Ketter Audit

[ezmoney5150]

Knowing proper methods and safe work habits IS A CONDITION OF EMPLOYMENT... Even the Union BA will tell you that...

If you are a good worker and management likes you... I doubt you will get fired over a Keter Audit... But if management is looking for that one thing to let you go, this could be it...

What artilcle would they fire him under???? Article 17 (I) Other Serious offenses???? LOL!!!!!!!!!

That would be a great lawsuit if the panel upheld that one.

 

[ezmoney5150]

We're told to learn these things on a daily basis, without any real justification given -- I'm sure it's for audits. The one most people seem to have trouble with is the five keys to preventing slips and falls. Since I hate answering these questions and try to get them answered as quickly as possible so I can be done with it, I just do it.

An acronym someone developed for slips & falls:

West LA:
W - Walk at a brisk pace, don't run
E - Establish firm footing
St - Stay off belts, rollers, conveyors
L - Look before you step
A - Adapt for changing conditions.

I know the technical definitions are longer, but they seem to accept these brief definitions.

I don't even know why this is a topic to discuss. If UPS cared about their customers as much as these Keter audits they would double their revenue. But instead they tie management pay to these stupid audits.

We had a keter audit yesterday for the air operation. I hooked up to my air trailer, the auditer was watching me hook up and i just ignored him like he wasn't even there.

 

[Griff]

perhaps you could elaborate. In fact put yourself into managements shoes and teach defensive driving to me.

How do I know a driver can safely clear an intersection if he can't explain it to me?

How do I know a sorter or driver can correctly lift a package using his leg muscles if he can't explain and demonstrate the process to me?

turn off the idiot supervisors comments who was stupid enough to threaten a discharge when he had no legs to stand on and focus on the actual training aspect of being able to recite this information. If you can't explain defensive driving and safe work methods then guess what you ain't doing it.

Sure, I'll elaborate for you. All of it is meaningless in the end because you and nobody else in management actually care about safety. You talk this big game with acronyms, keywords and other jargon and then turn around and claim that everything is avoidable. The entire system is built around placing blame on the employee. Of course everything could have been prevented; every fall, every slip, every accident...if you have days and weeks to question the decision made by someone that had one second. Everything that is "taught" at UPS falls under preventive instead of proactive. The company and the management team have absolutely no interest in making the environment at UPS less hazardous ($$$). Instead they sit around a table and dream up ways to blame people for costing them money. So lets recap, instead of spending money to better the operation and reduce the real-time chances of someone getting injured -- they make up rules for free.

Lets take a stroll down memory lane, shall we:

1) Slips in the middle of the back of the truck on the *METAL* floor on a bitter cold icy day. -- Avoidable, 3 points of contact.

- Nevermind the fact the entire length of the floor in the truck should have a antislip coating or industrial rubber on it. That's crazy talk! $$$$$$$

2) Old lady rear ends you at a 4 way stop-sign intersection. -- Avoidable, should have seen her coming in the side mirrors and moved out of the way. See you at the panel.

- What are you kidding me? Yeah, you should of pulled out into the intersection, durrrr.

3) Cut your shin severely getting into the truck. You used 3 points of contact you say? Still slipped up that 21" metal step huh. Well did you look down first...Oh you didn't, avoidable, check your mailbox for a warning letter.

- Who the hell is to say someone wouldn't slip just because they were LOOKING somewhere? Getting the picture yet? Everything is avoidable from behind a desk.

4) You died from carbon monoxide poisoning while driving 65mph and killed a family of 5? Avoidable, you should have sheeted the problem up in the DVIR (which has gone missing since the accident) and shouldn't have kept the doors closed. Oh by the way your family isn't going to be taken care of because you were grossly negligent.

- Safety is priority one at UPS. Oh by the way, we dispatched you with 13hrs but nobody can go over 9.5 today, be safe out there.

Prove to the employees that you actually care about safety and then I'll think about reciting UPS poems at 8AM. Get rid of the junkers that leak center manager into the cab. File down all the sharp edges in the truck. Put some real handrails on the sides of the truck. Rubberize the floors. Scrap any truck that doesn't have power steering, aren't you tired of paying out for rotator cuff, cheaper to hope for the best huh? Get rid of high steps on the trucks, cheaper to pray that you wont get knee/hip problems huh? Stop telling everyone to "RECORD" their lunch and tell them "TAKE YOUR FULL HOUR LUNCH BETWEEN 1PM-2PM AND PUT IT IN THE DIAD", you aren't fooling anyone with your sneaky way of telling people to skip it. You don't care about safety, please stop acting like you do.

 

[tieguy]

Sure, I'll elaborate for you. All of it is meaningless in the end because you and nobody else in management actually care about safety. You talk this big game with acronyms, keywords and other jargon and then turn around and claim that everything is avoidable. The entire system is built around placing blame on the employee. Of course everything could have been prevented; every fall, every slip, every accident...if you have days and weeks to question the decision made by someone that had one second. Everything that is "taught" at UPS falls under preventive instead of proactive. The company and the management team have absolutely no interest in making the environment at UPS less hazardous ($$$). Instead they sit around a table and dream up ways to blame people for costing them money. So lets recap, instead of spending money to better the operation and reduce the real-time chances of someone getting injured -- they make up rules for free.

Lets take a stroll down memory lane, shall we:

1) Slips in the middle of the back of the truck on the *METAL* floor on a bitter cold icy day. -- Avoidable, 3 points of contact.

- Nevermind the fact the entire length of the floor in the truck should have a antislip coating or industrial rubber on it. That's crazy talk! $$$$$$$

2) Old lady rear ends you at a 4 way stop-sign intersection. -- Avoidable, should have seen her coming in the side mirrors and moved out of the way. See you at the panel.

- What are you kidding me? Yeah, you should of pulled out into the intersection, durrrr.

3) Cut your shin severely getting into the truck. You used 3 points of contact you say? Still slipped up that 21" metal step huh. Well did you look down first...Oh you didn't, avoidable, check your mailbox for a warning letter.

- Who the hell is to say someone wouldn't slip just because they were LOOKING somewhere? Getting the picture yet? Everything is avoidable from behind a desk.

4) You died from carbon monoxide poisoning while driving 65mph and killed a family of 5? Avoidable, you should have sheeted the problem up in the DVIR (which has gone missing since the accident) and shouldn't have kept the doors closed. Oh by the way yobur family isn't going to be taken care of because you were grossly negligent.

- Safety is priority one at UPS. Oh by the way, we dispatched you with 13hrs but nobody can go over 9.5 today, be safe out there.

Prove to the employees that you actually care about safety and then I'll think about reciting UPS poems at 8AM. Get rid of the junkers that leak center manager into the cab. File down all the sharp edges in the truck. Put some real handrails on the sides of the truck. Rubberize the floors. Scrap any truck that doesn't have power steering, aren't you tired of paying out for rotator cuff, cheaper to hope for the best huh? Get rid of high steps on the trucks, cheaper to pray that you wont get knee/hip problems huh?

Wow did you just use the old I won't learn to work safely because I don't think you care about safety excuse?

You're now trying to use someone else as an excuse to not learn to work and drive safely?

Does knowing the material and using that knowledge help you work safely? If it does then who cares what think is in someone elses head?

Just think Griff , if you used the I'm not going to eat because UPS does not care about nutrition excuse then you would starve to death.

 

[Griff]

Wow did you just use the old I won't learn to work safely because I don't think you care about safety excuse?

You're now trying to use someone else as an excuse to not learn to work and drive safely?

Does knowing the material and using that knowledge help you work safely? If it does then who cares what think is in someone elses head?

Just think Griff , if you used the I'm not going to eat because UPS does not care about nutrition excuse then you would starve to death.

I know the material and I put it in action everyday. I'm not learning things word for word because I don't care about passing audits. I know it's a foreign concept, but I simply do not care about numbers or audits of any kind. I'm not refusing to do anything, I'm simply asking for you to stop acting as if you care. Come talk to me after I have an accident or injury, until then go get your ear beatdown over a speakerphone.

P.S. -- I'm glad you didn't bother to deny what everyone knows to be true. (YOU DONT CARE, SO WHY SHOULD I)

 

[tieguy]

I know the material and I put it in action everyday. I'm not learning things word for word because I don't care about passing audits. I know it's a foreign concept, but I simply do not care about numbers or audits of any kind. I'm not refusing to do anything, I'm simply asking for you to stop acting as if you care. Come talk to me after I have an accident or injury, until then go get your ear beatdown over a speakerphone.

Ahh bud I never told you I cared or did not care about your safety. I'm providing you with training that will help you work safer and drive defensively. why do i have to buy you a ring and tell you I love you before you will take to the training?

 

[Griff]

Ahh bud I never told you I cared or did not care about your safety. I'm providing you with training that will help you work safer and drive defensively. why do i have to buy you a ring and tell you I love you before you will take to the training?

Train all you want, keep repeating things until you're blue in the face. I would tell you right to your face, infront of your boss, that I don't care about audits. Audits are your job, not mine. Teaching these rules are your job, not mine. Making sure I can recite these rules verbatim is also your job, if I can't it doesn't effect me. Keep preaching your rules instead of spending a buck, it's noble work your doing.

 

[westsideworma]

I know the material and I put it in action everyday. I'm not learning things word for word because I don't care about passing audits. I know it's a foreign concept, but I simply do not care about numbers or audits of any kind. I'm not refusing to do anything, I'm simply asking for you to stop acting as if you care. Come talk to me after I have an accident or injury, until then go get your ear beatdown over a speakerphone.

P.S. -- I'm glad you didn't bother to deny what everyone knows to be true. (YOU DONT CARE, SO WHY SHOULD I)

I think I understand what Griff is stating as I've said a similar thing before.

Knowing the responses/material word for word doesn't mean you actually use it. You could have a driver who knows the stuff verbatim with accidents and safety concerns galore but is kept on road because he knows those things word for word. Then you'll have a driver with no accidents no nothing get pulled off road because he can't remember the commentaries/rules of backing word for word EXACTLY as it is on sheet but clearly knows them (recites most and or paraphrases the correct response) and is now preloading as a result....is that fair? I don't think it is.

Just knowing them isn't enough, using them should take paramount. I've seen a couple drivers fall into this trap at my building and I think its garbage because both of them, if they keep it up (many many years of safe driving etc), could be circle of honor candidates.

Tie I agree knowing the information is important, but just knowing isn't enough (I know you know that anyways).

 

[Tony31yrs]

Supervisors keep preaching safety and want you stay healthy, but then they have you in the office if you are paid over. There were a lot of routes that had poor time studies and guys would do what they had to do to scratch a route. I worked 27 years as a driver and never hurt myself on the job. I would just give an honest day's work and if they complained about my paid over, I would tell them to come along for a ride while I followed every one of their petty rules. I would usually wind up more paid over. The problem with a lot of guys is that they let the supervisors get to them, to the point where they are on the verge of a nervous breakdown and they would be unsafe to themselves and others on the route.

 

[upsdude]

Let me get this straight, If half or more of the drivers in a center can't recite the safety stuff, does the center shut down? I guess that means the ones that can will be working 20 hour days.

I've been driving 34 years (20+ at UPS), nothing, zero, zip, nada, is on my driving record.

Sorry, never have been very good at reciting stuff word for word and I don’t see me getting any better at it.

 

[Griff]

Let me get this straight, If half or more of the drivers in a center can't recite the safety stuff, does the center shut down? I guess that means the ones that can will be working 20 hour days.

Tieguy gets his ear beat in, that's all that happens. They threaten your job because their job is being threatened over it. Except they can't fire us for it, anybody who says otherwise doesn't know what they're talking about.

 

[looper804]

You have a better chance of being struck by lightning than being terminated for failing a ketter audit, the worst you might recieve is the tourment of watching the 5 star safety video over and over until you get it right and even then a sup will be right over your shoulder whispering the answers to cover his/her ass!

Part time sup in my facility was fired this week for failing to answer the questions asked to her by keder auditor.Not sure if she was ever struck by lightning. LOL

 

[HazMatMan]

Part time sup in my facility was fired this week for failing to answer the questions asked to her by keder auditor.Not sure if she was ever struck by lightning. LOL

Now that's what I call a rebel!!

 

[John Noble]

Knowing the info is good, but after 12 plus hours on the clock it gets hard. Get back to the basics of bringing it in by 9.5. You always saw a lot less injuries and accidents. When they go back to that we will believe they care about safety.

 

[KBlakk]

Part time sup in my facility was fired this week for failing to answer the questions asked to her by keder auditor.Not sure if she was ever struck by lightning. LOL

That's almost deserving how does the "preecher" not know the "sermon"? as for an hourly's punishment being that harsh he/she must have a file cabinet full or warning letters and a Shop Steward that hibernates.

 

[Covemastah]

if your in feeders and have to explain how to drive safely, how the hell did you get into the feeder in the first place???? there are a thousand things we do safely every day but cant explain it all,just do it!!! and when will ups install instructions in the bathroom so we can wipe our butts the safe ups way??? is that next ???? things are getting out of control around here and they ask why is morale so low????

 

[brownmonster]

We are constantly reminded that the dispatch has nothing to do with safety.

 

[tieguy]

Let me get this straight, If half or more of the drivers in a center can't recite the safety stuff, does the center shut down? I guess that means the ones that can will be working 20 hour days.

I've been driving 34 years (20+ at UPS), nothing, zero, zip, nada, is on my driving record.

Sorry, never have been very good at reciting stuff word for word and I don’t see me getting any better at it.

Nice job on the 34 years. Are you the rule or the exception? How do you train those that aren't as gifted as you are on defensive driving?

Most posts here still tend to lose focus and try to turn this thread into a B session on safety.

your points you make are that ups does not do enough for safety. But then as Griff did you try to reject the training they provide you that can help you drive defensively and can help you work more safely.

 

[tieguy]

Tieguy gets his ear beat in, that's all that happens. They threaten your job because their job is being threatened over it. Except they can't fire us for it, anybody who says otherwise doesn't know what they're talking about.

Griff try to show some integrity on this thread. I never threatened anyones job and i spoke out against the concept of threatening to fire someone if they did not learn the information.

 

[tieguy]

if your in feeders and have to explain how to drive safely, how the hell did you get into the feeder in the first place???? there are a thousand things we do safely every day but cant explain it all,just do it!!! and when will ups install instructions in the bathroom so we can wipe our butts the safe ups way??? is that next ???? things are getting out of control around here and they ask why is morale so low????

I'm curious . Can you explain to me how you double clutch or do you just somehow do it?

How about hooking up a set of doubles? Can you explain to me what you do or do you just somehow go out and do it?

Yet somehow you think you drive safely but yet you can't explain how you do it? If you really feel that way then you might want to stop and think about what you are doing. You might in fact have just been lucky up to now.