The Local 767 Thread

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by Island, Feb 27, 2014.

  1. Island

    Island Active Member

    This thread, I hope, will serve as a sounding board for a few of our issues here in North Texas.
    As some of you may remember, here on Browncafe and a few other similar websites, there was quite a stink about the election scandal a few years ago. Frankly the incumbent slate faked the election, based on what facts I have heard from multiple sources. I sat that one and a few people were angry with me for not voting - but, alas, if I had it would not have mattered, because the local would have submitted a reballot request and then sent in the second ballot in my name with a vote for them written on it. And then they wouldn't have counted it anyway, having trashed a lot of ballots and written down fake numbers in the end.
    We've also had quite a stink about our 22.3s. They are treated so poorly. And locally there seems to be a war on fulltimers in general. The company has been cutting down the fulltime positions and claiming that new ones are being created elsewhere, without giving any proof. The BAs all agree that those jobs are not being created anywhere nearby, but this is yet another battle the 767 has waved the white flag for.
    The drivers get a lot of forced overtime. The feeder drivers are basically on their own when it comes to enforcing their DOT, and I have personally seen a hub employee get called to put in an immediate feeder shift when he wasn't even clocked out of his hub job yet.
    The company uses cars with trashed transmissions to do their driving tests when they don't want to hire a specific person to drive. Having talked to a lot of people who went through tests, the data I put together suggests strongly that the company was auto-failing anyone who didn't fit their EOE numbers. Meaning if you weren't the right minority, you were given the car that won't shift.
    In the hubs... well. Mesquite made national news with how badly that went. And, if you don't know about the part that didn't fit quite so well in the headlines, a manager in that hub walked into his division manager's office, intending to kill him and himself. The division manager wasn't there and the fellow was so distraught that he killed himself anyway. The company was blaming the entire incident on him and probably going to fire him. That issue has a lot of debate surrounding it, and Mesquite management members have very unofficially said that their jobs are all in danger because their superiors who failed to plan for peak are blaming the hub for the entire region's failings.
    My hub was pretty trashed this peak. The company knew it was coming, had spoken to us extensively about how it was planning for and excited about the coming Amazon volume. Little did we know that Amazon volume was going to double and triple our daily numbers. Part-timers saw 70 mandatory hours weekly. The ones who were friends with management got out of some of them, management bullied most others. I personally saw two weeks of 65 and 75 during peak. One notable 22.3 saw over 100 hours - of course management stole some of his time and after he fought them for days about it, he finally got it corrected. I'm not sure why management likes to bully that guy about his time, he happens to be the one guy in the whole hub who will call the department of labor at the drop of a hat.
    Personally, I stopped going to the local meetings. A few times our treasurer was saying numbers made me a little confused because each month his stated numbers were completely different. When they want to get the idea across that they don't want to pay for things like the christmas party or local barbecues, they say the union is losing a lot of money. Other times when they want to sound like they're doing a good job they say they have millions in the local's account and are always gaining more. I'm sure someone else is better suited to quote the stated numbers, I'm no accountant, but I have noticed the discrepancies.
    The local has dropped the ball for me personally on multiple occasions where everyone with extensive time with the company has said I have a slam dunk case, my issue will be solved in 5 minutes, and naturally even when a center manager curses at me and threatens me and flat out tells me that they are going to punish me with XYZ because I dared to file a grievance when a supervisor pushed me and proceeded to do my work in front of me, with my center manager present at the time - well, obviously the local completely abandoned that slam dunk grievance or this wouldn't be contributing to my list of problems.
    One of our local stewards is kind of a joke. I learned fairly recently that his constant failure is increasingly famous outside our area.
    I've personally met supervisors who are blatantly racist, even going as far as to use racist language among groups of workers, in anger. Funnily enough it was the black victim in question who was basically carrying our department on his back, and he was being called out for being "another one of those lazy darkies." I can't tell you how many of us went to management above this person and to HR and that person not only kept their job but stayed in our department for quite some time and continued to behave in that manner. on one occasion I spoke to our center manager about it and I got a very unconvincing claim from them that they had no idea what was going on and it was a big surprise and they would take care of it. I'm also somewhat convinced that center manager was extremely racist and homophobic and I hadn't really counted on getting any good commitment to action out of them.
    Some of our good stewards were booted because they supported one of the challenging slates in the last election. That is another famous event here in internetland, the huge wipeout of all the solid unioneers. With them unable to do anything, having been blackballed, there's no one to prop up everyone else. The local's obviously not interested in doing what we pay them for.
    My BA makes 150 grand. I can't think of a single reason why I would pay him 1/3 of that if I were in charge of the local's payroll.
    For the darker stuff in line with the manager suicide, I work with a FT sup who rode his drivers so hard (when he used to be a driver manager) that two died on the same day on route. He was drunk when the company division came and escorted him to his demotion, or so the stories go. And now he curses at people all day, despite all the complaints to the union and the company about him, and he will never stop. That man will die cursing at an employee, probably of his last great heart attack.

    Our safety teams are sort of a joke. A few are trying to get things going right but the company is stonewalling every effort and the union gives no support at all. The local put through this memo a few years back saying that because safety team members were being used as management, all CHSP activities were to be shut down immediately. Well that never happened. In fact a few of us have brought it up at local meetings and the union doesn't seem to do anything but make promises. Again, they've done nothing to help the process, to actually stop the nonsense, nor to start up the real contractual CHSP. Two of our shifts have makeshift CHSPs running and trying to do things right but they aren't having a lot of success for obvious reasons.

    Some time ago I realized that if you took the union leadership as a whole, from the international offices down to our local, and completely transplanted those people with their equivalents at the company - the CEO on down to our supervisors - things would run exactly the same. Each person would discover, ahh, my job is exactly the same. I spend part of my time faking paperwork and making promises I can't keep, and the rest of my time either finding reasons to not do my job or making excuses and assigning blame. And then at each quarterly revenue meeting we will toast another record. But no, we can't afford pens this year.
    Atleast, that's how it feels to me. I have no respect at all for the International after our recent contract debacle. I can't tell you how much the VP lied to us in his campaigning for the contract. And then there's all the stories about the polling bullying! By the union and the company, both! Anyway, this is about the local, but my point is that all this corruption seems widespread and I am still in awe of those of you who claim to have solid locals.

    We have a lot of very defeated union members here in 767. They are jaded. They have given up trying to get the union to help them with anything whatsoever.

    If you're not 767, refrain from saying that our problems are not problems or that they are easy to solve, I've heard all that a hundred times.
    If you are 767, this would be a good place to concentrate your elevated negativity.
    Lasted edited by : Mar 7, 2014
  2. Island

    Island Active Member

    On a personal and recent note, today a FT sup made the mistake of telling me that on a conference call his "bosses' bosses" all said that every worker should be doing the work of 3 people, or else the FT sup is failing at his job. A few people in my department perked when he said that, it is a sensitive topic given that a lot of people in our hub suffer from overwork, a few having had terrible injuries as a result. Later that day my PT sup kept saying I was moving slow while I myself was doing the work of two people. I mocked him as I tend to, since there's no other solution to the situation given my local's abandonment, but he spent much of the day riding me about working even harder. I felt like, if our local was solid, then everyone who witnessed the statement made by our FT sup should have been able to add it to stack of cases of overwork. Unfortunately the union doesn't care about overworked or even injured employees.
  3. Jackburton

    Jackburton Gone Fish'n

    Can you break your post up into chapters?
  4. Island

    Island Active Member

    If you're not interested in a heavy read then this won't be a good thread to watch. I didn't intend to make this easy for an audience, but to provide a place for 767 members to realize that they aren't alone.
  5. jumpman23

    jumpman23 Oh Yeah

    This is precisely the reason why I got the Aflac. I got 13.5 years left and I already kmow that the only way I am going to finish the race is to take off some time here and there. That's pretty much a given with these freaks overworking us and beating the hell out of us. Theres so many guys working in pain and injuries its not even funny. I guess if their dumb enough to work injured and in pain all the time that's their stupidity. Im not doing it. If im in pain and I know I have a nagging injury im going to the doctor and probably shutting it down. I don't care about UPS, its about my health first and foremost. Im trying to finish the race by any means necessary.
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  6. bellesmom

    bellesmom Member

    Island you nailed everything that has been going on in 767 or more accurately not going on. I'm not surprised with the company's latest "pound them into the dirt" attitude because it must have been our fault they screwed up peak and cost themselves a bit of money, reputation, etc. We the employees must be punished on a daily basis because they won't take the blame.

    The defeated, jaded members as you said paid a heavy price and cannot carry others on their backs anymore. We need everyone to start paying attention to the troubles as a whole and not just their work area but that's a big dream.
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  7. jumpman23

    jumpman23 Oh Yeah

    It was just a matter of time before something like 804 happened. Drivers are over the shenanigans. Somethings gotta give or theirs going to be a whole lot of people losing their minds and totally snapping. Eventually you will see and hear of someone or people going absolutely biserk. I feel bad for the new guys and gals that will be starting here in the next 5 to 10 years. This place will be a place where you can only work 10 to 20 years physically. Its to the point now where its just freakin ridiculous and funny as hell lol.
  8. Island

    Island Active Member

    bellesmom I know you probably have other things to say. I'd like to hear it.
    Some of our new people are very bright-eyed but as you say, jumpman, I feel bad for them also. I've been telling them that it's tough here, there's better jobs elsewhere, but if they grow real thick skin it might be worth it by the time they are calculating retirement.
    If the new minimum wage passes, our contract will be even more of a joke, and I'll be happy to watch as no new employees come through the door and the company actually has to try to retain its people. ...I live in a fantasy, obviously
  9. jumpman23

    jumpman23 Oh Yeah

    Its different at every center though. Some centers its drivers versus management and everything has to be done by the book and by the contract 100 percent cause they have a strong local. Theres nothing with that but theres always tension in the air. We have a weak local and weak members but at the same time its more like drivers scratch managements back and management scratches drivers back at our center. Its all a game and you have to play it either way, you kinda learn that if you play the game it kinda makes the job easier sorta speak on the stress side of it anyway. Maybe not so much on the physical end but theres a mutual agreement for the most part between the 2 parties. Would the supes throw you under the bus to save his job, oh hell yeah lol. We all play the game from top to the bottom unfortunately. Kinda bs that the company and the job has come to this really. But for most part its pretty chill most of the time at our center. JUST 1 BIG MIND GAME AT UPS.
  10. Island

    Island Active Member

    What you describe is too much for me. I can tolerate no givebacks knowing that even a little nibble on my contract is just an appetizer for these people. So while my contract basically doesn't exist and hasn't for a long time I won't be happy with it until it is 100% secure, which will never happen. However maybe I will someday find a dark corner of some hub where I can chill out like you. Maybe you are lucky after all.
  11. kristan

    kristan New Member

    We have a new steward on days who seems like a good guy who cares and is able to work with issues at hand. Frankly, I wish we'd had him sooner, but I'm glad he's there now. He's certainly not alone if we stand with him as a group in the workplace. He does need an alternate, so there is that. Too big of a shop for one person. I hope the local will pony up and get a second player into the mix. There are peeps who've asked to be trained. That's fair.

    As for the elections, I agree with some of what you're saying. True Ballot has got to go. There have been alleged issues all over the map -- not just within union elections -- that put TB in a questionable light, including information from other programmers. If we're going to use a third party, we need one that isn't on the other side of the country as well as an objective software code supervisor. If you want to change that, good luck. The by-laws as they stand give the EB the power to do whatever it wants pretty much. Until those are addressed, we'll face the same problems over and over. It's a matter of conquering apathy, really. And money.

    150 grand now? I haven't taken a gander at LM2s in a minute. I have seen some BAs who deserved that kind of dosh, but, man, if you can't organize the majority of your local workforce or even have employees identify who the heck you are, you miiiiiiight not be a proper candidate for six figures plus.

    Island, you forgot something important non-UPS related: Allied de-certed. We lost our waste guys. They voted us out. That's freaking horrible and disgraceful, and yet there was not a peep. No word put out to help campaign. Nada. Those guys were very vocal against the local in the last election, btw. To top it off: Americold, anyone? Heard of them? Shame.

    Removing stewardships didn't negate the abilities of former stewards to continue supporting their brothers and sisters -- only prohibitive in settling certain grievances at the shop level. If you don't have the local's support, there's no more power in being a steward than there is in being a general member.

    They're reading, I promise. Tell 'em how you want it fixed.
  12. Island

    Island Active Member

    I have left out a few things intentionally because I know I am quite long-winded. Also I want to encourage other Texans to explain some issues as well, rather than just agreeing with my opinions.
    I was at the meeting where the local announced the decert of Allied, if I remember correctly, and it was met with a lot of apathy. The officers were quick to assign blame to the membership for not helping them but were just as quick to forget it ever happened. Honestly it seemed to me like they didn't really care.
    As for me, personally, I would have probably helped them out in some way had our local been doing more to get us more involved with organizing. I'm not going to go out on my own and figure out how to help those guys, I am already too stressed out with my own two jobs to seek more stress that is somewhat unrelated to me. And a small part of my brain keeps saying, "Let them get angry then form their own union, F the IBT."
    Back when Bell was on strike (well, a few times), I kept wanting to pull over and grab a sign. A couple of times I took their exit and drove by shouting encouragement while I was heading to work. There are a lot of other unions that are eager to help out other unions. It benefits the Writers Union to help out the Plumbers Union because if there are more strong unions out there then the Writers Union has to fight people a lot less to get its points across. It is another disappointment in my mind that the local never asked me to give encouragement to the Bell folks.

    As for the BA's salary, some of that got leaked online a little while back. I'm not sure if a hacker was doxxing the local, as the kids say, but some of their salaries got out. I think most of them are too technologically inept to even realize it happened.
  13. outta hours

    outta hours Active Member

    As a 767 member who does attend meetings, something the OP admitted to not doing. I debated on even addressing any of the misinformation,omissions,and blatant lies listed by the OP. But once I logged in and discovered that the OP has gone back in any thread I posted regarding 767 and selected the dislike button. I realized that Island was nothing more than a below average troll who was attempting to start an anonymous internet forum battle. I've been in those before and always been able to send them back to their holes. But this attempt is so absurd I won't waste my time.

    Anyone can anonymously post rhetoric that is full of misinformation in the hopes that other readers will take it as fact. But for the most part Brown Cafe users are smarter than that and refuse to engage the OP and subsequently without a reaction they fade away. I am sure my response will warrant another rant with poor grammar, bad structure, and a unreadable reply. To which I will not even bother to respond. So Island I encourage you to attend the next union meeting to have your concerns addressed. And instead of spending what it appears to have taken you hours to construct a poorly written rambling thread, get active in your local and help make it better.
  14. Island

    Island Active Member

    Your experience with the union is vastly different from mine for reasons I have already explained. I hope you and Wesley enjoy each others' friendship, the man does nothing at all for me or my coworkers.
    If you want to say my facts are wrong and you're too good to correct them, that's on you. Everything I have written here is what I have personally observed and discussed with many others.
    As for the meetings, I stopped going after they started dismissing my concerns. Much as you just did.
  15. Island

    Island Active Member

    For the 767ers who I recently discovered are lurking and reading this and talking about it at work: Well, I didn't anticipate that kind of reception. And I did try to edit and remove a couple statements and opinions but I can't seem to edit my own post. I realize some of my opinions are pretty inflammatory and I understand any disagreement with them.
  16. Island

    Island Active Member

    767 news this week. Multiple members of management have stated plainly that there are new buildings under construction. One major center to take the delivery volume out of the DFW building (it would go back to an air building only), at least one satellite hub for a city in the northern part of the metroplex and probably one somewhere in Dallas with a small center. The further rumor is that Mesquite is the hub getting a new satellite. I assume taking some of the delivery routes out of Mesquite would allow its feeder sort to function better.
    The new building would need something like 15 new feeder drivers. DFW is still hiring lots of new feeder drivers (15 on the current bid, but I don't believe that bid list has anything to do with the new building that is on the distant horizon), and delivery drivers. The company is so desperate to find people to drive that I have heard of people with 4 years of part-time seniority being called to begin driving. Everyone else has smartly turned it down.
    That's all for now, but it is good news to those of us who are dealing with completely bonkers sort operations.
  17. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt Dark Prince of Double Standards Staff Member

    MESTX P/T employees are very lucky to have this short of time before they can bid on a driver's job. Most hubs are around 7 - 12 years before they get a chance.
  18. Island

    Island Active Member

    The cases I have heard of were at DFW, not Mesquite. The reason so many of us have turned it down and allowed new hires to go drive is because our local has done such a bad job enforcing 9.5. There are too few routes, and drivers have too many stops. At DFW there isn't room for more trucks to be parked so the company, rather than building a new hub a long time ago, has simply been harassing drivers this whole time while having a lot of service failures. Mesquite is probably the same in this respect.
    I don't want to drive because I don't want to be the new driver who is stuck working 13 hour days, and my short day is a 10 hour day. When I meet a person who wants to go drive I make it very clear to them what's going to happen but they typically don't believe me and go looking for more sides of the story. As they talk to other people they quickly learn that I was right. Unfortunately I can't talk to just everyone. But if I was discouraging every single employee from becoming a driver, the company would have a real serious shortage of drivers. Once the new building is complete we'll see how the drivers 9.5 language is enforced and if IE actually planned the number of stops per routes correctly or if they purposely arranged for all routes to still have too many stops.
    There are drivers moving to feeders to replace retirees because they know they'll actually get fewer hours in feeders.
  19. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt Dark Prince of Double Standards Staff Member

    I respect your desire to work an 8 - 9 hour day but poor, hungry people (like I was at age 24) would jump at a job at 10 - 12 hour days. (Limited to 60 hours per week)
    I find it hard to believe UPS cannot fill open driver jobs from the P/T Union ranks.

    When I drove, I averaged 54 hours per week. (I took a big cut in pay when I went into management.)

    Many P/T at UPS already work a F/T job in addition to their P/T UPS job ... that's 12 -13 hours a day.
  20. Island

    Island Active Member

    Personally what I want is a combo job that doesn't involve driving and doesn't involve a huge gap in between split shifts. Unfortunately the company has stated that it is no longer creating combo jobs in our area and the local has had to fight hard to get them to put the combos up for bid when those employees have vacated them. The local has abandoned the case otherwise, ever since the combo folks won their payrates back. They still have huge splits.
    It may be hard to believe that no one wants to drive but it is true. Our area's drivers are that badly treated, even viewed against the national standard.