SurePost - A Subcontracting Violation that has led to the loss of many UPS jobs.

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by InsideUPS, Sep 9, 2012.

  1. InsideUPS

    InsideUPS Active Member

    The IBT has apparently made some type of single handed "Extra Contract Agreement" with UPS to allow a significant portion of UPS volume to be delivered by the USPS. (SurePost)

    QUESTION: What have been the negative ramifications of allowing UPS to subcontract bargaining unit work to the USPS in the form of SurePost?

    ANSWER: UPS is currently engaging in a nationwide plan of reducing full time driving positions with the help of SurePost. Our center for example has reduced the number of driving positions by almost 30% in the past several years. Retiring drivers are no longer being replaced. Routes are being expanded for the remaining drivers in a loop resulting in 10-12 hour days. SurePost has been expanding rapidly within our UPS center. Initially, only packages that were 10 lbs. and under (smalls) were designated for SurePost delivery. Currently, the size limit of SurePost appears to have expanded to much larger sizes and weights.


    1) If the IBT does not re-negotiate their (our) position on subcontracting UPS final delivery work, many part-time employees will be delayed even longer from entering full-time UPS driving positions.
    2) Current drivers will continue to work 10-12 hour days as their routes expand. Much of the "SurePost" work was the "icing" in a drivers day (raising stops per on road hour).
    3) Supervisor Reductions - Less drivers means less need for driver supervisors. UPS has already replaced many "Real" supervisors with "Specialists" that are generally low paid and do not receive stock incentives.
    4) Contract Negotiations - gone are the days of using a nationwide work stoppage (strike) to increase bargaining power. UPS easily has the technology and final means of delivering packages in the event of a strike.

    CONCLUSION: I for one want UPS to be prosperous and successful. I feel however that our current CEO (Mr. Scott Davis) has strayed far from the core UPS principles set forth by James E. Casey back in 1907. 10 Million + dollar salaries and incentives do not sit well with many of Mr. Davis's employees....both hourly and management. Corporate greed at the top has led to a multitude of problems within many UPS centers across the country. Morale is at an all time low, frustration and anger is at an all time high..... and service is certainly not what it used to be.... Hopefully a new 2013 contract will include a change at the top for UPS also.. As for the IBT......Mr. hall....don't subcontract our work to an entity that cannot make a profit and reflects poorly on UPS workers in the final delivery of customers packages....
  2. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt Dark Prince of Double Standards Staff Member

    Good God! You sure you wouldn't rather ask about where to get UPS socks?

    Actually, without SurePost, there would be less full-time Driver positions and even less part-time positions.
    This has been discussed ad infinitum ... y'all have fun.
    I'm sure someone will inform you of the correct consequences of cutting back on SurePost.
    At least your Union executives understand this and they, of course, will continue to allow UPS to use SurePost contracts to keep UPS volume from being diverted to FedEx.
  3. InsideUPS

    InsideUPS Active Member

    Just to clarify for those that may misinterpret my views on SurePost, the CONCEPT of SurePost is a wise decision on the part of our UPS Corporate leadership. The ABUSE of SurePost is what I am against. While it makes perfect business sense to let the U.S. Postal Service make final delivery on (Remote) SOME small packages in RURAL areas, it makes NO sense to give the USPS packages which are in URBAN areas. For example, many times our drivers have stops for the same customer in which a SurePost package is being delivered to. Although I don't have an MBA from Wharton, I believe it would make more business sense to keep the profits of delivering such packages rather than sharing them with our competitor.

    Our center statistics do not show that SurePost has preserved full-time driver positions. Since the inception of SurePost, we have had a 30% reduction in the number of full-time drivers. Routes have been expanded, overtime is at an all time high, and quality and service is at all time low.

    As far as the socks... OT..
  4. gotbrown

    gotbrown New Member

    I Agree completely, over the past year the sure post has more than doubled in my center, and i can tell you from my route alone i know that almost 1/2 of the sure post I drop at the post office I deliver daily to those areas. and sometimes once a week I deliver to the home and the post has the package sitting there i dropped off to the post office the day before. So where is the business sense here? My route and many at my center have felt like its been peak for months. the routes are heavier and heavier, are they using the sure post to keep from adding routes and more f/t positions? I believe surepost is good for ups and the union when properly used not abused.
  5. bigblu 2 you

    bigblu 2 you Active Member

    surepost must die
  6. beentheredonethat

    beentheredonethat Well-Known Member

    Keep in mind, at the time of shipment the shipper and the carrier have no way of knowing if there will be a pkg going to the same address from another customer. They, the shipper, address it to our consignee (the USPS). There is a reason UPS started Basic, which has morphed to Surepost. It is because FDX bought a company that did this and rebranded it Smartpost. SHippers wanted and needed a lower cost option to deliver the packages. UPS was losing a lot of resi volume to FDX Smartpost. UPS fought back and offered Surepost. The good part is that we stopped many customer from diverting from UPS ground to FDX Smartpost, while also maintaining their air volume. (Often when a shipper migrates volume to FDX, they migrate all the volume). We won large customers from FDX by offering Basic\Surepost. Take LL Bean, we won the business that was FDX's for almost 20 years. They wouldn't have switched if it was 100% ground due to cost. We won on average 40,000 pkgs per day, granted many of them are BAsic\Surepost, but many are also ground, also 1K a day are NDA. If we got rid of Basic\Surepost, we would lose all that volume.

    I 100% agree with you if UPS was the only shipper in existence. We aren't, we have very good competition that offers very very competitive rates and a variety of services in FDX. We need to compete against them, if we don't match them in this category, FDX will take all the volume.
  7. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt Dark Prince of Double Standards Staff Member

    You work for FedEx?
  8. Coldworld

    Coldworld Taking it all back.....

    just wait until the post office lays off thousands of employees and cuts back big time on rural areas...makes their customers come into town to pick up mail(which already happens in some areas) fedex will have to pick up that volume again along with ups...
  9. packageguy

    packageguy Well-Known Member

    I asked my IE guy, what up with the post office. He said I " the agreement we have with the post office is smalls and under 10 pounds. I said okay, but why am I getting
    oversize and packages and 45 to 50 pounds. He did not know what to say. He said he would look into, that's not suppose to happen.
  10. superballs63

    superballs63 Well-Known Troll Troll

    I've heard from more than one SUP that the reason behind SurePost is to first, offer a comparable service to FedEX and Second, we have our eyes on ALL of their business when they inevitably fold.
  11. upsyo

    upsyo Member

    If the address is for a PO Box the packages can weigh up to 70 lbs I believe
  12. pretzel_man

    pretzel_man Well-Known Member

    I'm not aware of a size limitation on surepost to be just smalls.

    Here is a UPS link on Surepost:
    About UPS SurePost
  13. packageguy

    packageguy Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the link, IE tells you things that you want to beleive, thats just not true. thanks again
  14. The Other Side

    The Other Side Well-Known Troll Troll

    This kind of logic is the reason why our volume is being diverted to the USPS. For those who want to come forward to claim that by accepting surepost pkgs into our system, we somehow are preventing FEDEX from taking the pkgs, but those same people either dont understand the market or just want to ignore a simple fact.

    FEDEX also diverts it pkgs to the USPS called Smartpost.

    Its the same concept. Take volume out of the system and reduce hours, drivers, use of equiptment, blah blah blah...

    FEDEX Smartpost is resulting in fewer fedex drivers on the road, work days cut to zero overtime and the delaying of replacement drivers.

    Smartpost and Surepost, is a scam on our system, and the teamsters at the National level DROPPED THE BALL on this issue and it needs to be addressed in these negotiations.

    This year, UPS will be dropping TRAILERS at the post office during peak, thats right, 40 foot trailers jammed packed with BOXES, not smalls, not bags, not rural deliveries. INstead, its OS2, OS3 pkgs that belong in the UPS system.

    UPS is deliberately attempting to reduce our delivery volume and benefit from everything that comes along with it.

    To say that our volume is going to FEDEX if we dont offer surepost is just dishonest.


  15. pretzel_man

    pretzel_man Well-Known Member

    Isn't there a point that you are NOT taking into account???

    Customers are asking for this service? These are NOT ground packages that UPS is diverting to the USPS. These are a different class of service for customers who are asking for a lower cost, no frills service.

    What would you say to them? Would you say sorry, we have ground and that's it. UPS delivery or no delivery?

    Like it or not (I don't) customers want this. UPS is responding.
  16. Buck Fifty

    Buck Fifty New Member

    You are seriously brainwashed. Moderate that !!!
  17. Buck Fifty

    Buck Fifty New Member

    You must go to the same brainwashing class as Hoax !
  18. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt Dark Prince of Double Standards Staff Member

    Y'all go ahead and thrash around with gnashing teeth while I smirk at you.

    In a way, I wish UPS would eliminate Surepost so y'all could reap the fruits of your labor.

    Unfortunately, your Union leadership can think and would never do something that stupid that would result in the loss of Union jobs.

    They want your dues, you know.

    I was going to say something like, "I didn't know you ever slinked out of Current Events or the Union forum." and then I noticed this is in the Union Forum.
    Jokes on me I guess! LOL ... but in a smug way.
  19. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt Dark Prince of Double Standards Staff Member

    One thing we all know for sure is that your brain has never been washed!

    Bless your heart!
  20. pretzel_man

    pretzel_man Well-Known Member

    If you can't attack the facts, go ahead and attack the person.....