Viewpoints for new contract, what's in-store?

[Inthegame]

.....and you continue to unsuccessfully attempt to sell the notion that there were no other options or alternatives.

Not selling anything but an accurate report of the options available under the law at the time, while you ramble from speculative theory to theory, with every presupposition that those in charge knew the future.
When the CSPF attained green zone status with the UPS payment of withdrawal liability, why would anyone consider lobbying for a law change to save a healthy plan?
Now after the crash of '08, the CSPF administator Tom Nyhan did indeed seek to institute a 10% cut in benefits that was widely resisted.

One fact remains with the geometry of the situation, that being that no theorem or postulate can explain away that the fund is destined for failure and those who are going to do without aren't accepting excuses and neither am I.

OK, Don Quixote but giving you a factual rendition of history isn't making excuses.

 

[Bubblehead]

Not selling anything but an accurate report of the options available under the law at the time, while you ramble from speculative theory to theory, with every presupposition that those in charge knew the future.
When the CSPF attained green zone status with the UPS payment of withdrawal liability, why would anyone consider lobbying for a law change to save a healthy plan?
Now after the crash of '08, the CSPF administator Tom Nyhan did indeed seek to institute a 10% cut in benefits that was widely resisted.
OK, Don Quixote but giving you a factual rendition of history isn't making excuses.

I'm saying that letting UPS, the single biggest contributor (by far), out of the fund while it was upside down in regards to actives vs retiree, was the equivalent of tapping out.

While the "green zone" illusion may have been "sustainable" for awhile stock market permitting, it marked the beginning of the end no matter what.

No significant newly organized company would ever buy in, after UPS bought out, and the ebbs and flows of the market would have (and did) bleed the fund dry later or sooner.

BTW, like it or not, when you throw your hat in the ring and prevail, you will be judged on your body of work.
Do I enjoy hindsight?
Absolutely!!!
But it wasn't and isn't my hat or legacy in the ring as we speak.
History will be written in stone and it won't be flattering.

 

[anHOURover]

I'm saying that letting UPS, the single biggest contributor (by far), out of the fund while it was upside down in regards to actives vs retiree, was the equivalent of tapping out.

While the "green zone" illusion may have been "sustainable" for awhile stock market permitting, it marked the beginning of the end no matter what.

No significant newly organized company would ever buy in, after UPS bought out, and the ebbs and flows of the market would have (and did) bleed the fund dry later or sooner.

BTW, like it or not, when you throw your hat in the ring and prevail, you will be judged on your body of work.
Do I enjoy hindsight?
Absolutely!!!
But it wasn't and isn't my hat or legacy in the ring as we speak.
History will be written in stone and it won't be flattering.

How much is paff charging you for a table this year ?
Did you get the early bird special?

 

[Inthegame]

How much is paff charging you for a table this year ?
Did you get the early bird special?

Go away little boy, adults are having a grown up conversation here you clearly cannot understand.

 

[Inthegame]

I'm saying that letting UPS, the single biggest contributor (by far), out of the fund while it was upside down in regards to actives vs retiree, was the equivalent of tapping out.

And the main reason Fred G (former trustee on the CSPF) ran against JPH in 2011. The active v retiree ratio while concerning, was also expected and with adequate returns and contributions can be overcome. Remember when those 44K UPS members left so did any additional liability.

No significant newly organized company would ever buy in, after UPS bought out, and the ebbs and flows of the market would have (and did) bleed the fund dry later or sooner.

That is more a function of structure of the withdrawal liability requirement on existing employer participants than action of a single employer. No one wants the continuing long term liability that comes with withdrawal, hence the hybrid plan that has been hatched.
FYI, CSPF on average beat their assumed rate of return over the last 20 yrs.

History will be written in stone and it won't be flattering.

Especially so if alternative facts are used.

 

[LeadBelly]

How much is paff charging you for a table this year ?
Did you get the early bird special?

According to Jumbo you need to take some of your 25 hour check and pay for a table dance or two.