With Telematics, is this the end of the career UPS driver???

[bumped]

It seems to me that with telematics and all of the other nit picky bs, that high turnover is where UPS wants to be...END the career UPS driver, they make too much money!!! and remember your dumb*** signed the contract. Will the union fight this telematics??? My SUP did a safety ride with me the other day and told me that with our last contract UPS was expecting a lot of drivers to retire, but that didnt happen now they are pissed off and hate the drivers! Saying now buy OCT everyone in our building has to be running scrath or face disciplinary action based on performance. Why doesnt the union invest on doing our own time allowance study to be held by?

If you think its bad now, just wait if there is ever a two tier wage system is agrred upon.

 

[Coldworld]

Telematics hardware has been installed in probably about 75% of the vehicles in my center, the system is expected to go live in my building sometime in May of this year.
Every person who shows up in brown to work in the morning should be rejoicing over telematics. For one, we all know that its impossible to put up good numbers on paper following all of their "methods" that UPS invented back in the 1960's when we handled only a fraction of the volume we handle now. They have their telematics, and now they can


deal with the consequences of the drivers having to follow these outdated rules. Two, in most area's of my center, area


trace is wrong. Remember, just like we have a sales department that gets paid money (not points on a card) to recruit
business, we have people in place in that get paid to setup routes in a sensible order. Follow your trace as it is in the
board, its your job. Never offer advice on how to setup a route; you're just an idiot that delivers and picks up
packages, not an industrial engineer.


If everyone does what they are supposed to, follows their "methods", and walks the line, feeder drivers won't be the

only hourly employees making $100k+ anymore. Be safe, all.

You hit the nail on the head....the question I want to know is when did ie decide that selection was 5.5 seconds per package or that a cod was 8.76567 seconds...1960????back in those days the average weight of a package was much less than it is now. Customers use to get off the pot pronto to meet the ups driver..well that's not exactly true anymore. I know from reading posts on here that past drivers had some input on methods and there was a sampling of
drivers than contributed to what we all now call the numbers...but I honestly believe these drivers who were chosen
were probably the fastest ones out there. I don't have a problem with the system of a time allowance but with the current individual times each task is given for today's world I believe they are way off..when was the last time the individual tasks were studied...1957??? Paging dr. P-man."....

 

[Coldworld]

When we have time studies why not have Ba or Stewart go on road as a follow up to UPS time studies. Why not have this or something similar in contract. There are way to many variables that effect our time and you could have the exact same run and have a different time each day cause of all the variables. The harasment of production needs to be STRONGLY ENFORCED. I had 30 minutes of travel and wait at meet point between finishing E.A.M.'S and my 1030 air and I had a big confrontation with center manager tday. I explained it and said what do u
think i did just go to a park and watch birds during that time. Insulting me is the reason why I said it.

You ever notice how secret they keep this info on the time studies...you could ask 10 sups how much time we get for ring and wait and you would get 10 different answers....nobody knows..and this is the way they want it. Remember, there is a reason they push this so much. It's because it's all they have and they know it get them out in the parking lot and they will tell you the same thing.

 

[Say what!!]

Relax. I get crushed every day and have never been disciplined because of it. Just do your job as if someone is riding with you because they are. After a while its like having company with you every day the more you welcome their inspection the more they leave you alone. Smile and work fair all day long its realy easy to do. If they know it upsets you they will keep harassing you if they know your cool with it they just move on.

 

[soberups]

My building (225 drivers) has been on Telematics for over 2 years now, so I have plenty of experience dealing with it first hand.

In that 2+ years we have had a grand total of one Telematics-related termination for dishonesty. The driver scanned a NDA to a business as "closed" at 10:26 when he was actually several blocks away, and then made the actual delivery 10 minutes later after the commit time. And it wasnt the Telematics data itself that got the guy fired, it was the fact that he lied and wound up admitting that lie when questioned about it.

If Telematics is coming to your center and this is the kind of stuff that you do....you will have to stop. But if this isnt the kind of stuff that you do....then you truly dont have anything to worry about. You arent going to get fired for showing up on the bulkhead door report and you arent going to get fired for showing up on the seatbelt report and you arent going to get fired because you have more "backing events" then some guy in a cubicle thinks you should have.

I can say that Telematics has actually vindicated me on two occasions. I had a customer in a trailer park call in a complaint on me for "speeding" thru the park. The speed limit is 10MPH. They pulled the Telematics report and it showed that I was going.....10MPH. Case closed. I also made a delivery to a house where the FedEx guy who had been there earlier had gone down the driveway and backed his truck onto the customers lawn in order to get turned around. He would up tearing the lawn all to hell. I parked at the curb and walked the stop off. The customer came home, found packages on the porch from FedEx and UPS, and called both companies to find out who tore up the lawn. The Telematics report clearly showed that I parked on the street and did not back at all, which would have made it physically impossible for me to be the guilty party.

Bottom line; if you have nothing to hide, then you will soon forget that Telematics is even there.

 

[Anonymous 10]

My building (225 drivers) has been on Telematics for over 2 years now, so I have plenty of experience dealing with it first hand.

In that 2+ years we have had a grand total of one Telematics-related termination for dishonesty. The driver scanned a NDA to a business as "closed" at 10:26 when he was actually several blocks away, and then made the actual delivery 10 minutes later after the commit time. And it wasnt the Telematics data itself that got the guy fired, it was the fact that he lied and wound up admitting that lie when questioned about it.

If Telematics is coming to your center and this is the kind of stuff that you do....you will have to stop. But if this isnt the kind of stuff that you do....then you truly dont have anything to worry about. You arent going to get fired for showing up on the bulkhead door report and you arent going to get fired for showing up on the seatbelt report and you arent going to get fired because you have more "backing events" then some guy in a cubicle thinks you should have.

I can say that Telematics has actually vindicated me on two occasions. I had a customer in a trailer park call in a complaint on me for "speeding" thru the park. The speed limit is 10MPH. They pulled the Telematics report and it showed that I was going.....10MPH. Case closed. I also made a delivery to a house where the FedEx guy who had been there earlier had gone down the driveway and backed his truck onto the customers lawn in order to get turned around. He would up tearing the lawn all to hell. I parked at the curb and walked the stop off. The customer came home, found packages on the porch from FedEx and UPS, and called both companies to find out who tore up the lawn. The Telematics report clearly showed that I parked on the street and did not back at all, which would have made it physically impossible for me to be the guilty party.

Bottom line; if you have nothing to hide, then you will soon forget that Telematics is even there.

This is 100% great advice.

 

[Dragon]

This is 100% great advice.

+10 advice

 

[UnconTROLLed]

My building (225 drivers) has been on Telematics for over 2 years now, so I have plenty of experience dealing with it first hand.

In that 2+ years we have had a grand total of one Telematics-related termination for dishonesty. The driver scanned a NDA to a business as "closed" at 10:26 when he was actually several blocks away, and then made the actual delivery 10 minutes later after the commit time. And it wasnt the Telematics data itself that got the guy fired, it was the fact that he lied and wound up admitting that lie when questioned about it.

If Telematics is coming to your center and this is the kind of stuff that you do....you will have to stop. But if this isnt the kind of stuff that you do....then you truly dont have anything to worry about. You arent going to get fired for showing up on the bulkhead door report and you arent going to get fired for showing up on the seatbelt report and you arent going to get fired because you have more "backing events" then some guy in a cubicle thinks you should have.

I can say that Telematics has actually vindicated me on two occasions. I had a customer in a trailer park call in a complaint on me for "speeding" thru the park. The speed limit is 10MPH. They pulled the Telematics report and it showed that I was going.....10MPH. Case closed. I also made a delivery to a house where the FedEx guy who had been there earlier had gone down the driveway and backed his truck onto the customers lawn in order to get turned around. He would up tearing the lawn all to hell. I parked at the curb and walked the stop off. The customer came home, found packages on the porch from FedEx and UPS, and called both companies to find out who tore up the lawn. The Telematics report clearly showed that I parked on the street and did not back at all, which would have made it physically impossible for me to be the guilty party.

Bottom line; if you have nothing to hide, then you will soon forget that Telematics is even there.

Here is my take on telematics, and a real world example of our center. Originally I wouldn't post things like this because I'm sure there are people reading this site, that have SOME knoweldge of this event.

Driver was accused and had telematics report that he was leading the center in backs per day/excessive backs so they deemed. I believe he had 20-40 per day, while the company wanted him under 10 and said there were many during the day he could avoid.

The long, winding telematics reports of course are for all to see right on the boards in the center. There are several areas of the center with these reports.

Long story short, a week later the said driver was down to 10-20 backs per day, which was acceptable. In honor of this, the center took it upon itself to announce in a PCM that the driver reduced his backs from 20-40 to 10-20. They explained his issues with the problem in detail , fully quoting all telematics reports for every day, and made an example of the said driver.

Now to some people they would look at this as noteworthy and important. IN my opinion, it is no one elses business who has "report" problems and who doesn't. I can't speak for others but to me, it would be frankly embarrasing, because most of the other drivers were jeering and harrasing the said driver , mostly jokingly. It was pretty awkward, in hindsight.

Is this what the center is trying to do? Embarrass drivers who have production or "telematics report" issues? Is that really ethical

 

[soberups]

...Now to some people they would look at this as noteworthy and important. IN my opinion, it is no one elses business who has "report" problems and who doesn't. I can't speak for others but to me, it would be frankly embarrasing, because most of the other drivers were jeering and harrasing the said driver , mostly jokingly. It was pretty awkward, in hindsight.

Is this what the center is trying to do? Embarrass drivers who have production or "telematics report" issues? Is that really ethical

We filed an Art 37 grievance and made them quit posting data on the bulletin board that could be used for disciplinary purposes.

There is still a "recording while idling" and a "bulkhead door open while traveling" report taped to the window sometimes.... but I have yet to see anyone reading it or giving a damn whether they are on it or not. Most of us choose to focus our attention on things that actually matter.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

We filed an Art 37 grievance and made them quit posting data on the bulletin board that could be used for disciplinary purposes.

There is still a "recording while idling" and a "bulkhead door open while traveling" report taped to the window sometimes.... but I have yet to see anyone reading it or giving a damn whether they are on it or not. Most of us choose to focus our attention on things that actually matter.

I filed Art 37 grievance for something similar and it was to my knowledge torn up and tossed. misloads being made public on a board with "zero misloads THANK YOU" and anyone with misloads having their names in large print and NOT ACCEPTABLE". This should be clear cut harrassment.

Our local does not work the same way others do. It's local 25 after all, lol. It's basically parallel to making the telematics data public and then citing examples during PCMs to single out drivers whos names are publically available.

Basically any grievance around here is considered "digging" as there are a lot of comfy deals set up.

Sorry for the OT, I am coming to think many of the points you make are specific to your local situation rather than a nationwide feeling or process.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Our preloaders also have their misload counts posted on a bulletin board but, to be fair, they also list their pkg count to put it in perspective. For example, my preloader had 1 misload but she loaded nearly 900 pkgs which, to me, is not a bad ratio.

They have also started to target the drivers who are "least best" by posting our most over allowed and excessive AM or PM time. We had a driver with .14 overallowed on the list. I was on the list with a .07 PM time which is roughly 5 minutes. My on-car saw me looking at these reports and told me not to put too much emphasis on them.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

Our preloaders also have their misload counts posted on a bulletin board but, to be fair, they also list their pkg count to put it in perspective. For example, my preloader had 1 misload but she loaded nearly 900 pkgs which, to me, is not a bad ratio.

They have also started to target the drivers who are "least best" by posting our most over allowed and excessive AM or PM time. We had a driver with .14 overallowed on the list. I was on the list with a .07 PM time which is roughly 5 minutes. My on-car saw me looking at these reports and told me not to put too much emphasis on them.

I believe the misload ratio is 1:3000, 1:900 will get you warning letters/suspensions here

 

[soberups]

Our local does not work the same way others do. It's local 25 after all, lol. It's basically parallel to making the telematics data public and then citing examples during PCMs to single out drivers whos names are publically available.

Basically any grievance around here is considered "digging" as there are a lot of comfy deals set up.

Sorry for the OT, I am coming to think many of the points you make are specific to your local situation rather than a nationwide feeling or process.

Indeed, I am blessed to work in a location with a strong and active local union. Unfortunately it would seem that you are not. Sometimes local problems call for local solutions...such as attending meetings and holding your union officers accountable for their action or inaction.

 

[soberups]

Our preloaders also have their misload counts posted on a bulletin board but, to be fair, they also list their pkg count to put it in perspective. For example, my preloader had 1 misload but she loaded nearly 900 pkgs which, to me, is not a bad ratio.

They have also started to target the drivers who are "least best" by posting our most over allowed and excessive AM or PM time. We had a driver with .14 overallowed on the list. I was on the list with a .07 PM time which is roughly 5 minutes. My on-car saw me looking at these reports and told me not to put too much emphasis on them.

I would say that you have already placed too much emphasis on them by even bothering to read them in the first place.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

Indeed, I am blessed to work in a location with a strong and active local union. Unfortunately it would seem that you are not. Sometimes local problems call for local solutions...such as attending meetings and holding your union officers accountable for their action or inaction.

We'll see, I'm not implying it is all bad..better than 10 years ago, that is for certain. However lots of room for improvement ( along with pension plan like 60% funded)

 

[804brown]

I believe the misload ratio is 1:3000, 1:900 will get you warning letters/suspensions here

Tell me what is wrong with being 99% effective. 1 misload out of 900 packages loaded is good in my book. Is it perfect?? No but we are not paid to be perfect. We are paid a "fair day's work for a fair day's pay." In local 804's supplement we have Article 26: "The company will not request or require from any employee any more than a reasonble performance." Is it reasonable that she might make a mistake loading almost 1000 packages a night?? I think a fair minded arbitrator might think so.

 

[brownmonster]

Tell me what is wrong with being 99% effective. 1 misload out of 900 packages loaded is good in my book. Is it perfect?? No but we are not paid to be perfect. We are paid a "fair day's work for a fair day's pay." In local 804's supplement we have Article 26: "The company will not request or require from any employee any more than a reasonble performance." Is it reasonable that she might make a mistake loading almost 1000 packages a night?? I think a fair minded arbitrator might think so.

You would think differently if that one misload was the "Girls Gone Wild" DVD you were expecting.

 

[Anonymous 10]

You would think differently if that one misload was the "Girls Gone Wild" DVD you were expecting.

Or those three inch prophylactics he's been waiting for so eagerly.

 

[menotyou]

Its pure intimidation to post those stats. I would file a grievance on that. If they are so worried about your performance, why do you have a job with them?

 

[UnconTROLLed]

Tell me what is wrong with being 99% effective. 1 misload out of 900 packages loaded is good in my book. Is it perfect?? No but we are not paid to be perfect. We are paid a "fair day's work for a fair day's pay." In local 804's supplement we have Article 26: "The company will not request or require from any employee any more than a reasonble performance." Is it reasonable that she might make a mistake loading almost 1000 packages a night?? I think a fair minded arbitrator might think so.

We have been getting warning letters, suspensions over misloads for quite some time (since peak ended, of course). The misload freq had dropped since peak, interestingly enough. I'm not even going to try to rationalize that.

As far as the 1:3000, I don't think it is actually that high, was being sarcastic. Though it may be.