Generation Snowflake Feeling Entitled

Old Man Jingles

Old Man Jingles

Rat out of a cage
It will be fine said:
My favorite driver owned a few businesses before working for me. I’ve tried to get him to accept a management position, he’s not interested. He likes just doing his own route, he doesn’t care about the finances of the company or anything else. He gets paid a wage he feels is fair and he’s satisfied. He’s seen outside the cave and is happier inside without the stress, I completely understand the appeal.
Click to expand...
That's what I felt like when I retired ... and still do.
 
DumbTruckDriver

DumbTruckDriver

Allergic to cardboard.
It will be fine said:
My favorite driver owned a few businesses before working for me. I’ve tried to get him to accept a management position, he’s not interested. He likes just doing his own route, he doesn’t care about the finances of the company or anything else. He gets paid a wage he feels is fair and he’s satisfied. He’s seen outside the cave and is happier inside without the stress, I completely understand the appeal.
Click to expand...
I worked in retail management for a time prior to UPS. I would never go back.
 
R

rickyb

Well-Known Member
It will be fine said:
My favorite driver owned a few businesses before working for me. I’ve tried to get him to accept a management position, he’s not interested. He likes just doing his own route, he doesn’t care about the finances of the company or anything else. He gets paid a wage he feels is fair and he’s satisfied. He’s seen outside the cave and is happier inside without the stress, I completely understand the appeal.
Click to expand...
to elaborate on my point, hes not free even tho he did management bc again the capitalists are setting the terms of his management job. so there might be too much stress, hours, etc.

he and the workers should be voting in and out managers.
 
1989

1989

Well-Known Member
rickyb said:
to elaborate on my point, hes not free even tho he did management bc again the capitalists are setting the terms of his management job. so there might be too much stress, hours, etc.

he and the workers should be voting in and out managers.
Click to expand...
You are missing one thing. Many people do not have the capacity to run and manage a successful business. They won’t even know how to vote on anything. The politics are unbearable in some cases. And in other cases, the same group/faction has complete control.
 
Fred's Myth

Fred's Myth

Nonhyphenated American
1989 said:
You are missing one thing. Many people do not have the capacity to run and manage a successful business. They won’t even know how to vote on anything. The politics are unbearable in some cases. And in other cases, the same group/faction has complete control.
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He is entirely missing the reality. If he is being exploited, then he is complicit in that exploitation, and deserves only what he is able to extract from the relationship. He is only a slave to his own lack of initiative. He accepts, and then complains about, his situation.
 
R

rickyb

Well-Known Member
1989 said:
You are missing one thing. Many people do not have the capacity to run and manage a successful business. They won’t even know how to vote on anything. The politics are unbearable in some cases. And in other cases, the same group/faction has complete control.
Click to expand...
yea but there are institutions to train ppl how to run a coop and all the worker democracy that comes with it. there are unionized coops.

it funny how our education system doesn't teach us this. at least we were taught animal farm, not sure if the teachers understood worker self determination part...
 
It will be fine

It will be fine

Well-Known Member
rickyb said:
to elaborate on my point, hes not free even tho he did management bc again the capitalists are setting the terms of his management job. so there might be too much stress, hours, etc.

he and the workers should be voting in and out managers.
Click to expand...
He owned companies, if you don’t want someone telling you what to do you own a company and run it yourself. Capitalism allows this, everyone is free to make that choice for themselves. Many people don’t want the stress that comes with it.

Voting for your own boss is a terrible way to run a company, if that was an efficient management philosophy it would thrive, it doesn’t.

You fail to see the virtue in a fair day’s work, that’s not the system’s failure it’s yours. Work ethic and pride are not contingent on the economic system you live in. Humans are hardwired to take pleasure in performing tasks to help the collective, it’s called work. You should try it sometime, it’ll be more rewarding than slacking, milking the clock and blaming your boss.
 
R

rickyb

Well-Known Member
It will be fine said:
He owned companies, if you don’t want someone telling you what to do you own a company and run it yourself. Capitalism allows this, everyone is free to make that choice for themselves. Many people don’t want the stress that comes with it.

Voting for your own boss is a terrible way to run a company, if that was an efficient management philosophy it would thrive, it doesn’t.

You fail to see the virtue in a fair day’s work, that’s not the system’s failure it’s yours. Work ethic and pride are not contingent on the economic system you live in. Humans are hardwired to take pleasure in performing tasks to help the collective, it’s called work. You should try it sometime, it’ll be more rewarding than slacking, milking the clock and blaming your boss.
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well in terms of stress related to owning companies, market pressures may be to blame for that. if the competitor works hard, you gotta work harder. my dads friend runs a company and he has a ton of health problems bc of the stress. not sure why he doesn't hire more ppl?

theres no such thing as a fair days work in this system bc the whole thing is built on mostly injustice.

in capitalism your not helping the collective, your helping the capitalist.

my 2 theories on the ppl who work hard for the capitalist is propaganda and some ppl always gotta be busy.

like I said before most ppl don't have the perspective to know anything other than capitalism.

I enjoy going slow and a lot of ppl at my job do this although they likely don't have a alternative to capitalism like me.

voting your supervisor and yourself is more efficient and more democratic than capitalism. theres facts to back up that coops are more efficient. I don't buy the idea that if something was more efficient we would already have it; this system we have is based on power struggles, not efficiency. we do tons of inefficient things and that's partly bc of rigging by ppl w money, partly bc ppl are too cynical to fight for a better world, etc.
 
1989

1989

Well-Known Member
rickyb said:
well in terms of stress related to owning companies, market pressures may be to blame for that. if the competitor works hard, you gotta work harder. my dads friend runs a company and he has a ton of health problems bc of the stress. not sure why he doesn't hire more ppl?

theres no such thing as a fair days work in this system bc the whole thing is built on mostly injustice.

in capitalism your not helping the collective, your helping the capitalist.

my 2 theories on the ppl who work hard for the capitalist is propaganda and some ppl always gotta be busy.

like I said before most ppl don't have the perspective to know anything other than capitalism.

I enjoy going slow and a lot of ppl at my job do this although they likely don't have a alternative to capitalism like me.

voting your supervisor and yourself is more efficient and more democratic than capitalism. theres facts to back up that coops are more efficient. I don't buy the idea that if something was more efficient we would already have it; this system we have is based on power struggles, not efficiency. we do tons of inefficient things and that's partly bc of rigging by ppl w money, partly bc ppl are too cynical to fight for a better world, etc.
Click to expand...
You have the same market pressures in a co op. People also get fired in co ops. You work slow, they will just silence your voice/push you out. So the same boss you voted in will cut you loose.
 
R

rickyb

Well-Known Member
1989 said:
You have the same market pressures in a co op. People also get fired in co ops. You work slow, they will just silence your voice/push you out. So the same boss you voted in will cut you loose.
Click to expand...
yes but at least its being done democratically.

democracy is not a perfect system but it better than dictatorships and capitalist power abuse.

and workers are incentivized to care w coops bc they profit off of their hard work

and yes market pressures make it hard for coops. theres been commentary on Mondragon regarding this
 

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