"It's too easy to fire drivers using computers!!!"

Discussion in 'The Archives' started by mrdiad, Oct 25, 2003.

  1. mrdiad

    mrdiad Guest

    My Center Manager calls me in his office almost every morning lately. About the 4th time he screamed Do you know where Im from!?, Do you know where Im from!? He said Im from up north where unions are strong! I was the guy they sent in to fire drivers! I could fire anyone! I could fire anyone using computers! Its too easy! Its too easy! Its all too easy to fire drivers using computers!
    What does he mean?
     
  2. local804

    local804 Guest

    Maybe he is talking about the sparks program.It puts up red flags when drivers have no activity in their diads for 15 minute intervals at a time.He cant use the diad reports to fire you, but maybe he will hop in his car and video tape you hanging out at a stop for a long time.Then, maybe he will use the stealing company time charge against you.If he isnt talking about the diad, I have no clue what he is talking about.If you do your job, you wont have any problems.MAybe Tie or some of the other suits have a better idea where this guy is coming from.If he was yelling that stuff to me, I would have asked him what are you talking about?, I do not understand...Why didnt you????????????
     
  3. tieguy

    tieguy Guest

    What specifically was he talking to you about?
     
  4. mrdiad

    mrdiad Guest

    His intimidation tactic of yelling is old and ineffective. It's amusing really.
    But the computer thing I don't get. I assume he will alter the digital information. There's no way to know if he does. He once added a package to my customers signature 2 days later because he said I forgot to scan it. I told him that was forgery.
    A past manager ordered me to miss packages to be off the clock in 9.5 hours. I recorded 60 missed but the morning report only showed 30. I confronted him and he admitted changing the digital information because he didn't want to get yelled at by his boss.
    Drivers have no way to know if their records have been altered. No fingerprints or eraser marks are left. They dont have to match ink color or handwriting. Management can change everything:
    Punch in/out times
    Packages
    Addresses
    Delivery Times
    CODs
    Mileage
    Commercial/Residential
    Duplicate stops
    Time study data
    And since it's all so editable, how can they hold drivers liable for the info in it? Has anyone else had situations where supervisors changed their DIAD information?
     
  5. tieguy

    tieguy Guest

    I suppose a good question to ask this northern genius is whether he was successfull up north by yelling and screaming and not listening.

    I don't in any way condone this guy and his intimidation tactics. I do try to understand why someone will act the way they do. I imagine he may have done a good job where he was at which is why he was relocated your way. Was he promoted when he was moved or is a promotion hinging on success in his current assignment? If so then he is probably feeling a lot of pressure to get results. He is probably also feeling a lot of pressure from having rotated into a strange new part of UPS where he knows everyone is looking at him and trying to judge why he got the assignment. This type of pressure will cause some to act in ways that is out of character for them. Its a shame because he loses whatever got him this far in the first place.Again not making excuses just trying to understand why the guy is acting the way he is.
     
  6. sertsg

    sertsg Guest

    It is true that some data can be changed. Each change is logged and recorded by user. I have seen two CTR managers fired and several supervisors fired for this. In a different state, numerous center teams were fired after an audit by LP. Our district has a proactive auditing procedure that looks at the data changes without the centers ever knowing they are being audited.
     
  7. local804

    local804 Guest

    We all have seen what can happen to them when they fudge the numbers. Mrdiad,if your mgr is playing the numbers game, he will get caught sooner than later.It really is way too easy for them to change the number to their advantage but I am sure, it is only a few out of the thousand supervisors out there.They have change the diad so the drivers couldnt edit any packages,now maybe they should do it for the suits.Two of the LP supervisors used to work in operations in the UPS hub.I think that is a major conflict of interest but who am I to say.Thats just like having the police to police themselves.
     
  8. tieguy

    tieguy Guest

    I think your completely missing the point. The manager is telling diad he can catch the driver with technology not that he is going to fudge the drivers numbers. Mr. Diad has been strangely quiet. What was the manager calling you in the office for specifically?
     
  9. rushfan

    rushfan Guest

    So does the computer count how long it takes to collect cod's. In the real world, not the ups world, it takes atleast 3-4 minutes to collect a cod. Also, how about those wonderful people who move through ups and it takes 30 minutes to cart 30 boxes up 4 flights of stairs. Does Mr. Diad take that into account.
     
  10. tieguy

    tieguy Guest

    Absolutely. It counts the number of footsteps, Measures Leg strength in footpounds per step required to haul them up 4 flights, measures elevation and how long it takes your eyes to focus in a dark hall way. It can also detect whether the customer is taking a dump when you knock. Our precise time measurement standards have determined that an average customer can wipe 5 times, pull their pants up, buckle the belt, wash their hands and answer the door in 1.3 seconds which is just enough time for you to knock on the other 3 doors on that level. Best dang measurement system ever.
     
  11. over9five

    over9five Guest

    Do your job.
    Be professional (on the road AND in the center).
    Dont worry about being fired.
     
  12. brownmonster

    brownmonster Guest

    Tie, is the dump time adjusted for geographical areas? Here in Wisconsin we eat so much cheese and get so plugged up that some of my customers are grumpin for 15 minutes. I guess all the quick dumping beer drinkers average it out!!
     
  13. dannyboy

    dannyboy Guest

    Rush,

    WHile quite funny, they really didnt answer your questions. And I am assuming you really want to know.

    IE. That is who decides what amount of time you get for every small detail of your job. They take the average time it takes to finish a certain aspect and that is the time allowance you get for that job. The only thing that changes on a route are the things peculiar to your route. Like the time it takes to go through guard stations, the number of places where you have deliveries up stairs, the number of times you have to catch an elivator, number of stop signs, stop lights, and on and on. These are things that they find out about when they do your timestudy. The basics like time for a COD (more time on a res. cod than a comercial cod), call tag, and the number of packages being delivered, everybody gets the same time allowances for those.

    At one time I knew what the allowances were for most of these. But time changes, and so do things I find interesting.

    BAsicly, If I were a manager, and I wanted to fire someone, I would have no problem doing so.
    And it was just as easy before the diad.

    Main thing is(and has been mentioned several times)just do your job to the best of your ability, and all will be well.

    By the way, the time allowance for the dump varries from sea level to mountain regions. This is due to the gravitational pull, more at sea level and much less here in the mountains. So our allowance is much greater than yours.

    d

    (Message edited by dannyboy on October 29, 2003)
     
  14. tieguy

    tieguy Guest

    LOL. Your right I didn't answer the question directly. I'm sure I would be told the time study averages the type of deliveries that rush described. I can't tell you for sure how much the allowance is or how accurate. I do know that the effort is certainly there to do a very detailed study of the route in the hopes of making it as accurate as possible. I know there will still be unusual circumstances that arise that are not measured or covered in the time study. One thing that is interesting is that future time studies will actually require the I.E. person to work out many of the calculations in long hand instead of using spreadsheets on computers. I think the intent is so the I.E. person can better understand the results and be able to explain them.
     
  15. brownmonster

    brownmonster Guest

    The technology is to the point where they could probably time study every stop. Rather then an average, each stop gets it's own allowance. 155 Main St. is a dock with a 22 step walk to the door, 161 main is around back, 165 is front door, 171 push a cart up an elevator, etc. Now you would have an accurate allowance. Probably could figure in weight and size of packages also. Good for the furniture guys, bad for the paper boys.
     
  16. parttimejon

    parttimejon Guest

    you know if someone was studying my route(and i do cover drive) i'd probably run it slower the following day just for spite. maybe its just me but if i'm not trusted to do a good job on my own then thats when i'll be a slacker like everyone else.
     
  17. dannyboy

    dannyboy Guest

    When doing a time study, the person doing the time study is to walk the whole way with the driver staying on sidewalks, using a brisk walk. They are to count the steps they take and record them. They record the number of times you move your package car, if you use the front or rear door of the package car, if you use the two wheeler, the number of steps you have to go up and down, curbs, ramps you have to haul packages up. The amount of time you have to wait on an elevator, cods, any think that makes your area odd or different than the standard allowances.

    Problem is that some if not most time studies are not done this way.

    The last one I had done was done by a delivery supervisor. She sat in the jump seat all day getting out only at bulk stops. Many times I was totally out of sight. By the time we got back to the building she had screwed it up so bad that I lost well over an hour.

    Within a week they had a guy from IE ride with me. THat is when I saw how they are to do it properly. When all was said and done, I gained about 35 minutes. Many of the things that she did not give me credit for doing, he caught and included. THe other guys in the same dispatch loop had some college kids do theirs. Kids that actually didnt work for UPS and didnt have a clue.

    So time studies are only as good as the person doing them.

    d
     
  18. wornoutupser

    wornoutupser Guest

    In our center in Florida, time studies are not allowed and have not been done in over 9 years.
    I have a run that started in a P6 and now is in a P10.
    MANAGEMENT decides what your SPORH are and it is any number that they want to pick.
    My run started at 12.8 and is now set 17.2.
    I have increased from 160 pkgs and 105 stops a day to 270 pkgs and 130 stops a day.
    Guess who gets 11 hour days and does not care about the phony op report?
    Our op report is changed often from the info that we turn in.This seems to be a common problem.
    Just tonight, I talked to a junior driver that was INSTRUCTED to sheet missed packages after 5:00 to "closed".
    I only WISH that LP would come audit our building!
     
  19. over9five

    over9five Guest

    "Just tonight, I talked to a junior driver that was INSTRUCTED to sheet missed packages after 5:00 to "closed". "

    If thats true, theres a number you can call to report this. Thats dishonest, pure and simple. I dont know the number, but someone will post it. Make an anonymous call with that info and your center number.
     
  20. dannyboy

    dannyboy Guest

    1-800-220-4120

    d