Open enrollment time

[brownIEman]

ups is still making billions of dollars a year profit that's right i said billions. you make that money because of your drivers , preloaders , unloaders and everyother teamster that moves the cardboard. stop whining profits are done thay are everywhere but unlike most other companies ups is still turning a huge profit.comparing ups to gm is so retarded it is not even funny,gm had been going down the tubes for decades because of mismanagement and an inferior product. although the management team at ups is about inept as the management team at gm your teamsters workers bail your worthless rear ends every time.so brownIEman go back to your pocket protector and slide rule and keep screwing up routes.

The ironic thing is that 20 years ago some misguided UAW member probably made an almost exactly parallel rant at a GM management person.

It is my hope that most of your IBT brothers are smart enough to see the writing on the wall and understand that being profitable is not enough. Also for your sake I hope they realize how much of a growing percentage of UPS' profit is being brought in by none IBT contractual work, and why that trend is happening. If so, they will make the smart, and some hard, decisions that will alow them and UPS to continue functioning and providing you with the great job you have.

All the while leaving you free to continue ranting irrationally and ignorantly about how greedy incompetent fat cats are trying to screw you. That is your right, enjoy.

 

[brownIEman]

The 300k is for a top pay Captain so figure what 300 bucks a month is to them. If I make 100k then I would pay 100 bucks a month, now ups wants me to make 75k and pay 400 a month for health care. That aint happening if I have anything to do with it. I had an AOT tell me that she had to drop her son due to her pay would be 0 if she covered him, I dont see her check stub but I have heard from others that AOT, admins etc etc have had a change in coverage from who they can use, how much deductable they have per year.

Just to preface, this may sound a tad harsh, for that I apologize. airbusfxr, I really know little about your current struggle, but I have tremendous respect for the job you and your brothers do keeping our air fleet running.

However,

IMHO, you are out of touch with current trends in this country, and if these current negotiations result in a strike you are in for a rude awakening, as are the IBT brothers who will undoubtedly and rightly support you.

In 1997 the IBT PR department brilliantly framed UPS as an evil greedy corporation screwing poor folks who just wanted to make a decent wage. They troted out single mom's who wanted full time work but evil UPS kept them in part time low paying jobs (never mind that is the way the work is organized). All this played well with the American public and the IBT by and large won their support.

If this goes into a strike, and you go into an interview with media and say "now ups wants me to make 75k and pay 400 a month for health care" with a tear in your eye, I would bet dollars to donoughts you will get a much different reaction. There are tons of folks out there working jobs just as challenging as yours making 50K and paying more like $600 a month for their own coverage, or going without. They will, I bet, grant you little sympathy.

 

[jimstud]

The ironic thing is that 20 years ago some misguided UAW member probably made an almost exactly parallel rant at a GM management person.

It is my hope that most of your IBT brothers are smart enough to see the writing on the wall and understand that being profitable is not enough. Also for your sake I hope they realize how much of a growing percentage of UPS' profit is being brought in by none IBT contractual work, and why that trend is happening. If so, they will make the smart, and some hard, decisions that will alow them and UPS to continue functioning and providing you with the great job you have.

All the while leaving you free to continue ranting irrationally and ignorantly about how greedy incompetent fat cats are trying to screw you. That is your right, enjoy.

you are so right the poor slob working the line at gm making 50,000 a year screwed it up.and you are right again the money the teamsters bring in every year is nothing. what do you suits contribute , nothing but mismanagement. you ie knuckleheads are the worst of all so again go back to your pocket protector and slide rule and come see me when you've been with brown over 22 years like i have and seen the waste by management that i have maybe we'll talk. so go on your next rant on how the teamsters are pushing ups into bankruptcy.

 

[DorkHead]

I am confused--I always thought it was UPS' contribution to Health and Welfare that was negotiated during contract talks, not the specific insurance carrier.

Our insurance is administered by the NYS Teamsters and is with BC/BS of Central New York. We just received new ID cards because the Teamsters has given permission to BC/BS to have us pay a $10 co pay for office visits and $100 co pay for ER visits.

Dave, you are correct on the negotiated contributions. I too, received the new cards today with the co-pay. But the Teamsters pick the ins. carrier with the best plan they can buy

 

[brownone]

you are so right the poor slob working the line at gm making 50,000 a year screwed it up.and you are right again the money the teamsters bring in every year is nothing. what do you suits contribute , nothing but mismanagement. you ie knuckleheads are the worst of all so again go back to your pocket protector and slide rule and come see me when you've been with brown over 22 years like i have and seen the waste by management that i have maybe we'll talk. so go on your next rant on how the teamsters are pushing ups into bankruptcy.

Should a Teamster ever have to pay for his or her benefits and before you answer I am fully aware of the current contract. I will add that 90% of your managment teams in operations used to be a Teamster at one point in their UPS career. Were they knuckle heads then as well? When I was a driver I delivered to GM. Many a day I had to wait 15 to 20 minutes because the person who could sign for packages was on break and the 10 other folks standing around could not do his job. Sad that that they would hire folks who could not write. Took my management team getting involved to get it fixed.

 

[brownIEman]

you are so right the poor slob working the line at gm making 50,000 a year screwed it up.and you are right again the money the teamsters bring in every year is nothing. what do you suits contribute , nothing but mismanagement. you ie knuckleheads are the worst of all so again go back to your pocket protector and slide rule and come see me when you've been with brown over 22 years like i have and seen the waste by management that i have maybe we'll talk. so go on your next rant on how the teamsters are pushing ups into bankruptcy.

No, I am so wrong. The poor slob working the line at GM making 50K did not screw it up. Well, I would be so wrong, if that is what I said. But it is not.

It was stupid management at GM that allowed themselves to agree to outrageous labor agreements that were simply unsustainable. Provisions such as paying salaries for workers who were laid off. So to use your misinterpretation of my remarks, it would be like saying it is not the guy working the line for 50K, it is the guy getting 50K for sitting on the couch watching soaps and eating cheetos. Although again, it is not even that person who screwed things up, he is a symptom.

GM made some other really bad decisions, but their labor agreements is where we have the greatest lesson for the UPS experience. For us, the labor agreements have even more bearing, as in our business labor is an even higher percentage of costs than it is at GM or other manufacturing companies.

As I have said, our labor costs are greater than any of our competitors. Our market share has dwindled from around 80% or so to less than 50. We have remained profitable, if not very competitive, by hounding our workers to make sure we get more production out of them than any of our competitors. What I ask, is how long can that continue? And if our market share gets to 0%, how many good paying teamster jobs will we be providing?

Yes, we are making a profit. And yes, it is due to the incredible job service providers such as yourself do. But our market share is going south, as is our profit. As I have said, hopefully in 2012 the IBT will see the writing on the wall and understand where the lower profit, smaller market share road takes us all. My fear is that if your mentality is prevalent, they will not until UPS has 2 or 3 losing quarters, and by then it may be too late.

So, I guess I will plan to come see you in about 5 years, I'll buy the first round. Believe me, I have seen a ton of management waste in my mere 17 years, especially being in management. That is something to be ever vigilant over as well, I will certainly not try to insult your intelligence by claiming otherwise.

 

[JimJimmyJames]

The ironic thing is that 20 years ago some misguided UAW member probably made an almost exactly parallel rant at a GM management person.

It is my hope that most of your IBT brothers are smart enough to see the writing on the wall and understand that being profitable is not enough. Also for your sake I hope they realize how much of a growing percentage of UPS' profit is being brought in by none IBT contractual work, and why that trend is happening. If so, they will make the smart, and some hard, decisions that will alow them and UPS to continue functioning and providing you with the great job you have.

All the while leaving you free to continue ranting irrationally and ignorantly about how greedy incompetent fat cats are trying to screw you. That is your right, enjoy.

I was doing a pick up today, as usual picking up Chinese made trinkets from a warehouse staffed with immigrants with questionable legal status. While I waited I was reading their (well, that which was printed bilingually) bulletin board and I noticed that the company I was picking up from didn't actually employee "their" workers. A separate company was contracted to supply all of the labor (probably partially as a shield to protect themselves from hiring illegals. They want to hire them, but they don't want it to show up on their direct payroll). Also, the company did not own the building, they leased it. So they have no employees, no building, and they make nothing. They really just own the company name.

Sadly, I doubt many of their employees can afford to own the products they shuffle around.

Why do I mention this? Because of the second to last line in your post that I have quoted. You are right in your sarcasm about the "fat cats" being incompetent. They are very competent. Unfortuantely they are very competent at being what you dismiss as being falsely greedy.

Greed has driven corporations to the point that the only way for them to compete against each other is to treat their own employees as the enemy. And now, thanks to the highly questionable practices of FedEx Ground, UPS has declared war on it's employees.

I am just trying to figure out who is going to buy Henry Ford's cars one day. (Historical note: Henry Ford wisely deduced that if he didn't pay his employees a living wage they would not be able to buy his products)

As an aside, brownIEman, I appreciate your honesty in your posts, especially about production. The company is quite obviously going to push us to the brink of what is humane in order to achieve production.
I wish more management would tell it like it is instead of peeing on our heads and telling us it's raining.

 

[feederdriver06]

I just opened my letter the other day and was dismayed to learn that the company is changing my PPO with Blue Cross/ Blue Shield to a POS plan with Aetna.

For anyone who has ever dealt with Aetna, they are everything that is wrong with managed healthcare today .

I talked to my steward and he says the company has the right to this. This should be addressed in the next contract.

Yup driver . . . I share your pain. The BC/BS of Illinois plan that I've had since 1998 has been great. Although I've had billing issues that took many phone calls to straighten out , the coverage has been excellent. I don't know what to think about Aetna POS. Our benefit levels are supposed to be the same with the Aetna plan as with the BC/BS. Years ago before the BC/BS plan we had an Aetna plan that wasn't POS . That was a good plan but why am I getting the feeling that we are having our coverage "cheapened"? Wouldn't a POS plan that has defined copays be a violation of the contract because I currently pay a percentage and not a defined copay? Our benefits were supposed to be unchanged with this contract. Changing from one company to another would be legal as long as the benefits stay the same. If the benefits are not the same after the switch this should be a violation of the contract. For me, my medical benefits are priority one when it comes to contract negotiations. Its what I examine first. If its funky its an automatic NO vote. Wages and pension is all secondary. The next contract may not go as smooth as this one did. I will be ready to strike over this most def.

 

[JimJimmyJames]

Before I went into the BC/BS PPO plan a few years backs I also had Aetna under the old traditional type plan. One of the reasons I left that plan was because of Aetna!

I think we are getting cheated here because my wife says there is definitely a difference between a PPO plan and a POS plan. She should know because she works as a supervisor in an emergency room and she deals with insurance companies all the time.

I lot of my current doctors do not take Aetna. Why? Because Aetna hates to pay.

I agree on the next contract, benefits come first. Then our pension and last our wages. I would forgo raises in order to save our benefits and pension.

P.S. I never vote yes on a contract .

 

[Just Numbers]

you are so right the poor slob working the line at gm making 50,000 a year screwed it up.and you are right again the money the teamsters bring in every year is nothing. what do you suits contribute , nothing but mismanagement. you ie knuckleheads are the worst of all so again go back to your pocket protector and slide rule and come see me when you've been with brown over 22 years like i have and seen the waste by management that i have maybe we'll talk. so go on your next rant on how the teamsters are pushing ups into bankruptcy.

The more I read your posts...I wonder how much you have learned in your 22 yrs. Give it another ten and you may mature. Always us vs. them or...them vs. us. Never a we included. Maybe the only management waste in the last 22yrs has been your employment. Have you ever had something positive to say on bc?

 

[jimstud]

The more I read your posts...I wonder how much you have learned in your 22 yrs. Give it another ten and you may mature. Always us vs. them or...them vs. us. Never a we included. Maybe the only management waste in the last 22yrs has been your employment. Have you ever had something positive to say on bc?

not when it has to do with ups supervision

 

[worried123]

Yup driver . . . I share your pain. The BC/BS of Illinois plan that I've had since 1998 has been great. Although I've had billing issues that took many phone calls to straighten out , the coverage has been excellent. I don't know what to think about Aetna POS. Our benefit levels are supposed to be the same with the Aetna plan as with the BC/BS. Years ago before the BC/BS plan we had an Aetna plan that wasn't POS . That was a good plan but why am I getting the feeling that we are having our coverage "cheapened"? Wouldn't a POS plan that has defined copays be a violation of the contract because I currently pay a percentage and not a defined copay? Our benefits were supposed to be unchanged with this contract. Changing from one company to another would be legal as long as the benefits stay the same. If the benefits are not the same after the switch this should be a violation of the contract. For me, my medical benefits are priority one when it comes to contract negotiations. Its what I examine first. If its funky its an automatic NO vote. Wages and pension is all secondary. The next contract may not go as smooth as this one did. I will be ready to strike over this most def.

I am very concerned about the fine print. We will not enroll in this plan. It states on some papers we got from the company is that once you enroll in this new planTHERE IS NO GOING BACK to what you currently have and my hunch is that UPS probably can change the terms of the plan yearly...whenever they want because it is not a union negotiated benefit plan. Once one of the hr persons said "all ups has to do is provide benefits" that statement is a was a red flag.

With what we have UPS has to provide the benefits that were negotiated under the contract. But like I said today a hr rep said "all we have to do is provide benefits" ....Once you enroll in this they can do whatever they want.


So once you enroll in this plan there is probably fine print or a discretionary clause that allow them to change the plan (raise co pays, deny coverage) for many things.

See we have aetna and they want us to switch to this "new aetna" plan. Now there are co pays when we never had them before.

I am concerned that this is essentially a "vote" to null and void our national contract.

We are going to our Teamster hall this week. There is no info coming from of our Union hall or reps.

 

[kumet]

I got my open enrollment letter and figured that if I didn't want to change anything I didn't need to do anything.I'm retired living in So. Cal. I understand that I will now be with Blue Cross. I Have no idea of any other details.After many calls to UPS retiree benefits, aetna and blue cross I guess no one does. I can't get the same story twice. I am no longer able to log on to UPSers.com. Open enrollment is overso I guess I don't have options.

 

[ol'browneye]

My son is in college and he got a letter from UPS about Cobra coverage yesterday. If he wants to continue Cobra coverage after he gets out, the Core (Medical, prescription, MH/SA) will cost him $101,999.99/month. If he wants to add Dental and vision to that, it jumps up to $1,121,999.98/month!

I kid you not. That is what the letter says!

 

[Brown_Eyed_Girl]

My 19 year old daughter received that COBRA letter as well. Answers my question though I guess......even though she lives with me but is not in college right now, no more coverage.

 

[Cezanne]

My son is in college and he got a letter from UPS about Cobra coverage yesterday. If he wants to continue Cobra coverage after he gets out, the Core (Medical, prescription, MH/SA) will cost him $101,999.99/month. If he wants to add Dental and vision to that, it jumps up to $1,121,999.98/month!

I kid you not. That is what the letter says!

It has to be a misprint. Did you get a clarification on those totals yet?

 

[ol'browneye]

It has to be a misprint. Did you get a clarification on those totals yet?

No, I just sent them a check!