Ok so why in past contracts like in 1997 it was not invoked I bet they had same percentage of votes .....This has never been done in history with large company like this This will be historical and the end of Labor Unions across the country slot of other labor unions follow this contract while the negotiate their own. This is one of the largest if not largest labor contract in the worldEverybody is trying to place the blame for this imposed contract on everything and everyone, except where the real blame belongs.
This clause in the IBT Constitution was pointed out here long before the vote was over, and has been in the IBT Constitution for 25 years and no one has ever attempted to remove it. I believe @Bubblehead was the first to point it out here. Just like last contract, people complained that they were not told that Teamcare required a weekly punch.
You would think that we would do our due diligence and research on a 5 year contract before we voted.
We are the only ones to blame. Could not even get half the people to vote. If we did, they would be back at the table right now. UPS Freight did, UPS Airline mechanics did. Why couldn't we?
And here you are trying to blame UPS. While I know they are ruthless at times, and I but heads with them on a daily basis, let's look where you placed blame.
Facilitating open and honest communications with our employees, customers and stakeholders
They did. In most places people even complained that UPS nagged them all the time to vote. Legally, they are not allowed to discuss the contract with you. Is this what you wanted? For UPS to tell you that Hoffa will impose the contract if you do not vote. They told you to vote.
Considering all good-faith proposals brought to the table during negotiations
They did. They negotiated since last November, and agreed with the IBT on this latest good-faith proposal. Do you not forget that the IBT negotiated this, has called it the best contract ever, and recommended a yes vote?
recognize the contributions of our employees
You do again realize that the lower paid 22.4 driver was proposed, and agreed to, by the IBT as well? While I believe we could have done much better, we did get a raise, for FT and PT, pension and H&W improvements and new jobs committed to.
competition and fairly reward the hard work, teamwork and determination of our employees
Again, I think we could have, and maybe should have, gotten better. But even with the lower paid 22.4 drivers, we are still the highest paid in the industry. Ask a FedEx driver, or DHL, or Holland, or ABF, or Amazon driver what they make.
Do you really want to make a change?
Elect someone in the next IBT election that will fix this in the contract in 2023. But yes, we are stuck with this for 5 years because we could not even get half our people to make a phone call or log into a webpage.
Shame on us.
In 1997 Ron Carey refused to bring the Company's "last, best, and final offer" to the membership for a vote, electing instead to call for a strike.Ok so why in past contracts like in 1997 it was not invoked I bet they had same percentage of votes .....This has never been done in history with large company like this This will be historical and the end of Labor Unions across the country slot of other labor unions follow this contract while the negotiate their own. This is one of the largest if not largest labor contract in the world
Wise words from an obvious sage.Everybody is trying to place the blame for this imposed contract on everything and everyone, except where the real blame belongs.
This clause in the IBT Constitution was pointed out here long before the vote was over, and has been in the IBT Constitution for 25 years and no one has ever attempted to remove it. I believe @Bubblehead was the first to point it out here. Just like last contract, people complained that they were not told that Teamcare required a weekly punch.
You would think that we would do our due diligence and research on a 5 year contract before we voted.
We are the only ones to blame. Could not even get half the people to vote. If we did, they would be back at the table right now. UPS Freight did, UPS Airline mechanics did. Why couldn't we?
And here you are trying to blame UPS. While I know they are ruthless at times, and I but heads with them on a daily basis, let's look where you placed blame.
Facilitating open and honest communications with our employees, customers and stakeholders
They did. In most places people even complained that UPS nagged them all the time to vote. Legally, they are not allowed to discuss the contract with you. Is this what you wanted? For UPS to tell you that Hoffa will impose the contract if you do not vote. They told you to vote.
Considering all good-faith proposals brought to the table during negotiations
They did. They negotiated since last November, and agreed with the IBT on this latest good-faith proposal. Do you not forget that the IBT negotiated this, has called it the best contract ever, and recommended a yes vote?
recognize the contributions of our employees
You do again realize that the lower paid 22.4 driver was proposed, and agreed to, by the IBT as well? While I believe we could have done much better, we did get a raise, for FT and PT, pension and H&W improvements and new jobs committed to.
competition and fairly reward the hard work, teamwork and determination of our employees
Again, I think we could have, and maybe should have, gotten better. But even with the lower paid 22.4 drivers, we are still the highest paid in the industry. Ask a FedEx driver, or DHL, or Holland, or ABF, or Amazon driver what they make.
Do you really want to make a change?
Elect someone in the next IBT election that will fix this in the contract in 2023. But yes, we are stuck with this for 5 years because we could not even get half our people to make a phone call or log into a webpage.
Shame on us.
Why do we have to wait until 2023???Everybody is trying to place the blame for this imposed contract on everything and everyone, except where the real blame belongs.
This clause in the IBT Constitution was pointed out here long before the vote was over, and has been in the IBT Constitution for 25 years and no one has ever attempted to remove it. I believe @Bubblehead was the first to point it out here. Just like last contract, people complained that they were not told that Teamcare required a weekly punch.
You would think that we would do our due diligence and research on a 5 year contract before we voted.
We are the only ones to blame. Could not even get half the people to vote. If we did, they would be back at the table right now. UPS Freight did, UPS Airline mechanics did. Why couldn't we?
And here you are trying to blame UPS. While I know they are ruthless at times, and I but heads with them on a daily basis, let's look where you placed blame.
Facilitating open and honest communications with our employees, customers and stakeholders
They did. In most places people even complained that UPS nagged them all the time to vote. Legally, they are not allowed to discuss the contract with you. Is this what you wanted? For UPS to tell you that Hoffa will impose the contract if you do not vote. They told you to vote.
Considering all good-faith proposals brought to the table during negotiations
They did. They negotiated since last November, and agreed with the IBT on this latest good-faith proposal. Do you not forget that the IBT negotiated this, has called it the best contract ever, and recommended a yes vote?
recognize the contributions of our employees
You do again realize that the lower paid 22.4 driver was proposed, and agreed to, by the IBT as well? While I believe we could have done much better, we did get a raise, for FT and PT, pension and H&W improvements and new jobs committed to.
competition and fairly reward the hard work, teamwork and determination of our employees
Again, I think we could have, and maybe should have, gotten better. But even with the lower paid 22.4 drivers, we are still the highest paid in the industry. Ask a FedEx driver, or DHL, or Holland, or ABF, or Amazon driver what they make.
Do you really want to make a change?
Elect someone in the next IBT election that will fix this in the contract in 2023. But yes, we are stuck with this for 5 years because we could not even get half our people to make a phone call or log into a webpage.
Shame on us.
Freight doesn't have more than half their members as short term, high turnover, part time employee either.Ron Carey set this in motion a long time ago. Love him or hate him it’s the Teamster constitution. Ron was all about voting. I know this first had because I know him very well. He had it right that members needed to vote. He also had it right that part time America didn’t work. He screwed up the pensions, but in the end if people listened to him and voted, you aren’t where you are right now. Freight members don’t have these problems because they vote.
In 1997 Ron Carey refused to bring the Company's "last, best, and final offer" to the membership for a vote, electing instead to call for a strike.
He wasn't in bed with the Company.
Why do we have to wait until 2023???
Isn't the same language in Art 12, section 6 of the IBT Constitution available to the General Executive Board as it was in 2014 when they imposed 3 area supplements???
Why do we have to wait until 2023???
Seeing that more than half of the membership at UPS are part time employees that have continually demonstrated an unwillingness to vote, seems to me this action would be "in the interests of the International Union or its subordinate bodies".
I know for a fact Fed ex drivers make more then us I live next door to one . The actual real fed ex drivers that have to own 5 or more routes to be a subcontractor and then they hire a guy and while he is on golf course he pay him 15 bucks a hour to use his truck and deliver his route .Minus the gas and insurance he is making 6 figures easily ..and he also has no trouble putting his socks on in the morning because his knees don’t bend anymore ... Didnyou read where UPS strives to compete with completion salary. Amazon part time start rate 15 a hour.Wise words from an obvious sage.
Freight doesn't have more than half their members as short term, high turnover, part time employee either.
I know for a fact Fed ex drivers make more then us I live next door to one .
And he is on the golf course making 30 dollars and still paying him 15. He is making 45 a hour. More then usLike @Bubblehead says, "let's compare apples to apples."
You just proved my point. You said that the person "driving" that truck makes $15/hr.
The person who owns the truck is not a delivery driver, he is a small business owner. Big difference.
The more routes they own, the more they can make.
I am sure a lot of PT would agree with eliminating all PT jobs and converting them to Art 22.3 at $30/hr. Was this ever a contract proposal?Why do we have to wait until 2023???
Isn't the same language in Art 12, section 6 of the IBT Constitution available to the General Executive Board as it was in 2014 when they imposed 3 area supplements???
~Section 6. The General Executive Board is empowered to amend, delete, or add to this Article if at any time it believes such action will be in the interests of the International Union or its subordinate bodies.~
Seeing that more than half of the membership at UPS are part time employees that have continually demonstrated an unwillingness to vote, seems to me this action would be "in the interests of the International Union or its subordinate bodies".
And no one is blaming UPS for anything all we want is for UPS to be fair to thier hard working employees who are the ones that make them The most profitable and proficient in the industry from the sacrifices of its workers .. ( like working till 830pm everyday and sacrificing time away from families) day in day out not just during peak
That is a good point, and to fix that, the IBT Constitution is going to need to be amended.
Good luck with that.
Someone is getting kick backsI have no problem with what you said, and I agree.
So what is it that you personally wanted, or think that would be fair for UPS to give you?
I don't like the lower paid 22.4 driver, but the IBT gave this gift to UPS. You don't think they would jump all over it or do you think that they feel that they should do the right thing and pay them more?
Our Union, who we elected to bargain on our behalf, agreed to this. And we could not get half our people to vote to overrule the Union.
And he is on the golf course making 30 dollars and still paying him 15. He is making 45 a hour. More then us