Griff
Well-Known Member
congrats on your feelings of importance. Hope it translates into a more positive outlook on life for you.
The bells of truth, they toll for thee. Deafening aren't they?
congrats on your feelings of importance. Hope it translates into a more positive outlook on life for you.
The bells of truth, they toll for thee. Deafening aren't they?
As a manager I often hear complaints from my people complaining about the slackers who don't carry their weight. I also hear them complain about co-workers who lie, cheat and steal the system to get what the want. Should I then decide this complaining proves that all drivers are thus dishonest or should I look at them as exceptions.
The bells of truth, they toll for thee. Deafening aren't they?
Like lifer said before , if you actually talked all the crap at work that you talk here you would have been fired a long time ago. I can't hear you because you're standing somewhere in the back row trying to whisper your version of hate and discontent. Ever wonder why the guy in front of you moves away from you when you start?
I used to see these kinds of drivers that complained about other drivers to management and they were usually the ones trying to kiss up so that they could eventually get into management or get special favors ahead of senior employees. They were also the ones that ran, skipped lunch, drove like maniacs and alienated customers. They never got more than a couple years of safe driving and often got hurt because they weren't following safe methods. All they cared about was scratching a route.
My experience completely opposite. I found the quiet guys who just wanted to come in and do the job without a lot of BS were the ones that would vent about having to carry someone elses workload. These are the guys that come in do the job and don't ask for a whole lot out of you. They felt they did the job and should not be punished because someone else slacked off. They often had no problem telling the slugs how they felt too. When someone who normally is quiet speaks up because they have had enough you tend to listen a little more.
I've also heard quite a few union employees complain because the union saved too many of those that deserved to lose their jobs. Quite a few of our people will take that soladarity thing so far until they have to start carrying their "brothers" weight around with them. At that point that brother gets disowned real quick.
proves my point. Lets say we have some divison manager that gets his/her gut into a case. At worse it might cost us backpay with the grievance process where a courtroom could easily cost much more. Or we discharge and bring back in a couple of weeks with no back pay.
Once again, a very small percentage of hourly employees would resort to law suits, although I'm sure the number is higher now than it was 50 years ago. Very few people fired unjustly without a grievance procedure ever get their jobs back with or without back pay or damages/loss of pay. Some will (through the courts) receive pay for damages when their constitutional rights have been infringed upon, but not when it is just a situation where a hotshot, wanna be important, flash in the pan manager wants to flex his/her muscle.
hell tex you a perty smart fella. figure out why all those companies including ups are putting in grievance process with an arbitrator at the end of the process? The grievance process gives us a means to fire people without really losing them. We don't want to lose them we just want to punish them.
I have no stats to show me that corporate America is jumping on the grievance bandwagon. I'm bettin' that the ones that do incorporate that process are either hoping that it will prevent law suits for discrimination OR their employees, both present and future, are putting pressure to get this small form of job security.
Or if we really want to fire them then we build a heck of a case through the grievance process. When the arbitrator finally agrees with a discharge then you have a case that will withstand the scutiny of the courtroom.
You surely can figure out that a case to fire someone can be put together in a much more efficient way than by hassling with arbitrators and a flow of grievances. It's been proven time and time again that given the right set of circumstances a law suit can be filled on anyone for anything. You feeling of success would be easily deflated by a jury of sympathetic people worried about the "little guy" and his family being walked on by the all powerful corporate "watchdog".
The grievance process is awesome. It allows management the opportunity to use the words "your fired" a lot more then we would if everything was going straight to the courts....
So, what you are saying here is that UPS plays games with peoples futures and their livelihood. You are saying that you not only agree with it but, you like it too. Do you practice the Donald Trump hand gesture and phrase, "You're fired" ?
Geeez I hope you don't have that same haircut.
All in all Tie, that was a nice twist, but I still aint dancin'
Once again, a very small percentage of hourly employees would resort to law suits, [\quote]
TRP I think you need to reconsider that point. Todays world is a very sue happy world. Look at some of the class action lawsuits we have had. In california 5 people file and draw in every driver in the state. No one else in the state now has to prove they were damaged. Only those 5. Think about the ratio. We probably have at least what 5000 drivers in california. Yet if we wrong 5 of them we stand to lose a sizable lawsuit.
The rest of your post is buried in the quote and too much trouble to respond to.
I guarantee you this point. Look at all the time served discharges you have seen over the years. You would hear the words "your fired" a lot less if the grievance process was not there to throw them back. The grievance process is your safety net. Its also a net to bounce a misbehaving employee off of if management chooses to go that route.
By the way what in the world does UPS do with all that extra billions of dollars that sit around?? Their deep pockets could pay for a lot of extra crap, Just don't....Love the corporate people
NASCAR.
Like lifer said before , if you actually talked all the crap at work that you talk here you would have been fired a long time ago. I can't hear you because you're standing somewhere in the back row trying to whisper your version of hate and discontent. Ever wonder why the guy in front of you moves away from you when you start?
So you're reiterating the fact that UPS targets individuals for their union involvement for all to see again? I've already informed you and UPS lifer that this is a highly illegal practice. Apparently you believe that laws do not apply between the brick walls of UPS hubs? This disregard for the contract and law is a common trait in the always idiotic management goon.
The question then becomes is UPS an ethical company? Also, are Teamsters and ethical organization? People are people. It boils down to the orginazations themselves.
I'm guessing UPS is delaying benefits to part timers, for just the reason you stated. Why would UPS want to contribute to benefits for an employee group who traditionally has a high turnover rate.
You may have the occasional parent looking for part time work and benefits for their families, but the usual mix of part timers are students, or young kids taking on a first job.
Tough situations for part time employees and UPS. It's all a matter of cost and benefits expense skyrocketing over the years.
So you're reiterating the fact that UPS targets individuals for their union involvement for all to see again? I've already informed you and UPS lifer that this is a highly illegal practice. Apparently you believe that laws do not apply between the brick walls of UPS hubs? This disregard for the contract and law is a common trait in the always idiotic management goon.
GRiff you need to work on your reading skills. the post you quoted was where I pointed out your cowardly tactic of standing in the back row and provoking others.
Considering the topic, I just saw the Ben Stein movie "Expelled". A must see for anybody interested in critical thinking. The premise of the movie is about the conflict of teaching intelligent design and it's counterpoint darwinism, very well done, highly entertaining and smart. It bought up the point about darwinism and it's concepts of the survival of the fittest and natural selection and it progressing to genetics and selective breeding under nazi germany. Consider this; the mindset of man being considered useless unless that can perform a function or benefit society has been taught in our univerisities and colleges for close to 100 years now. I knew we were in trouble about 20 years ago when the "personnel office" was changed to "the human resource department".
Just how much of current ethical business practices everywhere has been based on situational ethics and "the business of doing business". If there is no absolutes, anything goes. Just don't be caught and if caught lie with a straight face and deny everything.
FOXNews said:Ben Stein: Win His Career
After seeing a new non-fiction film starring Comedy Central’s Ben Stein, you may not only be able to win his money, but also his career.
Stein is that whiny little guy with the monotone voice that makes him seem funny and an unlikely "character" for TV appearances. But that career may be over come April 18, when a movie he co-wrote, narrates and appears in, called "Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed," is released.
Directed by one Nathan Frankowski, "Expelled" is a sloppy, all-over-the-place, poorly made (and not just a little boring) "expose" of the scientific community. It’s not very exciting. But it does show that Stein, who’s carved out a career selling eye drops in commercials and amusing us on sitcoms, is either completely nuts or so avaricious that he’s abandoned all good sense to make a buck.
To wit: Stein, Frankowski and pals say in "Expelled" that perfectly good scientists and educators are being stigmatized for wanting to teach their students creationism and "intelligent design" — in other words, junk science — in addition to or instead of conventionally accepted Darwinism. You see, Stein, like some other celebrities, finally has shown his true colors and they aren’t so pretty.
The gist of Stein’s involvement is: He’s outraged! He believes in God! God created the universe! How can we not avail our students of this theory? What do you mean we’re just molecules?
What the producers of this film would love, love, love is a controversy. That’s because it’s being marketed by the same people who brought us "The Passion of the Christ." They’re hoping someone will latch onto an anti-Semitism theme here, since there’s a visit to a concentration camp and the raised idea — apparently typical of the intelligent design community — that somehow the theory of evolution is so evil that it caused the Holocaust. Alas, this is such a warped premise that no one’s biting.
The whole idea of Stein, a Jew, jumping on the intelligent design bandwagon of the theory of evolution begetting the Nazis is so distasteful you wonder what in — sorry — God’s name — he was thinking when he got into this. Who cares, really, if "Expelled" is anti-Semitic? It will come and go without much fanfare.
But Stein is another matter. Can he really be amusing selling eye drops or acting like a nebbish on game shows if we now have this new insight into his thinking?
You know Ben Stein from his voice. He used it to intone Ferris Bueller’s name iconically at the beginning of that 20-year-old Matthew Broderick movie. His laconic delivery and deadpan presence have given him a benign celebrity — until now.
But this is what he wrote last fall on the "Expelled" movie Web site:
"Darwinism is still very much alive, utterly dominating biology. Despite the fact that no one has ever been able to prove the creation of a single distinct species by Darwinist means, Darwinism dominates the academy and the media. Darwinism also has not one meaningful word to say on the origins of organic life, a striking lacuna in a theory supposedly explaining life.
"Alas, Darwinism has had a far bloodier life span than Imperialism. Darwinism, perhaps mixed with Imperialism, gave us Social Darwinism, a form of racism so vicious that it countenanced the Holocaust against the Jews and mass murder of many other groups in the name of speeding along the evolutionary process."
In a word: Urgggh. Suddenly Stein is not so amusing anymore. I want my eye drops from someone else.
PS: Following "The Passion" release pattern, "Expelled" will open wide on the 18th, but mostly in rural and poor neighborhoods. It’s got just one theater in all of New York City, in Times Square, none in places like Beverly Hills or wealthier, better-educated urban neighborhoods where more "evolved" people might live.
According to the film’s Web site, the producers are in a whopping 45 theaters in North Carolina, and a mere seven in Massachusetts, 35 in Georgia, 11 in New Jersey, four in Connecticut and one in Vermont. And so on. There are huge numbers of screens in Florida and Texas taking the film, particularly seven in San Antonio. If I lived in the Deep South, I’d boycott the filmmakers for thinking of me as this gullible and unsophisticated.
GRiff you need to work on your reading skills. the post you quoted was where I pointed out your cowardly tactic of standing in the back row and provoking others.
My reading skills are superb compared to yours. I'll prove my point by asking you one question.
What is your reasoning behind claiming that I stand in the back row and allow others to do my bidding? You talk about this as if it's undisputed fact and you have video footage of me doing so.