Open Letter to President of Local 767 Wesley ****

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by texteam33, Jul 7, 2012.

  1. texteam33

    texteam33 New Member

    July 7, 2012

    An open letter to Local Union 767President/Business Manager Wesley ****-

    I can’t help but notice recently how frequent the letters from the Local Union hall are coming. I guess I shouldn’t be surprised since it is, after all, an Officer Election year. I do not doubt that information needs to get out to the members.However, I also have no doubt with an election approaching that these mailings will become more frequent. My request as a dues paying member is that you stick to point of the letter, and refrain from campaigning on the member’s dime.
    To be exact for example, in the letter concerning safety committees, it is stated we should stay united in all issues because our wages and benefits are at risk. What does this have to do with Safety? As a previous member of safety committees,including a time with our newest B.A. Mark ****, I can’t recall ever discussing, during a safety meeting, wages and benefits. I do remember discussing with members that I did not agree with then safety co-chair Mark **** riding around in supervisor’s cars observing drivers. Your letter to the members states this is to never happen. It appears as though after a year the only thing that came out of the “Standing Committee” was an application form. Is this correct?
    This brings me to my next point. Wesley, you closed that letter with a thought on apathy and how it is affecting our country. On this point I do agree. The prevalence of apathy will accomplish an atmosphere of inaction and a sense of frailty within the citizenry. We can find numerous reasons for the apathy in ou rcountry and most of it will be pointed at our leaders. So I ask you, who isresponsible for the apathy in our Local? What apathy you ask? Let’s start with the De-certification of Allied Waste. In the cover of their contract, you thank yourself for the victory. Are you accepting the blame for their de-certification?
    Recently, a postcard saying we need to move our next meeting [in order to accommodate a large crowd] was mailed to every member. I thought the “special funding” to renovate our Local Union hall was to accommodate larger crowds. Are you saying that after spending $1 million we still don’t have what we need? Was this a miscalculation? How much would you have to spend to make the hall able to serve the members? By the way, I am sorry you had to settle for a $4500 desk (lm2reports), I'm sure you had visions of so much more. I know I have not seen a quicker turn around on grievances. I have a two year anniversary approaching on some and still no settlement. You also used this post card to remind us of our upcoming Christmas party (pre-election strategy or just a coincidence?). We didn’t get a postcard last year reminding us that there would not be a Christmas Party because of all the money spent to renovate your office space / hall. We as members made the sacrifices.
    Again,please, get as much information out to the members as possible. However, if you want to campaign, either do it in person or pay for your own mailer, like any slate that opposes you will have to do. I know that this letter will have no meaning to you, but I hope that all who read it will take note of how much mail we receive, and how many times we will see you in our workplaces over the next few months.

    Carlos ****
    Teamsters Local Union 767 Member
    Lasted edited by : Jul 7, 2012
  2. gorilla75jdw

    gorilla75jdw Active Member

    I applaud yir effort on standing up to waste .
  3. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    Our union local sponsors free flu shots every year, which is great, but they send out a mailing to each and every member, which I think is a waste. We have a union bulletin board---all they would have to do is e-mail a copy of the mailing to our shop steward and have him download, print and post the mailing for all to see.

    I also don't like that they sell our mailing list to outside companies, especially insurance companies, which then try to solicit business.
  4. PackageManager

    PackageManager New Member

    Teamsters and UPS all about the money -- look forward to contract negotiations with millionaires on both sides who may have personally nothing really to lose?
  5. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    Nice post---has nothing to do with what I said or the tone of this thread, but nice nonetheless.
  6. bluehdmc

    bluehdmc Well-Known Member

    I'd like to know who sold my name to the Metropolitan Insurance company. I must get at least one mailing a month how they are gonna save me money on car insurance as a "upser".

    I don't think this was the union, I suspect the company did it. I have a neighbor who works for UPS in IT and gets the same crap.
  7. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    I like to take the mailings, stuff all of the paperwork, including the envelope used to send it, in to their return envelope and send it all back to them.
  8. moreluck

    moreluck golden ticket member

    If I get postage-paid envelopes, I cross the info. I put the Family Circle info. into the Home Journal envelope. I send used calendar pages and expired coupons.

    I figure if they want to keep paying postage, I'll play the game. Then they wonder how come their costs skyrocket!!
  9. outta hours

    outta hours Active Member

    I am a long time member of Local 767 of which the OP is referencing. It seems the OP has once again lurked in his own shadow of apathy for the past few years, and has now decided once again that he would like appear out of nowhere in order to ask for answers. He states he is not surprised with frequent mailings because it is an officer election year. I am also not surprised with the content or intention of his post. The OP was a member of a failed slate that opposed the current officers in the last election. The OP left that detail out in spite of his plea and endorsement that our local president and I quote ,"please, get as much information out to the members as possible".

    I will try and address his concerns from where I stand. As a dues paying member who attends as many meetings as I can. That is after all the original purpose for this forum I believe. To discuss and express different view points. Let me preface by stating that I am not an officer, a steward, or a BA of this local.

    1. The safety committees in our area were disbanded because of blatant abuse by the company. I won't discuss all the details here. But the membership complained to the hall. And our Local Officers took action. They stopped all safety committee activities until further notice. It has indeed taking a year just to make sure that the committees are implemented & exist in the correct contractual way. That is the experience of our Local Officers. Not rushing back in to a bad situation, taking the time to do it right. The process of reinstating them has begun and the application we received it part of that process.

    2. The Allied Waste desertification did not occur due to lack of effort of our Local. They put in the time and resources to try and help the Allied members see the light. I wonder if the OP offered his assistance to this cause?

    3. The post card regarding the venue change for the next meeting was indeed to accommodate larger crowds. It is a pre contract meeting. There are over 5000 members in our local. Many like the OP don't attend the monthly meetings. But they will come out at contract time. So a larger space is needed. His argument that the improvements to the property were not enough are foolish. From a business sense. It is more financially responsible to use the bigger venue on a rare occasion when it is needed which is usually contract time. Or would the OP prefer that we pay for a 5000 seat venue for our local hall to hold monthly meetings Not sure what that would cost but that seems financially irresponsible to me. I do know from attending the meetings that the improvements we voted on for our hall have increased the value and the worth of the locals real estate holdings. I have a friend in another local and they are losing money. I am proud that our leadership is financially responsible and our local is increasing in value.

    4. All improvements to the local hall as well as the Christmas party last year, this year, and every year are voted on by the membership. If you were at the meetings you would know. You would also have the chance to vote and, or ask questions about this or any other concerns you have. Be it financial or otherwise. And that way you could have your questions answered by the officers or Ba's themselves. Seems to me that would be the place to voice your concerns as opposed to an open letter on an internet forum. But you really don't want that do you? It is so much easier to hind behind the keyboard and make accusations. A real leader like what we have in 767 is out in front of the people every month at the meetings. Taking whatever questions are directed at him head on. Not here in a forum that only a few may see, and even fewer will take the time to respond.

    5. As for the grievance settlements, I do know that our local membership has been filing and enforcing the contract in record numbers. I know that the company has installed a stall technique to slow down the settlements. I know that because it was discussed at one of our monthly meetings. The purpose of the company slowdown is to try and discredit the local and bring dissension among its members. You have not fallen for that trick have you? I have received a very quick turnaround on some of my grievances. Others have taken a bit longer. I blame the company for that, not the local.

    You ask in closing for the local to get out as much info as possible to the membership. All the information you could possibly need is available each month at the meetings. Come out sometime, you may be surprised at what you learn. A lot has changed since the last time you came to a meeting.

  10. Inthegame

    Inthegame Well-Known Member

    Excellent post "outta". Surprisingly so since you're a mere lowly mortal that hasn't reached the 1000 post mark yet. Anyway, I think Carlos should be thankful he's in a well run local that has improved it's financial picture over the years. Not many have lately. A quick look at Local 767's LM2 shows the leadership/President increasing net assets from $1.7 ml in '09 to over $2.8ml last year. Doesn't look too wasteful to me. Kinda thought Carlos might have been on a challenging (and losing) slate...
  11. texteam33

    texteam33 New Member

    Sorry it took so long to respond. Just got home after another over 9.5 day. Let me start by saying im not hiding behind a keyboard. I put my name out there, the mods edited it. I will say that I applaude your effort in attending meetings. Since you do attend I'm sure you remember how I was often pointed out as a good stewart and an example of what a steward should be. I believe in unions I worked on organizing campaigns. All was well until I disagreed with a few things. First off I'm not ready to write of all the members who do not make it to meetings. Why do they not bring the meetings to the shop floors since the local works for us. I consider it a tragedy that we lost Allied. My point being who is responsible. I was at the meetings when they were saluted for their strength and unity during strike. I agree with your point on the hall, it would be impossible to accomodate if all members showed up. With this in mind how much of the million could we have saved and set aside to rent out spaces as needed.
    But I appreciate the info. Allied decert. not their fault. Spending close to a million and a half to build hall, which could never fit us all good idea. Grievances can only be settled when the company allows it. If I want to see a BA, I have to go to meeting, once a month. I am glad all is well for you, but when I see the company violate the contract and take money out of our brother and sisters pockets, and those in charge of fighting for them, say their hands are tied, I cant stand by and be silent.
  12. outta hours

    outta hours Active Member

    ClosArl1 I responded to your original post. But your subsequent post is nothing but the same. So I will not engage it further. My points on your issues have been made. It is quite obvious the intent of your posts. Even other members of this forum, who are not members of our local were able figure out your intent.

    I did forget one thing in my original reply. I do recall you being at the meeting when the potential improvements to our hall were presented in a power point presentation to the members.It was laid out there for all to see, costs and all. I also remember that when the motion was made to go ahead and update the building there were not any members who voted no. I remember it distinctly because you actually asked a question during the meeting. Which was answered. So why would you vote for and endorse a motion to remodel the hall, only to ridicule and disparage the improvements that you yourself approved? Just a short time later.I think we all know the answer to that.

    I could post a reply to all of your future rhetoric but it is really not worth my time. I will say that the current leadership that we have in Local 767 is the absolute best we have ever had in my 25 + years as a member. Bar none. The numbers prove that. That being said, If you have issues with what's going on down at the hall. I urge you to get involved again. Support our leadership and our union in the best way that you can.
  13. texteam33

    texteam33 New Member

    Outta Hours, I have no doubt that you are a good union member and we need more like you. Being at that meeting, you know that the original number has been almost tripled. My point is in a time when we are having parts of our contract violated under the excuse of a bad economy, and being told we have to sacrifice. How could this spending run this far out of control. If at that meeting we were told the number was going to be over one and a half million, wouldn't you have rather us move to one of the properties in Arlington etc, where at least the property would be worth something? I support our leadership but as members we have an obigation to also hold them accountable. In Solidarity.
  14. outta hours

    outta hours Active Member

    ClosArl1, I do know that when the process for the possible remodel of the hall began that other properties were indeed considered. It was part of the information meeting that was held before even one thing was improved on the current hall. Properties were considered through out the metroplex. With the costs of acquiring a new property, some of which would need major expensive improvements. It was definitely more fiscally responsible to update the current hall. If you were at the meeting then you remember all options were discussed. I applaud our leadership for being so diligent, and exploring all options before making a decision.

    The financial accountability of this leadership is presented every month a the general membership meeting in the form of the trustees report. Which is presented monthly by the secretary-treasurer. Line by line expenses and income are listed for all to hear, discuss, and approve. I think that in your words " holds them accountable".

    You state that parts of our contract are being violated, with UPS that will always be the case. It is each of our own personal responsibility as union members to do all that we can to hold the company accountable. I mean after all we are the union. If there are violations in my work area, I look to myself first to see what can I can do about it.

    I know that our current leadership has done so much to help equip us for the daily battles we face each day at UPS. I have learned so much at the craft meetings held after the general meeting. Where each month the BA's, trustees, and executive board members meet with members from each company within our local. Discussing specific needs or 'hot items" that pertain to each individual company. This is a great service to the membership. This is just one example of the forward thinking of our leaders.

    Our discussions and views we have expressed here, are the type of dialogue that occurs at the monthly meetings. I again urge you to come back to the meetings. Then you can have all of your questions or concerns answered.
  15. Island

    Island Active Member

    I'm in the 767 and I recognize some truths in both arguments being made here. I'm aware of the CHSP letter shenanigans, being a member of CHSP who coincidentally quit not long before the letter was issued. I'll be straight up about it, the co-chairs are all company tools, and the company has this stranglehold on the CHSP which should not exist. A few people have been telling me that in some operations, the union has completely fixed the CHSP but I have yet to see that happening in my building. It's been... quite some time since that letter was issued and we've had a bunch of injuries that the company has been sweeping under the carpet.

    The last time I walked out of a CHSP meeting, it was with sadness and regret, because I got tired of the company's district CHSP people telling me to do one thing and my local management telling me to not do it, and move cardboard instead - and my steward literally couldn't be bothered to give a flying ****. My operation is finally at a point where the CHSP literally does nothing but have meetings where they talk about how they're doing such a great job and pat themselves on the back. Literally. Sometimes I ask my department's CHSP representative the CSA questions: what are your activities to make the workplace more safe? And they're sort of blank, and then mutter about how they do observations, and new hire training, and how they teach the 8/5 to anyone who has trouble and how they do a bunch of cool activities and publications - but every last statement there is a lie, they do nothing. I know this, I was a wellness champion who was repeatedly given shrugs when I very angrily brought up in meetings that XYZ management personnel told me specifically not to do my job.

    If the union is really bankrolling enough to pay for that much printing... well, that's the union's privilege until some sort of measure to find alternative communication methods is voted in. I think wasting paper for redundant communication is silly, and I'll happily vote for alternatives, but the CHSP letter is probably something that would have to be on paper. Clearly some committees are less corrupt than others and if yours is fine, then the union will see that when it eventually gets around to examining it. As for my situation - when my hourly co-chair showed the letter to our management and laughed about how ridiculous it was... well, I won't say what kind words I had in mind for him.

    While I can't fix all of our problems, I can atleast refuse to do what management tells me to do when, for instance, my manager tells me to ignore a pile of bags that are clearly blocking the only ladder at a door where three people are working. If they want to press the issue, they know just how stubborn I can be when I know that the company paperwork clearly says I'm right, so they're in for a good argument. It all starts with the individual. I'd like for the union to print up shirts that quote the company's safety paperwork, specifically lines about how any employee who ignores an obvious safety problem rather than doing something about it is violating their contract, but just like you, Carlos, my individual desires would have to be addressed in a meeting.

    I have a lot of disagreements with what the union does (and what our stewards should be doing but don't), but I know that my opinion no more important than any other worker. This summer I am making time to get to some meetings, if anything just to find out if I can help if the local ever gets around to fixing my shift's CHSP and stopping the tide of people getting hurt for silly reasons.
  16. Island

    Island Active Member

    So, in the swelter of dreaded August, as my center handles not only several malls during the shopping rush but also Gamestop HQ - which is a huge disaster for UPS, I might add - I'll update on some of Local 767's issues.

    None of the CHSP committees for my hub's Preload, Sunrise, Noonday and Twilight shifts have been fixed. There are part-timers working office jobs on behalf of management in Sunrise, going as far as telling other people when to get off the clock, and in general spending entire days faking paperwork and doing observations on other bargaining-unit employees. I'm not sure where the drivers, air drivers and feeders are with their CHSP but ours are committing fraud on a daily basis. Have I mentioned the discrediting of injuries? I did previously, I see.

    For our contract meeting, we met at a hotel. In a room that supposedly had a maximum occupancy of 137, as I recall. We crammed a little less than 200 people in there. A few people were pretty steamed about paying for a space that's not bigger than the hall accommodations but then our illustrious president announced that the hotel would be giving us a real reception, with food. I went out into the reception hall during a discussion unrelated to my job, and ate roast beef and drank gourmet fruit juice. Our local paid a bunch to feel extravagant. I don't think it was necessary. If I want to be pampered, I'll go on a cruise.

    Also, there are still less than a handful of employees in my sort filing grievances. When contract violations occur on a minute-by-minute basis in all departments. I see no vaunted union success in my workplace. I applaud those of you who have strong operations.
  17. Red Dawn

    Red Dawn Member

    My thing is this, the building is nice to look at for the hour or two it is used by the membership for the 10 meeting we will have this year. Is it worth the amount of money that was spent?... In my opinion hell no! It has not speed up the grievances or stopped the same grievances from having to filed over and over. It has not increased the membership. It has not produced new or improved stewards. It has not increased the memberships knowledge of the contract. It has NOT gotten my BA butt out on the shops floor. Nor given our BA the knowledge of details how ups works on the shop floor. It also did not give us any more representation. For that I say it was a waist of money.

    Island- I agree with your comment about safety. I see the same thing. Don't know if you know but at one of the "selected" members that was to come up with rule of the safety Committee works at your hub. Don't know how this guy got on. He was not at the meeting when local asked for volunteers to come up with the dos and don't of safety members. Nor was he at any of the yrs meetings. Think he came to 2 thus year. But anyways, I asked him what did the committee come up with he had no answer. Just you had to a union member and to follow article 18. Witch was put in place back in 08. So I'm lost on what we gave a round of applause at a meeting for there hard work. No disrespect to the others if the did do something but no one can tell me what are the requirements they came up with for safety members. Or what could get you removed. ( outside what was already in place).

    Far as the contract meeting I agree it should been held at the hall. And the could of used the big screen to displace what to write down. Instead of repeating it over and over.
  18. Island

    Island Active Member

    Our "safety" is a joke. I don't even know how many folks have been hurt and the injury numbers aren't even in the logs - management has had a history of giving people paid time off as long as they don't try to make UPS pay their hospital bills. They call it "personal leave" or something. Their way out of telling their bosses how unsafe their operation is. And the committees are completely under their control.
    As for the local... grievances tend to vanish. If my grievance coming up, for being threatened with termination because I file grievances (what a funny thing to file for), vanishes... well, I'm done putting my neck out for the contract when my advocates at the local aren't even trying to stop the company from raising that axe. And the whole damned industry can go to the hot place, my pay isn't worth not sleeping.
  19. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    There is no such thing as "personal leave".
  20. Red Dawn

    Red Dawn Member

    Agree mgr let's them stay in air condition office in exchange for them to do there biding. Our local needs to get there :censored2::censored2::censored2::censored2::censored2: out of there offices and get on the shop floor. Then they could see its time for the stewards that don't stand up show be removed and replaced! But what do you expect when ba tells the stewards that the best ones are the ones that don't say anything. Just sit and had them grievance papers and walk away. Your steward will not even drop off your grievances. How many complaints about him have fallen on death ears.