Teamcare

[Bubblehead]

So even though the sky remains firmly above us, you’re still convinced it’s on the way down. As you know, the letter that claims unsustainability for Taft Hartley H&W plans was a joint letter from various Union leaders and few (if any) other union contracts provide the level of benefits contained in the UPS CBA.
Furthermore, three events must occur for the union leader’s prediction of peril to occur.
1)FT hours reduced to fewer than 30 to make members ineligible.
2)Taft Hartley’s not eligible for subsidies
3)Taft Hartley’s pay tax to fund ACA rebates
Point #1 is completely inapplicable to UPS employees as FT and PT are insured (regardless of reduced hours) and covered by CBA’s with contractually guaranteed contribution increases. FT hours cannot be reduced below 30 and indeed employment at UPS is increasing (finally) nationwide, further increasing funding for TeamCare.
Point #2 is unfortunately accurate and still hasn’t been corrected, but Taft Hartleys are non-profit so have an inherent advantage over for profit HC companies. This advantage should somewhat offset this obvious gift of corporate welfare to private HC providers. I believe this point is the sole reason for the “letter” and with a more thoughtful Congress will be addressed.
Point #3 is bearable (for larger funds). Taft Hartley’s will pay a three year diminishing tax to fund the start up of the subsidy program. But many Taft Hartley’s, along with private insurers, have benefitted from pre-ACA programs by receiving government subsidies for HC coverage such as the Retiree Drug Subsidy program (UPS Plan received over 27 million one year) so the “tax” is pretty much a wash.
The Hoffa letter clearly states these events must all occur to make Taft Hartley’s “unsustainable”. Since the criteria of the letter won’t be met in the TeamCare realm for UPS’ers, one would logically conclude TeamCare will be “sustainable”.
One question for you Mr Bubble, why do you hang on this one statement (albeit erroneously) from Hoffa, when you’ve obviously made it clear to the world you think this guy needs help tying his shoes? Never mind…I already know the answer.

First off, is Central States Health and Welfare a single employer fund?

Secondly, if he can't tie his shoes (a notion I hadn't pondered), he should get some of those ones with velcro instead of shoe strings.

 

[Inthegame]

First off, is Central States Health and Welfare a single employer fund?

Secondly, if he can't tie his shoes (a notion I hadn't pondered), he should get some of those ones with velcro instead of shoe strings.

No and yes.

 

[Bubblehead]

I would absolutely love to be wrong.

First off, is Central States Health and Welfare a single employer fund?

No

So...if there are other companies in the fund, what kind of shape are they in?
How's their participation level?
Could it be that they have a decreasing active participant level and an increasing retiree level, with this trend projected to get progressively worse.
How will they be negatively impacted by the ACA?
Are UPSer's being used as a "band-aide" for the fund?

Secondly, if he can't tie his shoes (a notion I hadn't pondered), he should get some of those ones with velcro instead of shoe strings.

...and yes

If the shoe fits???

 

[DubyaUPS]

Hoffa and Hall did clearly state this, but I don't believe it was ever the whole truth.
I wasn't there to bear witness to how the subject was broached in negotiations, but if it were indeed UPS emphatically wanting out of the HC business, that would have been a huge bargaining chip for the union.
This company is at the top of their game and a concession like this should yield major gains in other areas that didn't happen.
In fact the opposite was the case.
I submit that it was never the company that insisted on getting out, rather the union who insisted on getting their hands on that money to stabilize the HC funds for the rest of the union.



Hoffa said it best, as we stand today, our Taft Hartley plan is "unsustainable" under the ACA.
He's taking our "good money" and throwing it after bad.
It's just a matter of time before our GWI is also taken, coupled with increasing annual deductibles, to shoulder the ever increasing burden, instead of a company with the proven resources.
I hate it when people try to bring themselves up, by bringing someone else down and that's exactly what has happened here.
It's not fair to be tricked into martyrdom.

I believe you are correct. UPS was not in the health care business. No more than they were in the auto insurance business. We would have been better off if everyone was switched to UPS plan instead of team care and UPS would have saved money . With that said I am not complaining about team care. I have had it for 28 years and have been satisfied with it.

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[BigUnionGuy]

In the end, I think you're right to be worried.

Come on Bubble....

*I know*.... you're smarter than that.



-Bug-

 

[BigUnionGuy]

I will answer by saying that I am sorry that the rest of the country does not enjoy the same pension as those of us in Upstate NY and the Western Conference.

I would be lying if I said that I would be willing to give up any of it.

I appreciate your honesty.

Brutal honesty.

Sometimes, the truth hurts.



-Bug-

 

[Inthegame]

I would absolutely love to be wrong.



So...if there are other companies in the fund, what kind of shape are they in?
How's their participation level?
Could it be that they have a decreasing active participant level and an increasing retiree level, with this trend projected to get progressively worse.
How will they be negatively impacted by the ACA?
Are UPSer's being used as a "band-aide" for the fund?




If the shoe fits???

1) There are many other companies in Teamcare (formerly the Central States H&W Plan) and their shape determines which of the many plan options (8) of coverage levels TeamCare offers has been negotiated for their employees.
2) Their participation level has allowed the managers of the TeamCare fund to amass a staggering 21 months of reserve, wait for it…BEFORE thousands of UPS members were added.
3) Retiree level increases will impact Medicare much more than TeamCare. Employment is increasing after many years of stagnant growth, so numbers are moving up.
4) Large fund participants will feel little effect of the ACA and could be rewarded as rising claim costs should be mitigated by a larger pool of insured.
5) see response (2)

I do agree about the shoes...

 

[Bubblehead]

1) There are many other companies in Teamcare (formerly the Central States H&W Plan) and their shape determines which of the many plan options (8) of coverage levels TeamCare offers has been negotiated for their employees.

1.1) Sounds like a "shell game".

2) Their participation level has allowed the managers of the TeamCare fund to amass a staggering 21 months of reserve, wait for it…BEFORE thousands of UPS members were added.

2.1) Again, what does the actuarial reports look like 5-10-15 years down the road (before UPS joined the dance)?

3) Retiree level increases will impact Medicare much more than TeamCare. Employment is increasing after many years of stagnant growth, so numbers are moving up.

3.1) See sub-post 2.1

4) Large fund participants will feel little effect of the ACA and could be rewarded as rising claim costs should be mitigated by a larger pool of insured.

4.1) There goes the "staggering 21 months of reserves".

5) see response (2)

5.1) I'm dizzy?

I do agree about the shoes...

 

[BigUnionGuy]

1) There are many other companies in Teamcare (formerly the Central States H&W Plan) and their shape determines which of the many plan options (8) of coverage levels TeamCare offers has been negotiated for their employees.
2) Their participation level has allowed the managers of the TeamCare fund to amass a staggering 21 months of reserve, wait for it…BEFORE thousands of UPS members were added.

1.1) Sounds like a "shell game".

Bubble,

You do realize.... that not all contributing employers.... Pay the same rate.

We enjoy superior benefits.... because of the contactual ($$) contribution rate.


Same thing with a multi-employer pension fund.



-Bug-

 

[Foamer Pyle]

I will give you the benefit of the doubt and and assume everything you say is true. The point is that my plan is better than that.
And now you both think I'm supposed to be happy having a lesser plan. Why?

Because healthcare costs have skyrocketed, and you still have awesome insurance. I too have been on Team Care forever, and I have zero complaints.


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[Foamer Pyle]

Re: Is a shift to TEAMCARE beneficial to ALL Teamsters?



This has NOTHING to do with OBAMA care aka "the affordable health care act".

Hoffa has said this. hall has said this. Andy M has said this and M. Rosenschrader has said this,( UPS)

Would you keep your FOX NEWS nonsense out of this debate please.

This has simply to do with the "funding" of the central states Health and welfare plan. Its needs more money and the TEAMSTERS, not OBAMACARE are seeking to redirect monies into that fund.

We have heard the same line over and over again from different locals "the company wants out of the insurance business" yet, our homes are bombarded by solicitations from UPS insurance companies asking us to convert our personal insurance to theirs.

YET, guys like you who sit like a drone and watch a cable news channel for your days thoughts will say just about anything they tell you.

Change the channel bro.

Peace

TOS

You are about the most uninformed person I have run into. Drink your dumb liberal Kool-Aid, or wake up and listen to smarter people than you are saying what Obama Care has done to the healthcare industry. I can't stand Liberals.


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[Bubblehead]

You are about the most uninformed person I have run into. Drink your dumb liberal Kool-Aid, or wake up and listen to smarter people than you are saying what Obama Care has done to the healthcare industry. I can't stand Liberals.


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I can't stand truck drivers who think they make enough money to be Republican.
Personally, I try to drink a little of all the "Kool-Aid" out there, and end up spitting bits and pieces from them all.
Neither side is to be trusted.

 

[bottomups]

You are about the most uninformed person I have run into. Drink your dumb liberal Kool-Aid, or wake up and listen to smarter people than you are saying what Obama Care has done to the healthcare industry. I can't stand Liberals.


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My healthcare has only improved due to the Afforable Healthcare Act. Lifetime maximums have been removed, my children are covered until age 26 and mental health benefits are vastly better.

Take your conservative, union hating mentality and go work for FedEx. See if you can negotiate better benefits than you get at Brown.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

I can't stand truck drivers who think they make enough money to be Republican.

Aren't they "off the street" feeder drivers ??

Take your conservative, union hating mentality and go work for FedEx. See if you can negotiate better benefits than you get at Brown.

I thought, that is why they are here.

They can't do better.


They need us.... to do it for them.



-Bug-

 

[Atomic_Smurf]

My healthcare has only improved due to the Afforable Healthcare Act. Lifetime maximums have been removed, my children are covered until age 26 and mental health benefits are vastly better.

Take your conservative, union hating mentality and go work for FedEx. See if you can negotiate better benefits than you get at Brown.

Lifetime maximums have been replaced with annual caps & your kids only stay on your insurance if they are in college.

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[Bubblehead]

Bubble,

You do realize.... that not all contributing employers.... Pay the same rate.

We enjoy superior benefits.... because of the contactual ($$) contribution rate.


Same thing with a multi-employer pension fund.



-Bug-

Really????
No kidding???

I take it all back...I'm sure it's all on the up and up.

 

[bottomups]

Lifetime maximums have been replaced with annual caps & your kids only stay on your insurance if they are in college.

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How misinformed some people are. There is no annual cap on my insurance. Children do not have to be in school.

 

[Anonymous 11]

I can't stand truck drivers who think they make enough money to be Republican.
Personally, I try to drink a little of all the "Kool-Aid" out there, and end up spitting bits and pieces from them all.
Neither side is to be trusted.

I trust my local.

 

[Atomic_Smurf]

How misinformed some people are. There is no annual cap on my insurance. Children do not have to be in school.

Your annual caps begin at retirement, at the time in your life you are most likely to need it. One big medical expense away from bankruptcy.

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[Anonymous 11]

Your annual caps begin at retirement, at the time in your life you are most likely to need it. One big medical expense away from bankruptcy.

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So do you think the 200,000 cap a year in teamcare is worse than the 500,000 lifetime cap on the company plan?