Seniority lists

[East coast navy]

This is exactly how it works in my building, and I argue that it should. I went into feeders early in my career so I could move up that seniority list. Working nights is no joke and I have, and continue, to do that until my seniority gets me a job that works day hours. Why should a package car driver who has made the choice to work in package most of their career get to bump me down from my spot in feeders just because they feel its their "time" to go. If they wanted the better day hours they should have come in sooner. I have former package drivers who have way more company time than me beneath me on the seniority list, and at the same time I have off the street hires who have less company time than me above me because I didn't go into feeders early enough. The jobs are different, the challenges are different, and therefore the seniority should be different.

Now with that being said my answer to the OP is this. The only fair way to transition from one senioirity system to another is to have two lists. The first list would be the current drivers in that department who would get to continue to use their seniority as they always have. The 2nd would be the new incoming drivers who would work under the new seniority rules. As the guys from the first list retire and new drivers start to fill up the 2nd then the transition to the different seniority rules would be complete once all the drivers from the first list are gone. To shuffle around the entire seniority list just to benefit a few drivers who didn't go into feeders soon enough or came in late and are at the bottom is just plain wrong.

It doesn't matter what's fair... What matters is what the majority wants. That what makes a democracy system a (democracy system.)

Bring things to a vote, to put them to rest.

 

[Bubblehead]

This is exactly how it works in my building, and I argue that it should. I went into feeders early in my career so I could move up that seniority list. Working nights is no joke and I have, and continue, to do that until my seniority gets me a job that works day hours. Why should a package car driver who has made the choice to work in package most of their career get to bump me down from my spot in feeders just because they feel its their "time" to go. If they wanted the better day hours they should have come in sooner. I have former package drivers who have way more company time than me beneath me on the seniority list, and at the same time I have off the street hires who have less company time than me above me because I didn't go into feeders early enough. The jobs are different, the challenges are different, and therefore the seniority should be different.

Now with that being said my answer to the OP is this. The only fair way to transition from one senioirity system to another is to have two lists. The first list would be the current drivers in that department who would get to continue to use their seniority as they always have. The 2nd would be the new incoming drivers who would work under the new seniority rules. As the guys from the first list retire and new drivers start to fill up the 2nd then the transition to the different seniority rules would be complete once all the drivers from the first list are gone. To shuffle around the entire seniority list just to benefit a few drivers who didn't go into feeders soon enough or came in late and are at the bottom is just plain wrong.

In my Local, full time seniority goes with you from classification to classification, as it should.
If I decide to intent into feeders, my 22 years comes with me and I dovetail into the feeder seniority list.
After 3 years, I can bid back to packages, again bringing my seniority back with me.
Nights may be "no joke", but neither is humping bundles.
Both jobs have their nuances, and with seniority comes options.
So, in my Local the choice is mine, with no fear of losing the privileges that come with seniority.

 

[rama'nfeeders]

Hey bubblehead what local are you in and what part of the country are you in?

 

[PiedmontSteward]

In my Local, full time seniority goes with you from classification to classification, as it should.
If I decide to intent into feeders, my 22 years comes with me and I dovetail into the feeder seniority list.
After 3 years, I can bid back to packages, again bringing my seniority back with me.
Nights may be "no joke", but neither is humping bundles.
Both jobs have their nuances, and with seniority comes options.
So, in my Local the choice is mine, with no fear of losing the privileges that come with seniority.

That's the way it is (and always has been) in my area. The important thing to remember is that changing a seniority system that is currently in place is going to screw over somebody who was biding their time or enjoying life under the previous systen

 

[East coast navy]

That's the way it is (and always has been) in my area. The important thing to remember is that changing a seniority system that is currently in place is going to screw over somebody who was biding their time or enjoying life under the previous systen

That's why it never should have changed. They screwed over the past members when changing to years ago. Now it has to go back...

 

[Integrity]

Does anyone have or had a two list system in their local for seniority and if changed, how was it done?

My experience has shown me that the best system allows for company seniority for vac picks and layoffs and classification seniority for job preference issues.

 

[jaker]

In the West , seniority in feeder goes by when you came into feeder and I am ok with that

It takes a long time to go feeder here , so when someone decides to wait longer then they shouldn't be able to jump ahead of you after you already put your time in

 

[East coast navy]

The way I look at it, it should go by how much time you get by much union dues you have paid no matter where you go. A two month teamster shouldn't be able to pick over a 27 year vet. The 27 year vet shouldn't be sent home when a wet behind the ears teamster gets to work overtime and (6) days work. It's just wrong saying it! Someone coming off the street feeder should be happy her or she got hired off the street into feeder. They should do package time before they should talk.

 

[Coldworld]

In my Local, full time seniority goes with you from classification to classification, as it should.
If I decide to intent into feeders, my 22 years comes with me and I dovetail into the feeder seniority list.
After 3 years, I can bid back to packages, again bringing my seniority back with me.
Nights may be "no joke", but neither is humping bundles.
Both jobs have their nuances, and with seniority comes options.
So, in my Local the choice is mine, with no fear of losing the privileges that come with seniority.

It should be considered our right to do that ...it's all we really have here our senority

 

[Coldworld]

The way I look at it, it should go by how much time you get by much union dues you have paid no matter where you go. A two month teamster shouldn't be able to pick over a 27 year vet. The 27 year vet shouldn't be sent home when a wet behind the ears teamster gets to work overtime and (6) days work. It's just wrong saying it! Someone coming off the street feeder should be happy her or she got hired off the street into feeder. They should do package time before they should talk.

Exactly.....

 

[jaker]

The way I look at it, it should go by how much time you get by much union dues you have paid no matter where you go. A two month teamster shouldn't be able to pick over a 27 year vet. The 27 year vet shouldn't be sent home when a wet behind the ears teamster gets to work overtime and (6) days work. It's just wrong saying it! Someone coming off the street feeder should be happy her or she got hired off the street into feeder. They should do package time before they should talk.

You can disagree with but I am not talking about some off the street guy

If I work 13 years in package and my time comes up for feeder and I go and work ten years in feeder

And some guy who only started 5 years before in package but waited 10 years after me to go feeder gets the right to have more seniority in feeder and they just got there

If that is what you want you keep that dumb thinking , I like the way it is here

 

[Coldworld]

My experience has shown me that the best system allows for company seniority for vac picks and layoffs and classification seniority for job preference issues.

Is that even an option anywhere???

 

[PT Car Washer]

Is that even an option anywhere???

Only by new managers or sups trying to write their own rules. Usually they learn real fast what they can or can't do. Hopefully they are not the kind that takes everything personal and just waits for a chance to retaliate.

 

[East coast navy]

You can disagree with but I am not talking about some off the street guy

If I work 13 years in package and my time comes up for feeder and I go and work ten years in feeder

And some guy who only started 5 years before in package but waited 10 years after me to go feeder gets the right to have more seniority in feeder and they just got there

If that is what you want you keep that dumb thinking , I like the way it is here

I said it before and will say it again.. It doesn't matter what you think. What matters is who is the majority.

 

[East coast navy]

So

You can disagree with but I am not talking about some off the street guy

If I work 13 years in package and my time comes up for feeder and I go and work ten years in feeder

And some guy who only started 5 years before in package but waited 10 years after me to go feeder gets the right to have more seniority in feeder and they just got there

If that is what you want you keep that dumb thinking , I like the way it is here

So let me get this straight. If I was smart and put my name on the list for feeder a year after I was hired into package then got the call 10 years later... Is it fair for me to wait 10 years then this wet behind the ears teamster gets more seniority then me and has paid less union dues then me.

I'm sorry, that's not seniority..

 

[Coldworld]

It's either the old timers who want to be top dogs and feel threatened if the get bumped down one or two.. Big deal. OR the year driver who gets in and is Gitty as can be because they have more senority than a 15 or 20 year driver who for whatever reason doesn't or can't come in for whatever reason...under no circumstance should a year driver jump ahead of a 25 year vet.... Ever. I have a 25 yeAr vet under me and it is totally wrong... I should not be getting better vacation than him!!!!

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

It's either the old timers who want to be top dogs and feel threatened if the get bumped down one or two.. Big deal. OR the year driver who gets in and is Gitty as can be because they have more senority than a 15 or 20 year driver who for whatever reason doesn't or can't come in for whatever reason...under no circumstance should a year driver jump ahead of a 25 year vet.... Ever. I have a 25 yeAr vet under me and it is totally wrong... I should not be getting better vacation than him!!!!

You are correct---you should NOT be getting better vacation than him.

 

[Bubblehead]

If we're all full-time drivers, the fact being the company sponsors our CDL licensing, why shouldn't our seniority afford us all equal opportunities?

 

[Coldworld]

You are correct---you should NOT be getting better vacation than him.

Just like the dozen 1 year drivers above me which get better pics than me

 

[Coldworld]

If we're all full-time drivers, the fact being the company sponsors our CDL licensing, why shouldn't our seniority afford us all equal opportunities?

is that something we could change at the national level...it will continue to be this way with so many vets retiring and them pulling younger and younger drivers