PRAYING FOR NEGOTIATORS TO GET US A GREAT CONTRACT!!!!

[DELACROIX]

Actually, I am completely divested financially from UPS at this point, aside from a pension in the future, and that's basically beer money. Although, if the IBT does call a strike, I will be buying some shares as I feel confident I could game the emotions of the market in that scenario.

Your manager was not completely wrong however. Every contract since 1997 has significantly increased UPS' cost to serve, and UPS has taken many measures to control costs where it could in other places. For instance, in 2009 right after the financial crisis exploded, all management salaries were frozen. Management were taken off the old health plan back in '95 ish I think and had to start sharing a small portion of the costs of their coverage. I am not a me, me, me look out for only number one type of guy, never have been. I am all for hourly employee's getting their fair share of the pie as it were. I am simply suggesting perhaps they are and have been, and are likely to continue to do so in this contract, even if many do not recognize it.

Would be fair to state that your were not around during the "97" strike, and your statement about the "UPS Retirement Plan" just covering your beer money means that you really do not have the time to really know what this contract is about. I like your business like attitude, but you lack the understanding of just why the Union workforce just voted 93 percent for a work stoppage. What would be your take on just how much Wage, Health and Welfare and Pension increases we should be getting, does one dollar per hour in each sound like a fair share, or would it cause such a strain that the company will have to go bankrupt. If the union did negotiate every demand that the Teamster's committees it would be a good reason for them to raise their shipping costs to 6 or 7 percent, just blame it on being in a collective bargaining agreement.

It may of been before your time but back in the 80's and 90's we were getting a dollar per hour wage increase, most of the contracts were three years. I grant you this Pension and Health and Welfare costs have increased, hence the last two contracts being settled months before without a strike vote.

This contract will never be voted in prior to 1 Aug, we all are starting to understand that the timetable narrowing. If a sub par master contract is presented by the Union it will be voted down, and just forget about any of the supplements getting passed. To help you understand that it is not about the negotiated monetary contributions, maybe you were not involved with some of the decision making during last peak but from my limited perspective it was a total failure. The weather was cooperating and we were still leaving thousands of customer's packages in their trailers because of poor, poor planning. I still remember how I felt with over 40 years of service with this company, I keep repeating the statement "that this is not UPS". Since you are in IE what was the reasoning going on then?

If a work stoppage does occur it will not be about facts and figures, we are not a piece of meat stamped with a number. We are human beings and subject to a emotion called "passion" and I sure see it with here on the ground level, anger is growing and like you stated even if it is a excellent contract it might be voted down because of it.

 

[Frankie's Friend]

We


Overnight was a non union shop. That's one of the reasons UPS bought them in 2005. UPS was concerned about trying to break into a new market with a high cost union operation. However, in 08 a deal was struck to unionize UPS Freight and the folks that were Overnight have been represented by the IBT since.

Are you living in the past?

Btw...
Are you living in reality? Do you just make this up as you go? The union got locked out.
If you're going to post something do your homework before you hit post.

 

[Frankie's Friend]

I grant you this Pension and Health and Welfare costs have increased, hence the last two contracts being settled months before without a strike vote.

I agree with your post except what I copied above.
The last cba was not settled months before the deadline and we had no opportunity to strike.

Do you remember a strike vote?
Wasn't one.

It was "settled" 8-9 months after Aug 1 and some locals had it imposed upon them.

 

[brownIEman]

Btw...
Are you living in reality? Do you just make this up as you go? The union got locked out.
If you're going to post something do your homework before you hit post.
View attachment 197263

Ok, I get it Overnight was seriously anti-union. As I said, I believe that is one reason UPS went that direction. I will admit to being completely ignorant about Overnight until the announcement of the purchase in '05. At that time I was on assignment working with SCS and I remember being excited when the merger was announced because the logistics full service offerings SCS was trying to provide had one huge weakness, LTL freight.

Remember, the leadership in 2005 was still smarting from what it considered a betrayal by it's employees and the union in 97. SCS was holding training classes back then to train management on ways to prevent organizing efforts in the subsidiaries. But then in 08 a deal was cut to organize UPS Freight in return for an exit from the corporation killing Central states pension. Since that time, the people that had previously been Overnight scabs, were now UPS Freight teamsters. They've been your brothers for 10 years. You've got to let the bitterness go.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

I will admit to being completely ignorant about Overnight

How about.... we just leave it at that.

 

[cachmeifucan]

This contract year is such a joke maybe they should start negotiations earlier this is going to be new norm. At least last time I got to keep my atena ppo. Even though team care had all my info like it already passed when it didn't the fix was in imo. This would not be happening if this guy didn't win I think the new slate would be building a reputation on this contract but maybe next election

 

[brownIEman]

Would be fair to state that your were not around during the "97" strike, and your statement about the "UPS Retirement Plan" just covering your beer money means that you really do not have the time to really know what this contract is about. I like your business like attitude, but you lack the understanding of just why the Union workforce just voted 93 percent for a work stoppage. What would be your take on just how much Wage, Health and Welfare and Pension increases we should be getting, does one dollar per hour in each sound like a fair share, or would it cause such a strain that the company will have to go bankrupt. If the union did negotiate every demand that the Teamster's committees it would be a good reason for them to raise their shipping costs to 6 or 7 percent, just blame it on being in a collective bargaining agreement.

It may of been before your time but back in the 80's and 90's we were getting a dollar per hour wage increase, most of the contracts were three years. I grant you this Pension and Health and Welfare costs have increased, hence the last two contracts being settled months before without a strike vote.

This contract will never be voted in prior to 1 Aug, we all are starting to understand that the timetable narrowing. If a sub par master contract is presented by the Union it will be voted down, and just forget about any of the supplements getting passed. To help you understand that it is not about the negotiated monetary contributions, maybe you were not involved with some of the decision making during last peak but from my limited perspective it was a total failure. The weather was cooperating and we were still leaving thousands of customer's packages in their trailers because of poor, poor planning. I still remember how I felt with over 40 years of service with this company, I keep repeating the statement "that this is not UPS". Since you are in IE what was the reasoning going on then?

If a work stoppage does occur it will not be about facts and figures, we are not a piece of meat stamped with a number. We are human beings and subject to a emotion called "passion" and I sure see it with here on the ground level, anger is growing and like you stated even if it is a excellent contract it might be voted down because of it.

I was around in 97. I started in 91 and was in a technical non bargaining unit roll during the strike.
I was not around this past peak, I left in '15 so I can't really speak to specific failures this peak but can give my general impressions from prior years. One effect of ecommerce has been that peak volume growth compared to the rest of the year is much larger, and the way the surges in volume are spread through the peak time period have gotten less predictable. Planning for that has gotten way more difficult than it used to be. Remember in '13 the spoke was once again bigger than anticipated and weather knocked out a couple key locations for several days causing an unmitigated disaster in most places. So in 14 UPS spent hundreds of millions updating facilities, hiring, renting and buying equipment, and had one of the smoothest peaks I can remember. But, they made less profit than anticipated and wall street no likey. So back to the drawing board and try to make it work only a bit leaner. I left just prior to peak '15 but was told it was horrific by a couple guys I worked with.

UPS has the most expensive employees in the industry. It currently makes money because those employees do more than each of their counterparts at other companies. UPS has grown as ecommerce has exploded, but more of the increase has gone to competition mainly do to price. The not union competition had more flexibility to adjust what they charge and still make a profit. These are simple facts. The UPS business model for years has been basically "pay employees more than anyone else, and then beat them like a rented mule to get our moneys worth". Makes for a crappy environment, I get that. I would just warm against approaching this in an overly passionate way. Union hourlies make UPS what it is, and you have the power to destroy it as well.

 

[brownIEman]

How about.... we just leave it at that.

You're feeling really proud of yourself right now aren't you

 

[IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U]

I was around in 97. I started in 91 and was in a technical non bargaining unit roll during the strike.
I was not around this past peak, I left in '15 so I can't really speak to specific failures this peak but can give my general impressions from prior years. One effect of ecommerce has been that peak volume growth compared to the rest of the year is much larger, and the way the surges in volume are spread through the peak time period have gotten less predictable. Planning for that has gotten way more difficult than it used to be. Remember in '13 the spoke was once again bigger than anticipated and weather knocked out a couple key locations for several days causing an unmitigated disaster in most places. So in 14 UPS spent hundreds of millions updating facilities, hiring, renting and buying equipment, and had one of the smoothest peaks I can remember. But, they made less profit than anticipated and wall street no likey. So back to the drawing board and try to make it work only a bit leaner. I left just prior to peak '15 but was told it was horrific by a couple guys I worked with.

UPS has the most expensive employees in the industry. It currently makes money because those employees do more than each of their counterparts at other companies. UPS has grown as ecommerce has exploded, but more of the increase has gone to competition mainly do to price. The not union competition had more flexibility to adjust what they charge and still make a profit. These are simple facts. The UPS business model for years has been basically "pay employees more than anyone else, and then beat them like a rented mule to get our moneys worth". Makes for a crappy environment, I get that. I would just warm against approaching this in an overly passionate way. Union hourlies make UPS what it is, and you have the power to destroy it as well.

You fordof one important thing. Just like a football team may have a star player and pay him top dollar because he does more than the other players. You still have to give him test sometimes, if not he ends up on IR and doesn't do you any good.

How much does this company pay out in comp a year?

 

[brownIEman]

You fordof one important thing. Just like a football team may have a star player and pay him top dollar because he does more than the other players. You still have to give him test sometimes, if not he ends up on IR and doesn't do you any good.

How much does this company pay out in comp a year?

Excellent point. The current business model is succeeding for now, but personally I don't think it's sustainable long term. The part several years no really nice ideas have come out of Atlanta. Just claiming more efficiency and then cranking up the expected performance by dialing down the allowances. So performance gets farther from the plan, but slightly better than last year. So the brown tower says "hey, that worked, let's do that more".

Who knows, maybe a strike is the only thing that will shake things up enough to break out of the cycle. I hope not for your sakes.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

You're feeling really proud of yourself right now aren't you

Everyday I wake up, and beat the out of a "has been" like you ?


Yeah.... Happy Meal for me.



-Bug-

 

[brownIEman]

Everyday I wake up, and beat the out of a "has been" like you ?


Yeah.... Happy Meal for me.



-Bug-

I love that you consider taking a quote completely out of context the equivalent of "beating the out of"

Reminds me of my 8 year old. She gets happy and proud over the littlest things as well. Enjoy that Happy meal.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

I love that you consider taking a quote completely out of context the equivalent of "beating the out of"

Reminds me of my 8 year old. She gets happy and proud over the littlest things as well. Enjoy that Happy meal.

Don't be a puss.

Consider it.... for what it is.


I would have more respect for you, by telling the truth.

 

[govols019]

Do Happy Meals still come in that little box?

 

[BigUnionGuy]

Do Happy Meals still come in that little box?

It's ugly.

 

[Jkloc420]

Do Happy Meals still come in that little box?

ask @Gumby

 

[over9five]

Do Happy Meals still come in that little box?

It used to come with a toy, didn't it?

 

[35years]

Working people hard has always been the rule at Ups. But this last peak was past the point of reasonableness in many areas. 70 hours in 5 days is not OK for a physically demanding job.

I think it is UPS management that better consider if they are destroying this company.

 

[IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U]

ask @Gumby

I don't eat that crap. I bet @sailfish knows the answer

 

[Jkloc420]

I don't eat that crap. I bet @sailfish knows the answer

@Boxslinger11 knows