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MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Care to embellish?

The courier who is the lead plaintiff (Clausnitzer) lives in Florida and used to post on another site that I no longer patronize because it is a front for lawyers seeking cases. I've communicated with him in the past, and the Age Discrimination class action is still in the pipeline. In fact, I believe that the US Supreme Court had to rule whether or not the suit could even be brought because it hadn't been filed withing the usual required timeframe. FedEx lost, and as far as I know, the suit is proceeding. According to him, this is why Best Practices disappeared. FedEx supposedly designed the whole BPP program as a means of ridding the company of older couriers who couldn't make the numbers, hence the age factor inherent in the suit.

Many of us here have long thought that FedEx does it's best to eliminate older workers who are at top of range and more likely to be injured or out with health issues.
 
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bbsam

Moderator
Staff member
Class-action law suit=lawyers get rich. But if you heard it on a web-site, it's gotta be true, right?:happy-very:
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Class-action law suit=lawyers get rich. But if you heard it on a web-site, it's gotta be true, right?:happy-very:

Not on a website...from the horse's mouth. FedEx fought like Hell to have the Supremes drop the case, and it didn't work. The gears of justice turn slowly.
 

quadro

Well-Known Member
The courier who is the lead plaintiff (Clausnitzer) lives in Florida and used to post on another site that I no longer patronize because it is a front for lawyers seeking cases. I've communicated with him in the past, and the Age Discrimination class action is still in the pipeline. In fact, I believe that the US Supreme Court had to rule whether or not the suit could even be brought because it hadn't been filed withing the usual required timeframe. FedEx lost, and as far as I know, the suit is proceeding. According to him, this is why Best Practices disappeared. FedEx supposedly designed the whole BPP program as a means of ridding the company of older couriers who couldn't make the numbers, hence the age factor inherent in the suit.

Many of us here have long thought that FedEx does it's best to eliminate older workers who are at top of range and more likely to be injured or out with health issues.
Is Clausnitzer's case still going on? All the info I can find on it is at least a couple of years old and I think it was originally filed back in 2006.

I don't condone discrimination of any type and if a manager or managers are guilty then they deserve what they get. Whether or not FedEx actively engages in age discrimination is what the courts will decide (or possibly already have decided). Personally, I haven't seen it but that doesn't mean it hasn't happened.

Best Practices hasn't disappeared. Not sure where you got that idea from. Possibly your station doesn't do a good job of using it, but it's still there. The funny thing about that is that BP methods are designed to make things consistent throughout a company (FedEx isn't the only company that has best practices). They are designed to make a procedure or process efficient and minimize the work (effort) required to do that procedure or process.

I think the irony of the whole thing is that the law says you cannot treat people over 40 differently as that is discrimination. So you treat them the same as the people under 40 and then you get someone over 40 saying I cannot do those things and I want you to treat me differently.

I would bet that we all know older couriers in our stations that can run rings around the newer and younger couriers. I think the reality of it is just that as we get older some of us have bodies that deteriorate quicker than others. Unfortunately, that puts some people in a position where they simply cannot do the job the same way they used to. You cannot have different goals and standards based on peoples ages so you get caught in a catch-22.

As for eliminating older workers, in the last year I attended the 25 year purple celebration luncheon and I was amazed at how many people there were just in my district that had 25 years of service. If FedEx is eliminating them, they're not doing a very good job.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Is Clausnitzer's case still going on? All the info I can find on it is at least a couple of years old and I think it was originally filed back in 2006.

I don't condone discrimination of any type and if a manager or managers are guilty then they deserve what they get. Whether or not FedEx actively engages in age discrimination is what the courts will decide (or possibly already have decided). Personally, I haven't seen it but that doesn't mean it hasn't happened.

Best Practices hasn't disappeared. Not sure where you got that idea from. Possibly your station doesn't do a good job of using it, but it's still there. The funny thing about that is that BP methods are designed to make things consistent throughout a company (FedEx isn't the only company that has best practices). They are designed to make a procedure or process efficient and minimize the work (effort) required to do that procedure or process.

I think the irony of the whole thing is that the law says you cannot treat people over 40 differently as that is discrimination. So you treat them the same as the people under 40 and then you get someone over 40 saying I cannot do those things and I want you to treat me differently.

I would bet that we all know older couriers in our stations that can run rings around the newer and younger couriers. I think the reality of it is just that as we get older some of us have bodies that deteriorate quicker than others. Unfortunately, that puts some people in a position where they simply cannot do the job the same way they used to. You cannot have different goals and standards based on peoples ages so you get caught in a catch-22.

As for eliminating older workers, in the last year I attended the 25 year purple celebration luncheon and I was amazed at how many people there were just in my district that had 25 years of service. If FedEx is eliminating them, they're not doing a very good job.

Maybe some of Fred's money found it's way into Clausnitzer's pocket. My last email conversation with him was via FedExaminer.com, but that was at least 2 years ago. Once I stopped posting there (because it's run by lawyers looking for business), I didn't hear from him any more. If anyone out there knows him, have him drop by the BrownCafe and fill us in. Hey, vantexan, you used to post there? Do you remember his "handle"?

Also, I don't hear anyone actively referring to "Best Practices" at all these days. One day we had an auditor at the station when I was doing a flex route taking everyone's baseline packages. The senior manager and the auditor were hovering over me and being critical because I wasn't using the approved 4-square "BP" method for sorting my OL's and Paks. I explained that because I literally got my stuff 2 or 3 pieces at a time as the people I was helping sorted through their truck, that "BP" methods didn't make sense for what I was doing.

It finally sunk-in that a blanket, one-size-fits-all prescription doesn't always make sense for all situations. Neither of them knew what the Hell they were doing anyway because they'd never been couriers. Par for the couse at FedEx.
 
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vantexan

Well-Known Member
Hardly visit Fedexaminer anymore. Name doesn't ring a bell. I know a courier who was fired in Florida awhile back that got himself listed on the age lawsuit. BBSam is probably right, only the lawyers will make money most likely.
 

quadro

Well-Known Member
Maybe some of Fred's money found it's way into Clausnitzer's pocket. My last email conversation with him was via FedExaminer.com, but that was at least 2 years ago. Once I stopped posting there (because it's run by lawyers looking for business), I didn't hear from him any more. If anyone out there knows him, have him drop by the BrownCafe and fill us in. Hey, vantexan, you used to post there? Do you remember his "handle"?

Also, I don't hear anyone actively referring to "Best Practices" at all these days. One day we had an auditor at the station when I was doing a flex route taking everyone's baseline packages. The senior manager and the auditor were hovering over me and being critical because I wasn't using the approved 4-square "BP" method for sorting my OL's and Paks. I explained that because I literally got my stuff 2 or 3 pieces at a time as the people I was helping sorted through their truck, that "BP" methods didn't make sense for what I was doing.

It finally sunk-in that a blanket, one-size-fits-all prescription doesn't always make sense for all situations. Neither of them knew what the Hell they were doing anyway because they'd never been couriers. Par for the couse at FedEx.
I know this will shock you to some extent but I agree with your point about one-size-fits-all. That doesn't make BP wrong and keep in mind that BP is something that many business use because it makes sense in theory and often in practice. There are always exceptions as indicated by your example. As flex routes are normally few, the methods will work on most routes.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
I know this will shock you to some extent but I agree with your point about one-size-fits-all. That doesn't make BP wrong and keep in mind that BP is something that many business use because it makes sense in theory and often in practice. There are always exceptions as indicated by your example. As flex routes are normally few, the methods will work on most routes.

Blanket methods only work on paper. We do it by the book when the auditors come, and then go right back to the old ways after the show is over. Maybe in theory, but not in practice...too many variables.
 

Cactus

Just telling it like it is
Blanket methods only work on paper. We do it by the book when the auditors come, and then go right back to the old ways after the show is over. Maybe in theory, but not in practice...too many variables.

You got that right.

The way some of our vehicles are loaded is a big joke but then again when someone has 4 vehicles to load the results are always gonna be subpar.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
You got that right.

The way some of our vehicles are loaded is a big joke but then again when someone has 4 vehicles to load the results are always gonna be subpar.

I love the old video from Station One that shows the packages coming down the belt both slowly and uniformly in terms of size, as in all are Courier-Pak boxes, OL's or CP Envelopes. The Management Training Drone (MTD) carefully selects each one and places it in perfect stop order according to service level. In the real world, you have everything crammed on the belt, from 150# crates to tiny 1 lb boxes, all varying in service, which might or might not need to be mixed with pure P1. Then you have bulk shipments, which might make doing it "by the book" impossible. You're lucky if it all even fits. Or, as you said, you might be doing 4 trucks, so none of this will ever happen because each truck has a random pile in the back that the poor courier has to sort-out when he/she gets to the vehicle. BP? What a joke!!

More "blanket" ideas for a job that is chock-full of variables.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
And conceived by people that have never done the job.

But hey it looked good on paper! :funny:

Engineers and managers who have never been couriers are always the best source for new and brilliant ideas that "improve" FedEx. Put any of them on the road for a week and all of the calculations would change drastically. Management via cubicle never works very well.
 

FedEx2000

Well-Known Member
I love the old video from Station One that shows the packages coming down the belt both slowly and uniformly in terms of size, as in all are Courier-Pak boxes, OL's or CP Envelopes. The Management Training Drone (MTD) carefully selects each one and places it in perfect stop order according to service level. In the real world, you have everything crammed on the belt, from 150# crates to tiny 1 lb boxes, all varying in service, which might or might not need to be mixed with pure P1. Then you have bulk shipments, which might make doing it "by the book" impossible. You're lucky if it all even fits. Or, as you said, you might be doing 4 trucks, so none of this will ever happen because each truck has a random pile in the back that the poor courier has to sort-out when he/she gets to the vehicle. BP? What a joke!!

More "blanket" ideas for a job that is chock-full of variables.

I agree that the old videos all used to be like that, but the current STA1 instructors that do the videos are making them much more realistic these days. I know one of them very well, and I used to give him crap about that stuff all the time. Like when they processed a DBX and everything was powershippped....now they actually throw a few airbills in....not every box is a FDX medium box, etc. And he was actually a courier, so he knows how it works. But from the sounds of it at your station you probably haven't seen any videos made the past few years since you haven't heard anything about BP in a while.
 

FedEx2000

Well-Known Member
Engineers and managers who have never been couriers are always the best source for new and brilliant ideas that "improve" FedEx. Put any of them on the road for a week and all of the calculations would change drastically. Management via cubicle never works very well.
I couldn't agree more, Engineers should be required to do a certain amount of checkrides each year...in addition to completing courier class.
 

DOWNTRODDEN IN TEXAS

Well-Known Member
We have an engineer that used to be a manager and when he started making some changes, the most affected couriers asked him to go on the road to show why his changes were not great ideas...he flat out refused claiming it's not part of his job description.

Engineer...that's the job I think I want to do now, since the training departments are almost completely gone, or at least it seems that way. Painfully obvious that experience is "nice but not necessary.."
 

Cactus

Just telling it like it is
We have an engineer that used to be a manager and when he started making some changes, the most affected couriers asked him to go on the road to show why his changes were not great ideas...he flat out refused claiming it's not part of his job description.

No big surprise there.

Heaven forbid they leave the comfort of their cubicle.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
No big surprise there.

Heaven forbid they leave the comfort of their cubicle.

It's easy to think up ways to make couriers more productive when your fat ass is in a $500 office chair in a climate-controlled cubicle. It may be -30 in Duluth, but the engineer doesn't see anything but a computer screen that says Courier X in Duluth isn't making goal. He/she isn't smart enough or aware enough of the variables inherent in the job. Nobody understands until they actually do it.
 
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