Is it getting that bad elswhere?

Discussion in 'UPS Discussions' started by cashmen, Aug 12, 2006.

  1. cashmen

    cashmen Member

    We had 3 full time supervisors walk off the job last week on the same day and they dont plan on coming back...all of them had over 15 yrs on the job!
    It too bad cause I actually liked all these guys and they werent *******s like some of them!
    Wondering if it has happened elsewhere?
  2. crzy4trucks

    crzy4trucks AM Preloader

    It happens all the time man, being a PT Sup sucks.
  3. cashmen

    cashmen Member

    well, ive been a driver for 12 yrs and worked in 2 different states and 7 different centers and never seen 3 Full time driver sups quit on the same day in the same center!
  4. STLFeeder

    STLFeeder Need LS7 powered PKG car

    The FT sups that didn't get brainwashed by UPS manager school, get ridden the hardest by their bosses.
  5. over9five

    over9five Moderator Staff Member

    That has to be bad for the manager. Makes him look like a real AH.
  6. old levi's

    old levi's I use to care... but things have changed

    Makes him look like a real AH to who; the District Manager (an even bigger AH).

  7. xkingx

    xkingx Member

    yup within months...3 F/T delivery sups walked out...
    I had heard that recently they were contacted and asked to come back..Seeing how our area is begging people to go into management
  8. DS

    DS Fenderbender

    At our center there`s been 3 management lossess in the recent past.The latest is the guy that hired me as a driver 16 years ago.
    He left his job as center mngr after 23 years at ups to work for DHL.
    I got on fairly well with him and visited his office to wish him good luck.They matched his benefits and holidays,and gave him a substantial raise on top of it.I tried to get a reason out of him for leaving after so many years.He just smiled that **** eating grin and said its just time for a change.
  9. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    Most of the managers that rps had were ex UPS managers.

    Lets see, first I am paid a salary, not by the hour. Then after working a 65 hour week I am told that I am to head to the divisional office for a "weekend retreat". So much for family plans.

    I am held responsible for making production numbers, employee turn over, damages, service failures etc etc, and yet I am not allowed the autonomy to run my part of UPS, thereby wasting all my talent, knowledge and time........

    I am micro managed, almost to the point I cant go to the bathroom without permission. I am micro managed by IE, a faceless endless bunch of number crunching individuals that make their living telling other people how to do things better. Yeah some of the things they come up with help, some not. But what they say is law. They are never wrong, even when they are wrong. If they say the volume is going to be 15000 for today, and we had 17694, then it must have been us, we need to count them again. We must be skewing the numbers.

    And promotions? Hell, they are taking rookies right out of school. You know, the guys that have mastered the theory of business administration, where someone like me that has 15 years of hand on experience cant get even considered. Talk about a glass ceiling, try working your heart out for UPS being something that counts against you when it comes time, only to see someone that gets the promotion, and he only wore brown because he rode with someone a while.

    And having to cover the sat air once a month because it is my turn, is it not enough that I have had to work 60 plus hours this week already?

    Oh and lest I forget, lets not overlook the painful employee. I know that he is dragging his feet when it comes to delivery. Of the thousands of employees that I have come into contact with, he is a real winner. Cant get rid of him though, he is protected by the union. So therefor, the work that he refuses to do has to be split among other drivers, all of which are great guys and gals, all of whom have families and want to get in earlier. Its not fair, but what am I to do?

    Why would I want to quit a job like that?

    And before 9.5 or others try and make a big deal of my posting in first second, and third person formats, no, I have not been a sup. I was offered and encouraged, but for family and religious reasons I declined.

    But I have had many good men and women pass through the brown door for the last time to go work for other companies. Their thoughts and reasons are melded above to give you an idea. I am sure there are others.

    One of the biggest killers of careers is trying to treat your people well. That seems to have rotted more people on the vine than most anything else I have seen.

  10. trickpony1

    trickpony1 Well-Known Member

    Very well said!
    Another Pulitzer Prize winning post!
    Never been in management and don't intend to be but I have seen supes leave in droves.

    Gosh, what could it be?
  11. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND


    Frustration? Unfulfillment of promises made? Dreams of a UPS where each individual is cherished for the brain they have, talents they possess, and the drive they have shown?

    Dreams of a company that can care about the small issues of one person, and respond with help, but allows the freedom to try new things without the crushing reprimand from above? A company that promotes because of your talents, and if you tie with someone on that level, then your years with the company mean something. Your sexual orientation has no bearing on the matter, neither does your sex or race. Its the best person for the job. To watch where some that are good at lying, cheating, stealing get promoted because of the way they got their numbers to fall, and see honest men that lead by example when it comes to integrity, tossed by the wayside............

    Unfortunately, the UPS that currently exists is a top down management system, where it is all hail to the chief. Kinda reminds me of the emperor and his new clothes.

    A UPS where even if you tried, you really cant make that much of a difference.

    While it is not just UPS that has become that way, because it seems that any large corp gets that way after a while, it is a real shame it had to happen. With the rich legacy that was left, to have it prostituted like it has become.............

    OH well.
  12. over9five

    over9five Moderator Staff Member

    "And before 9.5 or others.."

    Ouch! Where did that come from?? Your post read very true to me.

    (I'm hurt.....)
  13. over9five

    over9five Moderator Staff Member

    In fact, I'm goin over to Teamsternet where the nice people are!
  14. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    So was I, but I got over it ;)

  15. childsplay

    childsplay Guest

    About three weeks ago, 8 supervisors quit in one multi-center building I used to work in.

    All the ft management were sent home to write a letter to their division manager stating why they should keep their jobs.
  16. upsdude

    upsdude Well-Known Member

    Probably the only time in weeks they had to see their families.
  17. up north

    up north Guest

    Is it ever! Numbers is all we are to UPS and they manipulate the numbers to make themselves look better. This is a fact but the problems I have with this is that they are dishonest in calculating these formulas to achieve results.

    For those who don't check there paystubs, I guess you trust the untrustable.
    Eg. 100000 employees, 40000 don't check there pay, 8000 get payroll reductions of an average of 30min a week, avg $18/hr = $72,000/week * 52 = $3.744 million.

    That's probably on the low side and UPS has 3 times the employees of the Example.

    Good luck!

    Ps! Don't worry about over under numbers cause the $20 your costing them by what they say could be saved 5x by improving the preload, effieciency with bulk deliveries and pickups and earlier start times.

  18. fmrtie

    fmrtie New Member

    Bravo Danny

    Very well stated!!!

    Let me just add a couple other items starting with the changes that took place years ago with the management insurance package. Flex benefits soured many people with after insurance being part of the compensation package now management is required to pay a portion. Although it is a reduced rate one still had to pay for something that was part of the benefits. The new supervisors don't know any different.

    And lets not forget the changes to the MIP program. The dangling carrot of retiring after 30 years a millionaire is no longer there. The annual award has now stretched out to 20% of the annual award given to the supervisor over a five year period. Another way the company is not coming through for management, many are leaving before the full award is given.

    I applaud your comments Danny for a non member of management having the vision to see what is going on in the management ranks.
  19. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    The way I understand the post on your stock, in the first year, you only get 20% of what is due you, in the second, you get the second 20% for the first year, plus 20% for the second year.


    Say you get $1000 stock the first 5 years as a sup.

    Year 1 You get $200 of the 1000
    Year 2 you get 400, 200 from the first year, and 200 from year 2
    Year 3, you get 600. 200 from each of years 1, 2,and 3
    Year 4 you get 800. 200 from years 1,2,3,and 4
    Year 5 you get 1000, 200 each from 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5.

    So basically if you still get the 1000 and not any more, then year 5 and beyond you get your full bonus.

    Problem is that if after 5 years you are still locked into the same bonus, you are not really producing for the company, or something else is wrong. Of course I have seen management that has been "demoted" and had stock "fines" as well.

    I view this as just another way UPS is trying to keep people on and making it expensive for you to quit. IT would seem that if you do quit early, you are tossing 3-4 years worth of bonus that they owe you.

    That is assuming that the way I understand it is the correct way it is figured.

  20. beentheredonethat

    beentheredonethat Well-Known Member

    You got most all of it right. There's one difference. In your scenario above. We now get 1/2 the bonus immediately and 1/2 spread out over the five years as you listed. To make the numbers work in your example, the mgmt person would have gotten a $2,000 in a stock bonus. 1/2 of it went straight to the supervisor in the form of cash or stock. The other 1/2 ($1,000) was awarded to the supv as you had listed above 1/5 each year for 5 years. For a person who stays with the company until retirement, it doesn't really affect them that much, except that the money is tied up and they can't do anything with it during this time. For a person who leaves, now they are losing part of their bonus they were awarded.

    In five years after the start up of this change, assuming the person kept getting the same dollar amount bonus of $2,000 of which $1,000 was awarded over a five year period. In five years the person will still have $200 tied up from year 1, 400 from year 2, 600 from year 3, 800 from year 4 and 1000 from year 5. For a total of $3000. This works out to a lot of money. The person who leaves, doesn't get that money that they earned. Also the MIP bonus has recently been almost two times a supv monthly salary. Double that for a mgr. Although it has been down to about a months salary. They also changed it from a striaght calculation of 15% of profits to now some arbitrary way of calculating it. No doubt the MIP will go lower as time goes by. I had a buddy who calculated his hours for the year. Assuming he was paid OT after 40/week, and including the 1/2 months bonus and MIP bonus. He was making way less then his drivers on a per hour basis. I reminded him he didn't even include the money he spends on HW from his flex benefits. That really got him going.