husband terminated...advice please.

[Mugarolla]

You have to remember though in this circumstance dish network is our customer, not the consignee. Dish ships the boxes and issues and pays for call tags. Those are usually RS3. They pay for 3 attempts. Not 2 and a I don't feel like it.

It goes beyond that.

UPS is drawing the line in the sand.

Amazon caught them cheating on NDA's. The whole reason for the RDR fiasco.

They just paid $25M to settle another problem.

Whether it is a call tag, NDA, ground package, DFU, etc., it does not matter. They are not going to issue less severe discipline, anymore, just because it was a call tag.

In the past, yes, they have. But this recording a package, or whatever it is, nowhere near the delivery point, is continuing.

I have said before, this may have been the first time this guy did it, but it is the millionth time a driver has done it and UPS has paid dearly for this.

They are going to put a stop to it, one way or another.

If we see that this is a dischargeable offense, and we don't get our job back, it will stop.

There is no defense for this except to admit to being stupid and begging for forgiveness.

If all else fails, sheet the damn thing as missed and take the heat for that. That is not a dischargeable offense. That is a warning letter at most.

 

[DOK]

It goes beyond that.

UPS is drawing the line in the sand.

Amazon caught them cheating on NDA's. The whole reason for the RDR fiasco.

They just paid $25M to settle another problem.

Whether it is a call tag, NDA, ground package, DFU, etc., it does not matter. They are not going to issue less severe discipline, anymore, just because it was a call tag.

In the past, yes, they have. But this recording a package, or whatever it is, nowhere near the delivery point, is continuing.

I have said before, this may have been the first time this guy did it, but it is the millionth time a driver has done it and UPS has paid dearly for this.

They are going to put a stop to it, one way or another.

If we see that this is a dischargeable offense, and we don't get our job back, it will stop.

There is no defense for this except to admit to being stupid and begging for forgiveness.

If all else fails, sheet the damn thing as missed and take the heat for that. That is not a dischargeable offense. That is a warning letter at most.

That being said, where does the language of "employee cannot be terminated due to info gathered by technology" or however it is worded? Do we just all blindly go along with the theory that this technology is accurate?

 

[Billy Ray]

Hate to see someone fired for a package that might not even existed, ie. customer has no idea what you're talking about when you show up with call tag.

That's when you cancel the tag; but.....

you still have to drive to the address to know that you can cancel the tag.

 

[I Am Jacks Damaged Box]

New reality show UPS Repo?

Fired Again?: UPS Edition would make for a ton of episodes.

 

[MrBrown]

I agree with others theres other stuff going on. If hubby was an asset to the management team a little booboo like that wouldnt make for a big deal. Last peak I had an especially crappy day, horrible load way over dispatched got stuck in someones driveway etc... I told management early that I would need help and probably wouldnt make it back to the building b4 830. They never sent me help and I got called off the road at 830 with like 10 to 15 stops left. I didnt sheet any of them punched out and left. I did get a warning letter but that was it. Its like a dfu, if i forget about one and realize it later im not going back to service it. They never say squat. Now if management didnt like me and my performance things would pan out differently. Maybe its just my center but I find if you play nice they tend to as well

 

[MrBrown]

Fired Again?: UPS Edition would make for a ton of episodes.

I found myself staring at the nip in your avatar then it dawned on me that its meatloaf

 

[Mugarolla]

I agree with others theres other stuff going on. If hubby was an asset to the management team a little booboo like that wouldnt make for a big deal. Last peak I had an especially crappy day, horrible load way over dispatched got stuck in someones driveway etc... I told management early that I would need help and probably wouldnt make it back to the building b4 830. They never sent me help and I got called off the road at 830 with like 10 to 15 stops left. I didnt sheet any of them punched out and left. I did get a warning letter but that was it. Its like a dfu, if i forget about one and realize it later im not going back to service it. They never say squat. Now if management didnt like me and my performance things would pan out differently. Maybe its just my center but I find if you play nice they tend to as well

For what you did, that is all that UPS could do. A warning letter.

Should not have even got a warning letter. UPS told you to come in. I assume they gave you a warning letter for not recording the packages as missed. You just came back and clocked out.

This other guy recorded a call tag as NI1 nowhere near the house. If he just brought it back or recorded it as missed, the most they could have done was a warning letter.

 

[Mugarolla]

That being said, where does the language of "employee cannot be terminated due to info gathered by technology" or however it is worded? Do we just all blindly go along with the theory that this technology is accurate?

You're referring to Article 6 Section 6 of the NMUPSA

Section 6. Technology and Discipline

No employee shall be discharged if such discharge is based solely
upon information received from GPS or any successor system
unless he/she engages in dishonesty (defined for the purposes
of this paragraph as any intentional act or omission by an
employee where he/she intends to defraud the Company). The
Company must confirm by direct observation or other corroborating
evidence any other violations warranting discharge. The
degree of discipline dealing with off-area offenses shall not be
changed because of the use of GPS.

What he did was not only dishonest, it was also defrauding the company in terms of the legal definition of defraud.

I would have to guess that they also asked him about this and he probably admitted to doing it before he was discharged.

One reason why a Steward should always be present.

Defraud

To make a Misrepresentation of an existing material fact, knowing it to be false or making it recklessly without regard to whether it is true or false, intending for someone to rely on the misrepresentation and under circumstances in which such person does rely on it to his or her damage. To practice Fraud; to cheat or trick. To deprive a person of property or any interest, estate, or right by fraud, deceit, or artifice.

Intent to defraud means an intention to deceive another person, and to induce such other person, in reliance upon such deception, to assume, create, transfer, alter, or terminate a right, obligation, or power with reference to property.

 

[browned out]

UPS must not like that driver. Maybe he runs over allowed a lot. Or maybe he made a safety complaint or a complaint to HR about his management team.

Many in UPS management are very dirty, lack integrity, are retaliatory, and are dishonest.

UPS lets their "most best" drivers get away with much more serious infractions.

If he does not get his job back, he should go outside the Teamsters/UPS panel and file a lawsuit. And ask for all records of all call tags not serviced or sheeted off area from his center for the past year. Why was he discharged while others in his center who committed the same infraction receive no discipline?

He did not follow proper procedure but should not have been discharged past the local level. Warning letter or suspension is just.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

You want the OP to file a lawsuit against the company based on his being terminated for failure to follow established work methods?

 

[trickpony1]

You want the OP to file a lawsuit against the company based on his being terminated for failure to follow established work methods?

If he does not get his job back, he should go outside the Teamsters/UPS panel and file a lawsuit. And ask for all records of all call tags not serviced or sheeted off area from his center for the past year. Why was he discharged while others in his center who committed the same infraction receive no discipline?

Try to keep up Dave.

 

[Orion inc.]

You want the OP to file a lawsuit against the company based on his being terminated for failure to follow established work methods?

Why not? What he did was wrong but the progression of discipline wasn't followed by ups. The punishment didn't fit the crime if he has a clean record and this was his first write up. There must be more to the story if ups was willing to go to panel and waste time, money and resources pushing it to that level over a first offense.

All the variables aren't known I'm guessing. There is more than what is being told here.

 

[IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U]

Why not? What he did was wrong but the progression of discipline wasn't followed by ups. The punishment didn't fit the crime if he has a clean record and this was his first write up. There must be more to the story if ups was willing to go to panel and waste time, money and resources pushing it to that level over a first offense.

All the variables aren't known I'm guessing. There is more than what is being told here.

Probably his numbers aren't the best. That's who them they like to go after.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Exactly-----no way he was fired just for sheeting two call tags while not at the address(es).

 

[trickpony1]

Probably his numbers aren't the best. That's who them they like to go after.

I'd like to read the transcript of the panel hearing.

Will his "bad numbers" even be brought up if he was explicitly fired for the call tag incident?

"oh....and while we're here, his numbers weren't good either".......

 

[IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U]

I'd like to read the transcript of the panel hearing.

Will his "bad numbers" even be brought up if he was explicitly fired for the call tag incident?

"oh....and while we're here, his numbers weren't good either".......

They love to pull that crap. Just about everyone I knew that went to the Panel, production was the real reason.

 

[Faceplanted]

We had a driver in our center who got fired for sheeting a package when not at the stop. Turns out it was a Friday, the driver is aware of the dr office hours and the posted hours were closed for Friday. He got terminated, stayed out for months, didn't take any deals and ended up getting back pay

He had a huge target in his back after that. He dida record drive del for a nda and I'm sure our center manager did a virtual ojs on him every day. He got fired and was out for months with no back pay. Me and a few drivers happened to hear our center manager talk to a senior ass kisser driver for doing a record drive record on a nda, all he got was a don't do it again. Needless to say we notified the driver who has been targeted, he called corporate, got an attorney ect. our terrible center manager got moved to a hub in the middle of no where

Moral is, if you are on their list, weather or be because u stand up for your self, don't kiss ass, ect be ready to get fired for absolutely no reason. I would bet if the driver who this thread was about could dig into the reports he would find plenty of drivers who have done the same and just got talked to while he is sitting at home not getting paid. Do everything by the boo, missed is missed, late is late, Cover your ass!!!! Life at ups

 

[OLDMAN3]

A lot of you guys think the driver must have been doing other things wrong, or was a slacker.
Sometimes that thinking is correct... when you have a case like this where an employee receives excessive discipline.

But sometimes it is UPS making an example out of someone.

Sometimes it is a case of the company and the union feuding and a driver is caught in the middle. Or the company using the employee's job as a bargaining chip for another purpose.

Sometimes there are too many drivers on the payroll and anyone doing anything remotely dishonest will be fired.

Sometimes the District or Division manager is on a power trip.

We have all seen discipline used to pressure production. But it is not always the reason for discipline.

In all cases the best response by the driver is not to go faster, but to do the job as perfectly as possible.

 

[Browntown2014]

You want the OP to file a lawsuit against the company based on his being terminated for failure to follow established work methods?

Lol. You are too much.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

A lot of you guys think the driver must have been doing other things wrong, or was a slacker.
Sometimes that thinking is correct... when you have a case like this where an employee receives excessive discipline.

But sometimes it is UPS making an example out of someone.

Sometimes it is a case of the company and the union feuding and a driver is caught in the middle. Or the company using the employee's job as a bargaining chip for another purpose.

Sometimes there are too many drivers on the payroll and anyone doing anything remotely dishonest will be fired.

Sometimes the District or Division manager is on a power trip.

We have all seen discipline used to pressure production. But it is not always the reason for discipline.

In all cases the best response by the driver is not to go faster, but to do the job as perfectly as possible.

Your post makes some astute realizations.... except for one.

Or the company using the employee's job as a bargaining chip for another purpose.

Can you clarify that ?

Just curious, about what you mean.


I don't want to jump to conclusions.


Thanks.



-Bug-