Wikileaks

[av8torntn]

As a lowly soldier, you claim almost firsthand knowledge of WMD in Iraq (you're not a contractor for "The Shop" are you?) :

Heck no I'm a UPS driver. I was the top enlisted soldier on a small highly trained team. Our job was mainly to go after individual targets, and train a small unit of Iraqi soldiers. At times it seemed like our job was to just ride around and get blown up.

Things like these happened in Iraq. These things have been reported widely on open news sources.

"Two former weapons inspectors — Hans Blix and David Kay — said the shell was likely a stray weapon that had been scavenged by militants and did not signify that Iraq had large stockpiles of such weapons."



OK I just got blocked from wikileaks site so I cannot post anymore. I have to go outside now and look for the black helicopters. I can't believe the site has been working this long for me. If I can find an open source link to some of my experiences I will share and give background and context.


<<<<<< That's laughing at me.

 

[wkmac]

Heck no I'm a UPS driver.

As I said, you're just a lowly soldier!


Here is Ray McGovern, a 27 year CIA agent in May 2006' in Atlanta Georgia challenging Donald Rumsfeld at around the 15 second mark over WMD in Iraq and at about 1:10 Rumsfeld responds specifically to the WMD in Iraq. This was May 2006'

[video=youtube;MInHphR4zBg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MInHphR4zBg&feature=related[/video]

As for the riding around part, well I didn't make that dispatch so what can I say but as to the "getting blown up part" was that blown up by WMD? Are you one of the soldiers who wore the protective suits daily because you were at such risk of a WMD attack?

This is the first I've heard of this so is it possible you could share more information about that ordeal and what you can tell us about known WMD weapons that might be deployed on your position? What weapon seemed the most concern at the time to be use, gas, biological agent or nuclear device? How would that weapon have been delivered upon the vehicle in which you were riding? I know there were lots of other attacks on moving vehicles carrying soldiers that used something called an IED and is that the same as a WMD? Do you have any documented incidents where a moving military vehicle was attacked with a WMD type weapon? Again, all this is new to me so by all means tell us what you can. Thanks in advance.

As for Black helicopters, I find looking at them at night makes them all black and in the case of airplanes, they can get that UFO effect in the right conditions so if I look, I do so at night. As for Wikileaks, let me know as I got friends and I can get you the good hook up!


Here Ray McGovern on the Death of the 4th Estate!

 

[bbsam]

Why on earth would a WMD be used against a single or very limited target? Contrary to the definition of WMD, isn't it?

 

[wkmac]

Why on earth would a WMD be used against a single or very limited target? Contrary to the definition of WMD, isn't it?

OK, then add those 2 questions to the list as well and maybe AV can explain that too because I don't have the answer.

 

[av8torntn]

As for the riding around part, well I didn't make that dispatch so what can I say but as to the "getting blown up part" was that blown up by WMD? Are you one of the soldiers who wore the protective suits daily because you were at such risk of a WMD attack?

This is the first I've heard of this so is it possible you could share more information about that ordeal and what you can tell us about known WMD weapons that might be deployed on your position? What weapon seemed the most concern at the time to be use, gas, biological agent or nuclear device? How would that weapon have been delivered upon the vehicle in which you were riding? I know there were lots of other attacks on moving vehicles carrying soldiers that used something called an IED and is that the same as a WMD? Do you have any documented incidents where a moving military vehicle was attacked with a WMD type weapon? Again, all this is new to me so by all means tell us what you can.

No
No


Chemical by far and as far as I know was the only. Conventional weapons were always the biggest concern.

Again this type of action was what was of the most concern at my level. << I was not involved in this but it was widely reported on. OMG WMD's used against a single or point target. But but but that's not possible.

This was a main reason given to the UN to go to war. <<<< Has nothing to do with wiki.

"BAGHDAD, Aug. 13 -- U.S. troops raiding a warehouse in the northern city of Mosul uncovered a suspected chemical weapons factory containing 1,500 gallons of chemicals believed destined for attacks on U.S. and Iraqi forces and civilians, military officials said Saturday. " <<<< Just kills the argument that Iraq had no capacity to develop WMD's.


From my knowledge blister agents were the most prevalent type found in Iraq. My knowledge is very limited. My job had nothing to do with looking for chemical weapons. Just for comedy once an old man approached us and told us an elaborate tale of an underground weapons lab with this "secret" entrance. We knew he was full of "it" but we spent several hours following him around to make sure he was. It was the only time I heard about nuclear weapons while I was there. It was really amazing the amount of detail this guy had to spin such a tale. We often wondered how many coalition troops he had spun that tale to over the years. I see number two of four joined in.

 

[av8torntn]

OK, then add those 2 questions to the list as well and maybe AV can explain that too because I don't have the answer.

As I said years ago on here. My opinion is that during the invasion the military fled. There were people who broke into unguarded depots and loaded up on weapons and buried them all over the place. I would present that as fact but I will just say it is my opinion. When the insurgency kicked up people were digging up these rounds and using them to make IED's and VBIED's. They used what they had and they were not used in a tactically superior way. Thank goodness. If they had 155mm or 152mm or mortar rounds or whatever they would "daisy chain" them together hook them to a detonator(normally a long range cordless telephone while I was there) and set them off. I've even seen them use RPG warheads. There were many times that we laughed at how if they only had done this or that they would have killed us all. If you just picked up a couple of rounds would you be able to tell if it was conventional or chemical? My guess is they they could not. Before I was there I would not have noticed the difference. This is all my opinion and not to be taken as some type of statement of fact.

 

[av8torntn]

As for Wikileaks, let me know as I got friends and I can get you the good hook up!

They are back up now.

"On Sunday 28th Novembre 2010, Wikileaks began publishing 251,287 leaked United States embassy cables, the largest set of confidential documents ever to be released into the public domain. The documents will give people around the world an unprecedented insight into the US Government's foreign activities."

"Due to recent attacks on our infrastructure, we've decided to make sure everyone can reach our content. As part of this process we're releasing archived copy of all files we ever released - that's almost 20,000 files. The archive linked here contains a torrent generated for each file and each directory."


"The 391,832 reports ('The Iraq War Logs'), document the war and occupation in Iraq, from 1st January 2004 to 31st December 2009 (except for the months of May 2004 and March 2009) as told by soldiers in the United States Army. Each is a 'SIGACT' or Significant Action in the war. They detail events as seen and heard by the US military troops on the ground in Iraq and are the first real glimpse into the secret history of the war that the United States government has been privy to throughout."



Doesn't look like they plan on backing down.

 

[tourists24]

You guys keep the questions coming to AV.... he is the real deal. Sometimes books and magazine articles can make you think you are an intellectual.... but keep an open mind. Keep your pre conceived notions aside and you may learn something

 

[bbsam]

You guys keep the questions coming to AV.... he is the real deal. Sometimes books and magazine articles can make you think you are an intellectual.... but keep an open mind. Keep your pre conceived notions aside and you may learn something

I do not doubt Av being the real deal. I am wondering why, if everything he is saying is true, the Sean Hannity's of the air waves weren't shoving that story every 2 minutes. Think about it. "Blistering agent"? Hell, that could be sulfuric acid. There isn't a high school chem lab in U.S. that doesn't stock "blistering agents". And what about the "daisy chaining" of conventional weapons? If that's WMD, then there is no country on the planet that would withstand the WMD rationale for invasion. It seems to me that the rationale continues to evolve even to this day. Can you imagine if Colin Powell had gone to the U.N. talking about "daisy chains" and "blistering agents"? I'll be the first to admit that I'm no military pro, but that's not needed to find potential flaws in logic.

 

[Jones]

You guys keep the questions coming to AV.... he is the real deal. Sometimes books and magazine articles can make you think you are an intellectual.... but keep an open mind. Keep your pre conceived notions aside and you may learn something

That cuts both ways. Just sayin....

I do not doubt Av being the real deal. I am wondering why, if everything he is saying is true, the Sean Hannity's of the air waves weren't shoving that story every 2 minutes. Think about it. "Blistering agent"? Hell, that could be sulfuric acid. There isn't a high school chem lab in U.S. that doesn't stock "blistering agents". And what about the "daisy chaining" of conventional weapons? If that's WMD, then there is no country on the planet that would withstand the WMD rationale for invasion. It seems to me that the rationale continues to evolve even to this day. Can you imagine if Colin Powell had gone to the U.N. talking about "daisy chains" and "blistering agents"? I'll be the first to admit that I'm no military pro, but that's not needed to find potential flaws in logic.

In this context "blister agent" almost always refers to some variant of mustard gas. One thing I give the Bush administration (and Bush in particular) credit for is that they haven't engaged in a lot of after the fact justification and shifting of definitions on the WMD issue. Bush and Cheney have both been pretty straightforward about admitting they were wrong in their assumptions.

 

[bbsam]

That cuts both ways. Just sayin....


In this context "blister agent" almost always refers to some variant of mustard gas. One thing I give the Bush administration (and Bush in particular) credit for is that they haven't engaged in a lot of after the fact justification and shifting of definitions on the WMD issue. Bush and Cheney have both been pretty straightforward about admitting they were wrong in their assumptions.

And that's why I question (in fact I am intrigued) at the continued insistance that WMD was indeed prevalant int Iraq. And let's be honest about it. Bush took a good long time to come to that conclusion.

 

[av8torntn]

I do not doubt Av being the real deal. I am wondering why, if everything he is saying is true, the Sean Hannity's of the air waves weren't shoving that story every 2 minutes. Think about it. .

Seems they were.

 

[av8torntn]

Think about it. "Blistering agent"? Hell, that could be sulfuric acid. There isn't a high school chem lab in U.S. that doesn't stock "blistering agents". And what about the "daisy chaining" of conventional weapons? If that's WMD, then there is no country on the planet that would withstand the WMD rationale for invasion. It seems to me that the rationale continues to evolve even to this day. Can you imagine if Colin Powell had gone to the U.N. talking about "daisy chains" and "blistering agents"? I'll be the first to admit that I'm no military pro, but that's not needed to find potential flaws in logic.

Well first of all I was responding to honestly the ignorant question you posed of how or why would someone use something like a 155mm arty round(conventional or otherwise) as an IED against a point target. I would assume that even the least knowledgeable person knows that indirect is considered an area fired weapon. For some odd reason you did not question or mock why would someone "waste" a 155mm round on an IED. My guess and it is just a guess that you do not get that but in that regard they are pretty effective. The reason that nobody really takes anyone from the extreme left seriously is because of what you just tried to do by claiming that I said that multiple conventional rounds together would equal WMD's. I never said nor implied anything even remotely similar. That will not slow you down though. There are multiple things that would have to be done correctly to use an IED effectively and you can add multiple more things to the list if you used a chemical round to make your IED. I never claimed that anyone had a cache of chemical weapons and they would use them against specific targets. I honestly never felt like anyone knew exactly what they had or where all the weapons were coming from. It was not uncommon to get flagged down by a civilian who was farming and uncovered buried weapons. There was a fear of getting caught with them by coalition forces. I'm sure your next question is why did we not use technology to find all this. We are the superpower after all.

 

[bbsam]

No. My next question is Wk's. Are you lying or are you calling George Bush a liar?

 

[av8torntn]

No. My next question is Wk's. Are you lying or are you calling George Bush a liar?

Actually I was pointing out what was in the wikileaks. It has always been the goofy leftists like you that called Bush the liar.

 

[tourists24]

Actually I was pointing out what was in the wikileaks. It has always been the goofy leftists like you that called Bush the liar.

cmon now AV,,, we all know that everything was Bush's fault,,,, he lied lied lied... EVERYONE else knew the truth but Bush forced his will on everyone like the dictator he was

 

[Lue C Fur]

I thought Bush went into Iraq just for Oil...

 

[Jones]

cmon now AV,,, we all know that everything was Bush's fault,,,, he lied lied lied... EVERYONE else knew the truth but Bush forced his will on everyone like the dictator he was

I don't think Bush consciously lied, but I do think he allowed himself to be convinced of something that he was predisposed to believe anyway. I don't think he was very well served by some of his advisers, particularly guys like Tenet and Wolfowitz. Like I said before, it's a credit to him that he has admitted he was wrong, and I think that's because at the end of the day he's basically an honest guy and honest guys admit their mistakes.

 

[av8torntn]

No. My next question is Wk's. Are you lying or are you calling George Bush a liar?

Funny first you tried to claim that I said conventional weapons were WMD's then it was why did the talking heads not mention it which they did now you go to the old mindless fall back of Bush lied people died. All of this because wikileaks brings the WMD finds in Iraq back into the news.

 

[bbsam]

I thought Bush went into Iraq just for Oil...

Now, I must step away from my "lefty ways" and say quite frankly, I'm all for that. Secure the oil fields, drill and transport. I'm fine with that.