What is L.P. thinking?
- Thread starter 705red
- Start date
705red
Browncafe Steward
Another post filled with genuine insight and informative information. How did we ever manage to get by before you joined this site?
Tie is a big boy and will eventually answer the question.
Why not leave real issues to those that are willing to discuss them and go back to watching your cartoon reruns!
tieguy
Banned
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
red
i know tie enough to know he does not, nor would he condone or support any hourly employees or management under his comand to falsify records of any kind. time, mileage, hours of service, etc. he and some of the others here would fire anyone that even hinted at the thought of falsifying records of any kind.
but the fact remains, it is done every day. in many areas of the company. so i know what you are getting at.
thing is, tie will remain in his position on this matter, regardless of what we post.
i agree, thing ought to die until the trial. after that we can argue the finer aspects of the case.
maybe it would go better over a taco and beer?
d
i know tie enough to know he does not, nor would he condone or support any hourly employees or management under his comand to falsify records of any kind. time, mileage, hours of service, etc. he and some of the others here would fire anyone that even hinted at the thought of falsifying records of any kind.
but the fact remains, it is done every day. in many areas of the company. so i know what you are getting at.
thing is, tie will remain in his position on this matter, regardless of what we post.
i agree, thing ought to die until the trial. after that we can argue the finer aspects of the case.
maybe it would go better over a taco and beer?
d
stevetheupsguy
sʇǝʌǝʇɥǝndsƃnʎ
I agree, Beer and Taco's. I ain't rich, but I'm buying if you all just shut up!!!........LOL
Please tel that story
So the locked explanation:
We have two phone networks in our country at this point in time, CDMA (Verizon and some Sprint networks still, the takeover of Nextel has skewed this slightly) and GSM (AT&T, T-Mobile, Sun-Com, All-Tel, most of the Mom and Pop Carriers).
Keep in mind the rest of the world is on GSM for the most part.
Verizon and Sprint Phones can generally only be used on those networks
Any of the GSM carriers have SIM Cards in them, that track the charges, instead of something pre-programmed.
To keep people from swapping out chips left and right and to be able to continue to charge high costs and get people to commit to long contracts, each phone carrier "locks" the phone to their network.
If I have an AT&T Phone, I can swap my sim card out in your AT&T Phone without any problem. If you have a T-Mobile Phone, I can't just change sim cards. The phone has to be unlocked first, which is basically a hack. You can download the kits from eBay for $10-$30 depending on the phone.
You can buy an unlocked phone direct from the manufacturer, but it's going to cost you $100-$200 more (in some cases $300).
So I probably confused everybody more with my explanation, if so just google it and hopefully you'll stumble across something.
We have two phone networks in our country at this point in time, CDMA (Verizon and some Sprint networks still, the takeover of Nextel has skewed this slightly) and GSM (AT&T, T-Mobile, Sun-Com, All-Tel, most of the Mom and Pop Carriers).
Keep in mind the rest of the world is on GSM for the most part.
Verizon and Sprint Phones can generally only be used on those networks
Any of the GSM carriers have SIM Cards in them, that track the charges, instead of something pre-programmed.
To keep people from swapping out chips left and right and to be able to continue to charge high costs and get people to commit to long contracts, each phone carrier "locks" the phone to their network.
If I have an AT&T Phone, I can swap my sim card out in your AT&T Phone without any problem. If you have a T-Mobile Phone, I can't just change sim cards. The phone has to be unlocked first, which is basically a hack. You can download the kits from eBay for $10-$30 depending on the phone.
You can buy an unlocked phone direct from the manufacturer, but it's going to cost you $100-$200 more (in some cases $300).
So I probably confused everybody more with my explanation, if so just google it and hopefully you'll stumble across something.
satellitedriver
Moderator
dilligaf
IN VINO VERITAS
Daniel, Thank God our judicial system is based on fact and not supposition. If this guy went to trial based on Tie's 'judicial' system he would be drawn and quartered and sent to the gallows. Unfortunately for those of us that work for UPS, we are subjected to 'guilty until proven innocent' on a daily basis. I, too, look forward to seeing how this is going to turn out.
tieguy
Banned
and now the gentle turn to questioning my integrity.
Red ,
I think I answered your question. I should not have to in this thread under this context. its a shame the question of my integrity should come up at all in order for you to defend a thief. I've made quite a few posts here where I've tried to keep the conversation on subject though there were attempts to pull it off on tangents. Along the way I have given you your dues for defending the guy. Your thanks is to now try to question my integrity.
Danny thanks for the vote of confidence.
The fact is that theft is rampant at UPS. The reason it so is because the cards are stacked against ups. Someone getting caught red handed is not enough to get them fired. Instead UPS has to have overwhelming proof that the guy had dishonest intent.
The police often refuse to get involved in the prosecution of theft unless it is a felony theft and the evidence is solid. DA's tend to plea bargain anything this small or worse yet nol pros it to save time piddling around with a low grade felony.
So reality is that 1 out of about 20 theft cases of this type ever make it to a courtroom. The ones that do usually do so because some twenty or thirty year upser is willing to stand up and testify against the thief because he understands what the thieves do to our reputation.
Red your questions about me have nothing to do with your thief. I didn't sell him the phone and I didn't help him steal it. This debate should have been left in that context.
tieguy
Banned
Dilli,
drawing and quartering would be a refreshing change from the slap on the wrist they currently get. Since you're so sympathic to thieves why not take all your valuables and hang out at the worst street corner in your town. Put a sign up begging to be robbed. Then let us know how much you enjoyed your experience. Don't forget to add the bleeding heart sob story of how the robber had a rough childhood or was the victim of some over zealous police officer. that one always gets some tears.
stevetheupsguy
sʇǝʌǝʇɥǝndsƃnʎ
You could not afford my beer tab.
Of course I only meant the, first round.
I'm getting the feeling that tie has been robbed of something. He's really going to town on this thread. BTW, I just saw an add on Yahoo for a blackberry. $99 with whatever contract they're offering, after a $100 mail in rebate.
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
tie my friend
you are confusing two different issues
ups has not shown intent. they did not charge him with intent. they charged him with theft. and all your arguments to the contrary all mention that you understand he did not steal the phone, he only bought the phone. you insist that he knew the phone was stolen, a group of managers at a hearing disagee.
if ups is trying to prove intent, they better have overwhelming proof. if he stole the phone as charged, then all they need is proof, not overwhelming proof. big differences. not interchangeable.
as for character, out side of a few rough edges that i need to work on, you are pretty much at the top of the managment pile.
Best
d btw, beer in germany is much cheaper. and we still ran up tabs overthere of 3-5000 euro's just about every night
you are confusing two different issues
how can you prove intent? i read where a suspected robber was shot dead in england a while back. they shot him dead because he showed intent as well. he actually did not actually steal anything, but he showed intent.
ups has not shown intent. they did not charge him with intent. they charged him with theft. and all your arguments to the contrary all mention that you understand he did not steal the phone, he only bought the phone. you insist that he knew the phone was stolen, a group of managers at a hearing disagee.
if ups is trying to prove intent, they better have overwhelming proof. if he stole the phone as charged, then all they need is proof, not overwhelming proof. big differences. not interchangeable.
as for character, out side of a few rough edges that i need to work on, you are pretty much at the top of the managment pile.
Best
d btw, beer in germany is much cheaper. and we still ran up tabs overthere of 3-5000 euro's just about every night
dilligaf
IN VINO VERITAS
Tie, I am for from sypathetic towards theives. I have had things stolen out of my pkg car and I would love to catch the grubby little bastard that did it and slap the dog snot out of s/he(By the way, before you jump all over this, it's a figure of speech). But, like everyone else here (well almost everyone), I believe in innocent until proven guilty. This guy has not been proven guilty. I also believe that mgts philosophy is guilty until proven innocent. I also believe that if (and I only say 'if' for the sake of avoiding another argument from you) this guy is found innocent in court (I believe he will be) you will still accuse him of being guilty and getting away with it. You have such a narrow minded opinion us, it's no wonder you are in mgt. I have a question Tie. What came first the egg or the chicken? Did you always have a narrow minded opinion of humanity therefore went naturally into mgt or did you go into mgt an learn that you had that narrow mindedness?
tieguy
Banned
I have personally been involved in removing at least 70 thieves from this company. In that time I have devoted a lot of my personal time as the electronics guy on the weekends setting up little stings for these rodents.
So while you fantasize about getting revenge against some unknown thief i have personally walked the talk and done just what you dream of.
Since i have the least you should be able to do is respect my knowledge and experience in this field. Catch someone with a stolen good and they always claim it was given to them or sold to them.
My extensive experience with these rodents tells me that thieves are some of the best liars around.
Red has his gut in this one because the guy knocked up his wife. My extensive experience tells me there is a good chance the guy was somehow involved in the orginal theft.
Common sense tells you that someone who buys a brand new popular item like a blackberry at a 75 percent discount knew he was buying it hot.
The guy selling it could have easily gotten more for it. Why then did he chose to sell it so cheap to someone he supposedly did not know.
I could shoot holes in this guys story all day long. If you want to welcome him to your house and trust him with your valuables then feel free.
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
tie
you are not the only one that has walked the talk. three out of our building, one that i thought a friend. several more out of atlanta and charlotte and one other unnamed building.
mine were getting the thieves our of our system, not setting up stings.
i also agree and have posted that someone just all of a sudden does not "start" stealing after 20-30 years of being a model employee.
let me also clarify, the employee that bought the phone did not have a girlfriend that was pregnant, it was the lowbreed that stole the phone. that is why he stated he needed to sell his phone. this is just one of several things you have either misquoted or misstated. i doubt intentionally. so i thought i would bring that to your attention.
bottom line is that still does not change what has happened.
a panel of experts at ups, much like you, with experience with this type of behavior, ruled that he was not guilty based on evidence that was presented. while we are not privy to what was presented, i am sure if there was any doubt as to the guilt, at best it would have been a hung panel. so trusting in the wisdom of those learned members of the panel, the proof showed that he was not guilty, as charged by the lp department.
so by your posts, you doubt the intelligence of those members of of management that were on the panel by ruling the way they did on the evidence. i dont.
best
d
you are not the only one that has walked the talk. three out of our building, one that i thought a friend. several more out of atlanta and charlotte and one other unnamed building.
mine were getting the thieves our of our system, not setting up stings.
i also agree and have posted that someone just all of a sudden does not "start" stealing after 20-30 years of being a model employee.
let me also clarify, the employee that bought the phone did not have a girlfriend that was pregnant, it was the lowbreed that stole the phone. that is why he stated he needed to sell his phone. this is just one of several things you have either misquoted or misstated. i doubt intentionally. so i thought i would bring that to your attention.
bottom line is that still does not change what has happened.
a panel of experts at ups, much like you, with experience with this type of behavior, ruled that he was not guilty based on evidence that was presented. while we are not privy to what was presented, i am sure if there was any doubt as to the guilt, at best it would have been a hung panel. so trusting in the wisdom of those learned members of the panel, the proof showed that he was not guilty, as charged by the lp department.
so by your posts, you doubt the intelligence of those members of of management that were on the panel by ruling the way they did on the evidence. i dont.
best
d
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
interesting concept. reminds me of when the car i was driving no longer was dependable to get me to the preload on time. so i traded "up" to a pinto. they gave me $250 bucks for my car. coulda got more for it if i had the time to wait, but at the time, keeping my job was more important.
BTW, the trade in was a 65 mustang convertible.
i guess that would make me guilty of what?
the issue is that you pronounced guilt, and then everything written you claim points to that end.
i say, under what little we know, based on others with more experience than i, after hearing both biased and unbiased evidence, made a ruling. i am cool with that. you are not. even after his acquittal in court, in your opinion, he will still be guilty.
shame.
d
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