moreluck
golden ticket member
The guy from W. VA. Joe ?
President Trump
- Thread starter wkmac
- Start date
JL 0513
Well-Known Member
Funniest post ever on BrownCafe. Congrats.
I guess from the perspective of a Communist, he is a centrist. Remember there are two sides to Obama. There's the real Obama then the much more toned down version he knew he had to be as President, especially with a Republican Congress. For example we all knew he said he wanted single payer government run health care but knew it would never pass so we got the ACA.
MrFedEx
Engorged Member
Wall Street Obama was a centrist.
liberalism is the political center. they carry out small reforms while maintaining the system.
obama is definitely not well left of center. but it doesnt really matter, both parties are 2 heads of the same corporate beast.
BrownArmy
Well-Known Member
You believe that, but the system has moved so far to the right that Obama and H. Clinton seem 'to the left'.
In fact, both were right of center.
Flame on...
BrownArmy
Well-Known Member
Really, how is Obama a Socialist?
The ACA was based on a scheme by the Heritage Foundation, not exactly a hot-bed of socialism.
Seriously, how is Obama a Socialist?
His Wall-Street policies?
His war policies?
Please, enlighten me, and I'm not being sarcastic.
BrownArmy
Well-Known Member
JL 0513
Well-Known Member
I didn't call Obama a socialist. At one point, I brought up that people who did call Obama a socialist were sometimes called racist for doing so even though that makes no sense. I do know the definition of socialism and yes, Obama didn't impose it but mainly because he knew he couldn't.
Fortunately, our Constitution and system of government makes such implementation very difficult by design. You must be aware of Obama's actual desires vs his actual record as President. There is a big difference. His record over 8 years was left of center. His actual beliefs are far left.
JL 0513
Well-Known Member
What system? How has it moved so far to the right? America was founded on the Constitution which is conservative by definition. That framework is much more to the right than what we are set up as today. Because we have moved so far from it we have accumulated $20 trillion in debt and $105,000,000,000,000.00 in unfunded liabilities which is going to totally screw us in coming years.
Half of the Republicans in Congress are progressives. Amazing how everyone sees things so differently. You guys don't even see are far left you are, and you see leftist as centrists. Nobody has every called Obama and Hillary right of center, LOL. I watch a lot of liberal media for the laughs and never even heard that. You're nuts dude.
BrownArmy
Well-Known Member
Again, we'll have to agree to disagree.
If you actually look at his record, he's center-right.
(In other news, HRC is about on par with Nixon, in terms of the left-right slide-rule, IMHO).
You might think you can divine Obama's thoughts, but what we have on record is the reality of his Presidency.
Again, both parties have moved vastly toward the right, so Obama seems left.
The whole 'hope-and-change' thing was great campaigning.
Do I agree with Obama's actions 100% ? No.
But it's a fallacy to call him a Socialist or a Communist.
Obama was a center-right capitalist.
(If it helps your vision, delete all the civil-rights agendas that Obama championed, and then look at every other thing in his record).
I think President Trump is finding out that facism isn't a governing style in American democracy. It works great in business. Government is not a business.
Bernie is a leftist. Obama is no Bernie.
BrownArmy
Well-Known Member
That debt is equally shared among both parties, JL O513.
Again, we'll just have to agree to disagree.
It's clear that you and I value differing hierarchies-of-place in terms of what is most important to us.
That's fine, and it's correct.
'Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold...'
Ever since Trump took office, what Republicans have you heard speak of the debt? I think that's just campaign speak.
JL 0513
Well-Known Member
Are you unaware of everything Obama is on record for SAYING? I've already mentioned his record as being more moderate than his words on record. You can't ignore things he said like "I'm a proponent of a single payer health care system". Then went on to say that we won't be able to get there overnight but will have to get there one step at a time and that is our goal.
You really think the Democratic party has moved "way to the right"? You have to be kidding. Just in the last decade, the Democrat party has moved so far left they've become a regional party (coasts and big cities). This is a party that almost nominated a self proclaimed socialist. Um, have you already forgotten the Clinton administration? That was the Democrats in the '90's. Compare that to now with the lunatics marching in the streets and you're saying they've moved right.
JL 0513
Well-Known Member
Exactly, which is why I just called a good half of them progressives. Fact of the matter is we will never control our debt no matter who has the power because no one wants to lose their goodies in the short term. Then one day it's all going to come crumbling down and we'll know what pain is.
Kiss your social security good bye.
JL 0513
Well-Known Member
Yet it is political poison to make adjustments now to try and save it. This is why we are screwed. A politician mentions reforms and he is run out of town. People only care about themselves right now.
