side.
    I misunderstood the tone of your posts as indicating you were being singled out for this treatment.

    My bad.
  16. Myron

    Myron New Member

    Dear Trick, Nope, I have not been singled out (yet) but I have watched it happen repeatedly to many people for reasons I am dumb founded by.

    I have had 11 "broken" managers work for me since I became a manager in 1989. When I was younger I didn't get into discussions about what caused their demotions with them. I felt it was a personal matter in all cases and would not discuss it with them unless they brought it up with me. I never kept a note -- except mentally.

    Nine years ago, I became familiar with a situation where a division manager had a center manager demoted for supposedly not getting his delivery scan numbers. The irony of this was the scan was the responsibility of a 34 year old preload manager. The center manager had to constantly work through the younger preload manager to get his delivery scan improved. The division manager knew this but NEVER took the preload manager on to assist to assist the older manager. Later the division manager publicly stated he had to "kick him (the older manager) while he was down".

    I became involved when this now broken center manager became a driver supervisor in my center. (My 11th busted manager). He was great in every other role he held until this time except his 2nd operational rotation where he was demoted. Prior to all of this, he was told in order to become a division manager he needed rotations in operations. Now he was mine to keep motivated, but he needed little incentive. He was motivated and a good worker. So good at work, I became puzzled as to how it was possible he could ever have been demoted. At the same time I had another driver supervisor who was also a broken manager; and he also was a very diligent supervisor. Excellent in assessing situations and acting on them.

    I began to become skeptical about what I was seeing when a newly promoted 34 year old manager (no surprise, a promotion to replace a 3rd OLDER demoted manager) came to work under the influence--blown out on non-prescribed medication-a controlled substance. This younger manager happened to be African American. What made me question this matter was that just a year earlier a 48 year old who ALSO was African American was DEMOTED for similar circumstances. This older manager came to work and was demoted for less a obvious; but similar issue-the older African American gentleman came to work with JUST THE ODOR of alcohol-he was not tested. This older person was then demoted! The younger manager was obviously abusing drugs and no demotion ensued. WHY NOT??

    As they took the younger 34 year old manager out of service and into EAP (again, no demotion), a still younger (29 year old) was then promoted to take his position. This circumvented the "promotion process", bypassing not only the 2 older "broken" managers who worked for me, but hundreds of capable older supervisors in mine and other districts. Competent supervisors with more experience and similar education.

    I BEGAN TO ASK VERY POINTED QUESTIONS OF ALL THE PARTNERS WHO WORKED FOR ME IN THE PAST WHO WERE BUSTED. "Why were you demoted and who replaced you??" What I was hearing made me concerned, but I was, and am still afraid to talk to anyone including the 800 line. However, I want it known; the reasons for my rants here.

    What I am seeing could put me at huge risk. Everyone understands where the 800 complaints get routed! Who do you speak with? How could anyone bring this to the attention of a district manager and not be thought of as what you have suggested- A DISSIDENT!! Permanently wrecking my career???

    I DO NOT WISH TO ROCK THE BOAT. On the other hand I am very close to people in many districts through work in staff functions as well as my own district. I began calling friends in my home distict who I could contact over the course of a year or so as I found time and their home phone numbers. I did not wish to discuss this matter at UPS with higher ups until I was certain of what I was finding.

    In my district, I knew of 42 individuals all over 40 in 12 years who were demoted. ONLY 2 were under 40. ALL were replaced by younger people-race and gender were equally represented, but NOT age. I then began calling some of the people who resigned (again a very disproportionate number of older people).

    Many of the reasons are legitimate reasons for separation and demotion. On the other hand when 63 or so people have an adverse employment action and only 6 are under 40 IN JUST ONE DISTRICT, and ALL are replaced by under 40 year old people, it begs one to ask a very pointed (but very fearful) question; WHY??

    In 2004 I started talking to my partners I have known from special assignments and schools who are in other districts (Georgia, E. Bay, Indiana, Michigan, Detroit, DC, and others) and asked if they are seeing the same trend. All suggested they are seeing a disproportionate number of younger promotions, but because most lacked the HRIS listings they could not see the ages of the promotions; but it was apparent who they were replacing.

    Until I came across a supervisor in late 2005 who worked for me 20+ years prior who had taken a position in Alabama. What he stated made my head spin. In 2004 we (UPS) began to double up supervisor jobs. It was not going on where I am. UPS began putting supervisors in charge of multiple operations (preload/driver line or local sort/driver line). No big deal at face value, but the supervisors who were being put into these jobs in Alabama were all over 50! They had lost 4 supervisors in just 6 months who stated they could not do the job. They were told if they could not do the work, they didn't have a job. NO STRESS THERE.

    I observed as this practice spread north a little over a year later; 2006. I saw no under 40 year old supervisors given the task of multiple operations. Shortly there after, we then began putting managers in charge of multiple centers with no additional resources. Again, these managers are all over 40. The stress levels are enormous and the potential for failure in various elements are unprecedented.

    As these people step down, resign or are forcibly demoted, I have only seen one replaced by an over 40 promotion (one who was previously busted!) The remainder have ALL been replaced by younger people. In some cases the demoted individuals step down and DO THE SAME JOB!!!

    I don't want to make waves. I hesitated even posting on what I have seen. On the other hand, with 4 years left until I am 55, I can not stand idly by anymore not pointing out deficiencies in our system BUT I CAN NOT CALL THE 800 LINE. I AM CERTAIN I AM NOT SUPPOSED TO KNOW WHAT I KNOW AND UPPER MANAGEMENT CAN GET RID OF CENTER MANAGERS IN A BLINK AND YES I AM AFRAID. I have watched tremendous talent leave the business with literally just months left to retire, be demoted, or be put on disability with nervous breakdowns.

    The last straw was when the district nurse provided me with knowledge of the disability list for management over the last 7 years. I was floored. I went to my division manager last April to discuss what I had found IN A GENERAL WAY; he candidly told me what he was seeing. He stated he was afraid to stand up when asked his thoughts about promotions in people meetings. He also stated the operation matters and procedures were increasingly being pushed onto OPERATIONS MANAGERS from above (the region) and the division managers were being given less and less say. Hence perhaps the reason why NEARLY ALL ATTRITION IS IN THE OPERATIONS.

    My division manager then went onto suggest that the reduction of resources and increasing use of management on the street was being done with corporate knowledge. Siting the number of management on stress, anxiety or other type disability; he suggested this was also a predetermined number; "in the plan". I never told him how many people I saw this happen to because like you- I AM SURE HE WOULD LOOK AT ME AS A DISSIDENT. I take NO offense to this!

    I am far from being a dissident. I know what is right and what is wrong and what I am seeing flat out stinks. WHO CAN I GO TO WITH MATERIAL LIKE THIS? So far I can keep if for my own safe keeping so if something happens to me I might have some recourse, but if I don't share my observations, I can almost not look at myself in the mirror knowing what has gone on--knowing it is likely happening in every district.

    I appreciate your thoughts....

    TRPLNKL, I at first thought this matter was just how the world works. On the other hand, when our hiring practices constantly draw people who are less than 25 years old, and when we supposedly only promote from within, you have automatically stacked the deck in favor of younger management and hourly employees.

    When attrition at the older ages happens more rapidly than at the younger ages, and replacements are younger than your average management age, well I believe these are truly indicators of improper activity. There can be only one logical explanation as to why it is happening and that is wages, and later benefit costs of retirees. My problem as I state earlier is, I am afraid to talk to anyone. I mean just trying to put it out on this BLOG has got me freaking I talk with an attorney or with my partners for 27 years-the people I love but cannot altogether trust?? If it gets out that I might speak to an attorney I am sure I would be doomed politically if not worse.

    Now back to breathing!
  17. pretzel_man

    pretzel_man Well-Known Member


    I'm not sure which district you are talking about, but I've worked in many myself.

    I've been with UPS for 33 years and have been in countless people meetings. I've certainly been over 40 for quite some time and saw 50 a few years ago.

    I have never been directed to pressure or lose those more senior members of my group. In fact the opposite has been true. Age discrimination is illegal and I've been couseled on how to approach members of my group to discuss their career.

    For instance, for planning purposes I have to get an idea of when people will retire. I have to make sure I don't make it seem like I am encouraging it.

    The last time I looked at the corporate numbers, it did not support your statement on attrition.

    Since I cannot refute the accuracy of the information you presented I can only give you my side of the story.

    It seems to me that to take the data points you have seen and then accuse UPS of conspiracy to act illegally is quite a stretch.

  18. UPS Lifer

    UPS Lifer Well-Known Member

    I agree 100%! I was a 20 year manager who retired and never felt that age was an issue in my region.
  19. Myron

    Myron New Member

    I still would like to know who I would go to with the information I have without feeling I am going to have hell to pay for it. I know what opening a can of worms can bring here-Do I wait and see if it ever happens to me? Do I talk at all? So it might be your advice to let what I have go and not worry about it?

    I don't want to believe that ANYTHING I have seen is purposeful. Ignorant definitely but hopefully not purposeful. On the other hand, many, many things have changed in the last 6 or 7 years to make me wonder.

    Last August I was aware that security was investigating two managers because of PTE problems. When security was done with the investigation their division manager was implicated and admitted directing changes; nothing was done with her.

    One of the business managers subsequently went on disability due to anxiety and the other took a voluntary step down. It may not be purposeful, but it sure feels like it is. They were 43 and 46 both were replaced with younger managers.
  20. pretzel_man

    pretzel_man Well-Known Member


    There is an ethics hotline. I encourage you to call it. If someone in UPS management acted improperly they should be made aware.

    Maybe I read your posts incorrectly, but I sure got the impression that you were alleging purposeful systematic discrimination.