What don't/do like about this contract?

PAS has many benefits for UPS. One of them is recycling Preloaders, sorters, etc so there's less and less union strength as new employees have no knowledge of what some have faught for. When it comes time to negotiate contracts, there's little doubt that no matter how poor they are ( this last one was just a scratch on the surface), they'll be ratified because the union's that much weaker with revolving door unknowing, unskilled job workers, a fruit of PAS.

There was a time when preloaders and drivers saw each other daily, shot the ..., and etc. Now you'll never know which work-release loaded your truck and if you'll actually be shot to ...

I never really thought about it that way, but that does make pretty good sense. The longer an employee stays with UPS, the wiser and more informed they get. Keeping the starting wage low will insure high turnover, which in turn will result in a nieve and un-informed workforce. These people either won't vote or will vote with the company. And that's exactly how UPS wants it to be.
 

IDoLessWorkThanMost

Well-Known Member
I never really thought about it that way, but that does make pretty good sense. The longer an employee stays with UPS, the wiser and more informed they get. Keeping the starting wage low will insure high turnover, which in turn will result in a nieve and un-informed workforce. These people either won't vote or will vote with the company. And that's exactly how UPS wants it to be.

Absolutely. We could go even deeper into it, but let's not get too depressing on a Friday before a 4 day weekend. ;)
 

Overpaid Union Thug

Well-Known Member
The reason, cause i still have 21 years left to go on part time. why would i want to draw from the bottom of the employment barrel? 8.50 an hour, is a joke. thats whats wrong with the teamsters they drove a wedge between PTer's and FTer's. i was talking to a driver last night about all the cover drivers they use instead of adding another route, and he thinks it;s good wording that cover drivers can only drive 208 times a year, or UPS has to add another route. lets do the math 365 days a year, 104 days that don't count towards cover driving( sat, sun) so that brings us down to 261, minus the 208 leave 53 days a year.

Did you include November and December in that 261 days?
 

steeltoe

Well-Known Member
Not to sound selfish, but why would a current UPS employee be so worried about the starting pay of anyone???

This is the exact reason why our Union is in the state that it is in. Everyone out for themselves. Why would you worry about the starting pay of anyone, because someone in the past cared about it the day you started. Have you people ever heard of the concept of the "Internal Customer"? You have some clown working for $.50 more per hour than you did 25 years ago loading your package car. What type pf employee do you think we are going to be able to hire in the year 2013 making $8.50 and hour and no benefits for 1 year?

How about our Mechanics? How are we going to hire experienced Mechanics making about $10.00 less per hour than at Pep Boys and expect our package car to stop properly? I hear it is nearly impossible to hire an experienced mechanic now, wait until this new contract goes into effect.

We have failed ourselves and our future Teamsters with this contract. We take the first offer on the table 10 months out from the end of the current contract. If anyone, I mean anyone, can give me another example of a Union going for the first offer being 10 months out from the end of the current contract, please show me.

Sorry for the rant, but I can not believe this current deal. I am in a right to work state. How in the world are we going to get new hires to join the union after 8/1/08? Sure my benefits and pay are better, but I have to work next to the dude making $8.50 an hour with no benefits for 1 year. I take that back, I will be working with the 25 dudes in the same position in the same year due to lack of pay and the all hit the road.
 

tunemixer

Well-Known Member
I believe each local is different when it comes to the new hires getting benefits . I talked to our SS the other day and he checked for me. He said it does not include our local which is #597. I voted NO for both the suppliment and the national contract because I DO care what happens to the future emplyees at UPS. I am looking at no more than 1 1/2 years and I'm gone. When I started back in 1983 the pension was terrible. Its now a very good one and has gotten better over the last 10 or so years. I'm looking at almost 4000 a month with 25 years . If Bush doesn't blow all my SS I'll get another boost 6 months after I retire. Not to shabby for not working .
 

Fredless

APWA Hater
Not to sound selfish, but why would a current UPS employee be so worried about the starting pay of anyone???


You sound like a feeder driver that was at one of my local meetings and started screaming at the part time preload steward when he raised questions to the president of the local about the contract and expressed how difficult it was going to be to sell the union to the new hires.

The guy totally flipped out and went on blah blah blah..I think that jackass was one of the reasons why our local, comparitively, had a pretty high percentage of a no vote.

Feeders/old timers and management got their way. Screw everyone else, and screw the unborn. Speaking from personal experience, it is very difficult to sell the union and ESPECIALLY difficult to get the part timers to care about the union.

But thats fine, you guys got to retire. So I guess the future of the organization doesn't matter..you guys got your money and its the unborn's fault that you relied on a promise to you by a company that constantly breaks promises.

I guess it was too hard to learn from:
The steel industry
the railroad industry
the government job pensions going away
the airline industry
the auto industry.

But whatever, you guys had your day in the sun so piss on everyone else.
 

ezmoney5150

Well-Known Member
You know, one of the reasons I stay away from this board is that it is filled with management who have an agenda to dumb hourly down and meesters who care about nothing but themselves. But someone sent me a link to this thread and like a goofball I clicked it. And I hate to let people be mislead.

Now!!! I'm no schill for UPS management. I am very involved with my locals politcs, but common sense is common sense. For everyone who want's to raise the starting pay for part-timers, my question to you is: Are you willing to go without a raise for the whole contract???? Most of you would say yes, then vote no on the contract.

Lets just for giggles start the pt at $15. Well what do you do with all the people who have worked here for 3-4 years??? Do they stay at $11-$12 while new hires make $15???? Uh???? no, so you have to push them to at least $18. Not to mention the rest of the hourly that are not red circles. That would cost a boat load of money. Now considering that UPS just wrote a check for $6,001,000,000.00 (I wrote it out to give perspective)to Central States, where do you think the money to up the part timers pay is going to come from???? Yes your package car and feeder drivers pay.

Now, knowing how my feeder department reacts. The first time that this proposal got leaked, that there would be no raises for any full time drivers, there would be a lynch mob waiting outside the union hall.

I could see the reaction already, "who cares about a bunch of college kids, I have a family to support." And a Harley, and a friend-350 pickup, and a $300,000 home.

We're truck drivers not executives.

Tell me I'm wrong.
 

IDoLessWorkThanMost

Well-Known Member
You know, one of the reasons I stay away from this board is that it is filled with management who have an agenda to dumb hourly down and meesters who care about nothing but themselves. But someone sent me a link to this thread and like a goofball I clicked it. And I hate to let people be mislead.

Now!!! I'm no schill for UPS management. I am very involved with my locals politcs, but common sense is common sense. For everyone who want's to raise the starting pay for part-timers, my question to you is: Are you willing to go without a raise for the whole contract???? Most of you would say yes, then vote no on the contract.

Lets just for giggles start the pt at $15. Well what do you do with all the people who have worked here for 3-4 years??? Do they stay at $11-$12 while new hires make $15???? Uh???? no, so you have to push them to at least $18. Not to mention the rest of the hourly that are not red circles. That would cost a boat load of money. Now considering that UPS just wrote a check for $6,001,000,000.00 (I wrote it out to give perspective)to Central States, where do you think the money to up the part timers pay is going to come from???? Yes your package car and feeder drivers pay.

Now, knowing how my feeder department reacts. The first time that this proposal got leaked, that there would be no raises for any full time drivers, there would be a lynch mob waiting outside the union hall.

I could see the reaction already, "who cares about a bunch of college kids, I have a family to support." And a Harley, and a friend-350 pickup, and a $300,000 home.

We're truck drivers not executives.

Tell me I'm wrong.

No one's talking or mentioning 15/hr. Your misconception here is fairly obvious. Fed-Ex package handlers (in this general area) are making 11-13/hr to start, with benes. We are talking about competition here.

Personally, I am close to making top rate and am not affected by part-time wages. But, as a part-timer for several years, I can say that $8.50 is not cutting it in reality, lining up with comparable jobs!
 

ezmoney5150

Well-Known Member
No one's talking or mentioning 15/hr. Your misconception here is fairly obvious. Fed-Ex package handlers (in this general area) are making 11-13/hr to start, with benes. We are talking about competition here.

Personally, I am close to making top rate and am not affected by part-time wages. But, as a part-timer for several years, I can say that $8.50 is not cutting it in reality, lining up with comparable jobs!

15$ was just an example. I was part time I know what its all about. Is Fed Ex paying their health insurance??? probably not. So the $8.50 is now up to about $14-15. Now they have a $10 co-pay. Fed-Ex may make more in wages but our PT's make more all around. You can't just forget about benefits. That part of the pay package.
 

IDoLessWorkThanMost

Well-Known Member
15$ was just an example. I was part time I know what its all about. Is Fed Ex paying their health insurance??? probably not. So the $8.50 is now up to about $14-15. Now they have a $10 co-pay. Fed-Ex may make more in wages but our PT's make more all around. You can't just forget about benefits. That part of the pay package.

Do you read posts or just glance then keep typing away? 11-13/hr WITH BENEFITS.

No one's talking or mentioning 15/hr. Your misconception here is fairly obvious. Fed-Ex package handlers (in this general area) are making 11-13/hr to start, with benes. We are talking about competition here
 

IDoLessWorkThanMost

Well-Known Member
I'm disputing what you are saying. I don't think Fed Ex picks up the cost of benefits. Who would unless they were forced to?

Well, you may be correct. I am not 100% sure to be honest, either. Maybe someone from fed-ex can clarify.

"Job Summary
Courier: The most highly visible of all positions, A FedEx Courier operates Company vehicles and provides courteous and efficient pickup and delivery of packages.

These are Part Time positions. Candidates work an average of 17.5 up to 30 hours a week. Pay rate is $15.91/hr. Position includes a full benefits package.

You are not eligible to apply for the Courier position if you have had any of the following within the last 3 years: More than 2 moving violations, more than 1 non-moving license suspension or ANY moving violation suspension."


"Handler: The driving force behind our business by ensuring that packages are scanned, sorted and properly loaded on FedEx aircraft, containers, and vehicles.

These are Part Time positions. Pay rate is $12.50/hr. Position includes a full benefits package.

Approximate shift/hours:

AM shift: Monday through Friday: 6:30 AM to 8:30 AM (Must also commit to work 3 PM shifts)

PM shift: Sunday through Thursday: Sunday 3 PM to 10 PM (at Logan Airport) & Monday through Thursday 7:30 PM to 9:30 PM"
 

bigdog

Active Member
As a HR Manager- FED pays more with Benes in my area, but if you wok the ground side of FED your NOT guaranteed to work everyday - your kind of on call
So you could work one day and be laid off all week
 

tieguy

Banned
But thats fine, you guys got to retire. So I guess the future of the organization doesn't matter..you guys got your money and its the unborn's fault that you relied on a promise to you by a company that constantly breaks promises.

I guess it was too hard to learn from:
The steel industry
the railroad industry
the government job pensions going away
the airline industry
the auto industry.

what lessons were they supposed to learn from these industries?
 

Fredless

APWA Hater
Not to trust a company or a union with their retirement...and how screwed you can get with doing a blue collar job for 50k+ a year with only a high school education, if that.
 

IDoLessWorkThanMost

Well-Known Member
Not to trust a company or a union with their retirement...and how screwed you can get with doing a blue collar job for 50k+ a year with only a high school education, if that.

....And (one thing alot of blue collar, HS or less educations don't think about here); you're making as much as guys/gals WITH college degrees IN YOUR SAME DOMAIN DOING the same JOB.

The person next to you making 60k might have 3x your education and skills.......this doesn't happen in many other places.
 
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