Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by retired, Oct 21, 2007.
I Wanna Be A Union Boss Game!
pretty cute video....
Ron Carey=Best thing ever for the teamsters and 804 for that matter.
Ron worked his ranks through the union as a driver steward to teamster president. you either like him or you dont.
BEST thing for the Teamsters, let alone Local 804????? Sir.....you need to do some research!!!!!! After doing my research, I'm behind the Court decision to bar him from union activities for life!!! I wouldn't trust the man further than I could throw a fully-loaded UPS feeder!! . -Rocky
Would you mind sharing this research with the rest of us? He was not barred by the courts, he was barred by a federal oversight board which made an arbitrary decision. When he finally got his day in court, he was cleared of any wrongdoing and acquitted of all charges. The government's star witness was a convicted felon who was facing 20 years and a 2 million dollar fine and looking for some leniency. If he had chosen to apply for re-instatement it would probably have been granted, but by the time the trial was over he was 65 and tired of the whole thing.
Ron Carey wasn't perfect, he was human and he had his flaws. In hindsight (always 20/20) you can make a pretty good case that striking in '97 was a mistake. But he was an honest guy who came up through the ranks and knew what it was like to be a working man, not some corporate lawyer trading in on his father's last name. He had our best interests at heart, which is more than I can say for the current Union Boss.
I don't mind sharing this research with you. My research is all from newspapers of the time--1960's and first half of the '70's. I would post the article citations but I'm unsure of the copyright issues, so I won't do it. Your local public library has newspaper article databases. Search the New York Times/ProQuest Historical Newspapers for (United Parcel Service) AND (Strike) AND (Carey) AND PDN(>1/1/1960) AND PDN(<1/1/1980). When you do, you'll get six results. One line from ONE of those articles sealed my opinion of Carey: "Since 1968, we have had 40 work stoppages in violation of the no-strike provision in our labor contract with Local 804." Still going to heap praise on Carey? I'd LOVE to hear this.
OK, my mistake. For some reason, I thought it was a Court decision. Federal Oversight Board also reminds me of a court.
As far as Hoffa.....don't get me started. -Rocky
Stop Stop, poor Ron, I'm going to cry because he had our best interests at heart and his reputation was ruined. Did you miss the following post?
No, I didn't miss that post. Did you miss the fact that that ruling was handed down prior to Ron Carey being cleared of all charges?
Depends on what you're looking for. That sentence is from an article published in the New York Times on 6 April 1972, the day after UPS suspended NYC operations because of a strike. I suggest you read the article, sir. A couple sentences rang somewhat familiar of what happened at Chicago last week.....-Rocky
I Agree with you Hammer, He was the best!
Who is Ron Carey?
Since Hoffa and his cohorts (804 officers included) are back to attacking Ron Carey (repeating the same lies about his leadership and continuing to ignore the fact that he was acquitted of ALL of the charges thrown at him), it might be a good time to explain to some of our newer members who Ron Carey was and why the split between him and Local 804 Executive Board.
Ron Carey was born March 22, 1936 in New York City, the son of a UPS driver. After leaving the Marines in 1955, he started working for UPS as a package car driver in NYC and 3 years later became shop steward. Carey became dissatisfied with the union bureaucracy and in 1962 ran and won the race for Local Trustee. He was elected President of 804 in 1967 and won landslide elections to nine straight 3-year terms.
Carey fought management to improve member's wages and working conditions. In the mid-seventies he led a groundbreaking strike which allowed drivers to retire after 25 years instead of 30. In addition, Carey negotiated strong contracts that doubled the salaries of those drivers. Then he took on the "old guard" of the International.
The Teamsters Union was a mess. Its major pension was used as a piggy bank for organized crime and many of its locals were dominated by mobsters. The Federal Government filed a RICO suit against the Teamsters in 1988 and the Union was forced to choose its leaders democratically.
In a three-way race for General President in what was the first secret ballot rank and file election in Teamster history, 804's Ron Carey was swept into office in 1991 by the force of his reform agenda and the organizing efforts of Teamsters for a Democratic Union (TDU) rank and filers.
Upon becoming President, Carey cut his own salary from $225,000 to $175,000 as well as selling off Teamster limos, jets and a Caribbean condominium owned by the Union. The Reformers were finally in charge. The Carey Administration ended backroom deals with employers and opened up the negotiating process to rank and file involvement. He led national campaigns for strong contracts that gave members higher increases in pension contributions from employers as well as higher wages and better benefits.
Moreover, Carey placed numerous corrupt Local unions into trusteeship and passed a Code of Ethics for Union trustees. He also eliminated the overwhelming majority of multiple salaries to union officers.
In organizing, the International worked with local unions to recruit and train Teamster members to be volunteer organizers who talk to non-union employees, which helped reverse the steady decline in Teamster membership. The Carey Administration also mounted the first successful organizing drive in history at Overnite, then the largest less-than-truckload freight company.
Then came the strike at UPS in 1997. The Teamsters were successful in the strike against UPS because the company underestimated the determination of the union and its leadership. Carey mobilized the rank and file months before the contract expired on July 31 by holding rallies all over the country to prepare the members for a possible strike.
Furthermore, the public was on the Teamsters' side. After years of downsizing good jobs, when Ron Carey spoke about "Corporate Greed", millions of Americans agreed with his characterization.
The UPS strike ended what is known as the "PATCO Syndrome": the effect of defeat and demoralization by ALL union when Reagan fired the 11,300 striking air traffic controllers in 1981. It in effect sent a strong message to the labor movement that Reagan and his Big Business backers were in charge. In 1980, 25% of all workers were unionized; by 2006 it is down to about 12%.
But the election of Ron Carey and the UPS strike brought a bright new day to the labor movement. Corrupt and complacent union officers were put on notice that their members wanted a new direction for their union, while company bosses who were used to big concessions from the unions had to face a revived Teamster union.
This radical action sparked a rejuvenation of the labor movement. However, Carey became a threat to Big Business. Accordingly, Corporate America and their Republican puppets in Congress went after him and took him down.
The newly controlled Republican Congress led by right winger Rep. Hoekstra of Michigan led the witch hunt against Ron Carey . He pressured the IRB and Justice Department to void Carey's 1996 reelection win over Hoffa . This was the same Hoffa who opposed the Teamsters' strike against UPS -undermining the striking workers- as well as took money from UPS for his campaign; his father must have been spinning in his grave beneath Giants Stadium.
In the end, Carey was not allowed to run in the 1998 special election. Even though Michael Cherkasky, the Federally appointed examiner of Hoffa"s election campaign, found numerous fraud, misrepresentation of money, deception and cover-up, he ruled Hoffa eligible to run. Hoffa beat Carey slate member Tom L and became General President.
Why the double standard? Was it because Republicans were actually concerned about corrupt unions? No. In fact the Republicans have always welcomed corrupt union money in their coffers as well as signing sweetheart deals with companies who also were large donors to the same Republican Party. Sounds good: put in a "leader" they can control (Hoffa), who opposed the UPS strike and Carey's militancy, with a lot of union money to possibly give to Republicans (Ron Carey changed the Teamsters from supporting the anti-union Republicans to the pro-union Democrats .
In early 2001, Ron Carey was indicted on charges of lying to a Grand Jury. On October 12, 2001, was acquitted of all the charges.
Ron Carey was an honest union reformer who fought against Teamster corruption, led a successful strike against UPS and revived the labor movement. For the "sin" of actually "putting members first", Carey was taken down by the powerful in this country. Some of the officers in our Local have forgotten this; the rank and file have not.
(Courtesy of Localagitator)
I was wondering when you'd pop up, Agitator. What you posted--while interesting from a student of history standpoint--it does nothing to help your cause. I won't forget that quote from a UPS executive about the number of strikes between 1968 and 1972. That averages out to almost TEN work stoppages PER YEAR!!! And, speaking once again as a student of history, you didn't touch on the last sentence of my post.....-Rocky
He was a great man and an awesome local/teamster leader. Even when he was the IBT president, he still came back and visited ALL the building from his old local numerous times. No one is perfect, hell your old president got head under the table(im sure more than that) then lied about under oath.Hope you hade a good weekend.
Hey Rock...are you aware of the fact that in that period of time there was no national contract agreement. Each local negotiated for it's own members. New York City was one of the most hostile work environments to make a living in. Want to further your education...Read "The Teamsters" by Steven Brill, especially chapter five- Ron Carey.
I'm afraid we're going to have to agree to disagree, Local. I've never accused him of being out of touch with the rank and file, by the way. What I did say was that what I've heard about him doesn't sound good OR trustworthy. I'm afraid organized labor hasn't gotten the best example from Washington politics about 'head under the table.' Maybe some things would be different if there were some morals in the union again. Whoooops.....I forgot some posters think those are outdated (not talking to you here, Local).
Yeah, my weekend was pretty good. Its back to the books tomorrow, though. FOUR MORE WEEKS AND I GET OUT FOR CHRISTMAS BREAK!!. Anyone need a helper? lol.
Yeah, I did know about the individual contract negotiation. Personally, I think if organized labor was smart, it might go back to a similar practice. Then again....that has its positives and negatives. It doesn't matter to me if NYC was ruled by a dictatorship at the time! AVERAGING NEARLY TEN WORK-STOPPAGES A YEAR OVER THE COURSE OF FOUR OR FIVE YEARS IS TOO MANY!!!! I'm a student of history, Mr. Peep. I'll have to go looking for that book over my LONG school break! -Rocky
I'm looking for the context in which that statement was made, because taken by itself it doesn't appear to have any relevance. You seem think it's important, I'm curious as to why.
What does the above have to do with your assertion that:
I wouldn't trust the man further than I could throw a fully-loaded UPS feeder!!
This tells me absolutely nothing.
Let me get this straight. You claimed that, based on your extensive research, Ron Carey is not to be trusted.
When I asked you to share some of that research, you made some odd excuse about "copyright issues". But your concern about copyright law didn't prevent you from posting an out of context quote from someone who you later admitted to to being a UPS executive (how's that for an unbiased opinion). Not that it matters, because the quote itself doesn't appear to be relevant.
And no, I have no intention of going to the library and researching old newspaper articles from 1972. That's your job. You are the one who made the assertion that Carey was untrustworthy, and it's incumbent on you to back that claim up. I get the feeling I'll be waiting a long time for that to happen.
I'm not sure what to make of this. Is the number of work stoppages rule written down in the Big Book 'o Labor Law (Corporate Edition)? Leaving aside the fact if NYC had been ruled by a dictatorship, pretty much any amount of work stoppages would have been justified, what parameters are you using to decide how many is too many?
LOL.....I'm done arguing with you, sir. I'm not a baby-sitter OR a school librarian. I gave you EVERYTHING you needed to track down where that quote came from. Its your decision not to. Meanwhile.....its back to the books! PAX! -Rocky
Not much of an argument. You made some unsupported statements and then ran away when confronted. Good luck with those "books"
Unsupported statements? I gave you the place to FIND those statements. I'm not going to do YOUR work for you. Running away? I didn't run. Our discussion wasn't going anywhere since you wouldn't do some 'detective' work. Why would I keep banging my head against a wall with a close-minded person? And I'm having very good luck with the books. I'm thoroughly enjoying myself. Those 'books' were the reason I found that statement by a UPS executive. -Rocky
might want to read a from a few more sources then one. Ron and his local paid quite a few fines for these illegal strikes.
Ron could have cared less about paying fines.
The money didn't come out of his pocket.
Separate names with a comma.