Our Fantastic Healthcare

[59 Dano]

Perhaps, Van. But I find it thoroughly nauseating that a country the size of Cuba has an infinitely better and more equitable health care system.

They don't.

If we're so great, why do we let our citizens starve or die in the streets?

Wanna take a stab at how much we spend on anti-poverty programs?

And here, if you dissent too loudly you risk being harassed by the FBI, IRS or other agencies.

And there, they throw you in jail for it.

If Cuba has such a poor healthcare system, it's hard to see why the U.S. Falls far behind in infant mortality.

Probably has something to do with our abortion rate being so far behind theirs.

 

[59 Dano]

VanT: What do you think should be done with the poor who have no insurance and no money but also need healthcare? Should health care become the exclusive domain of the wealthy elite?

Hey, how about ANOTHER government program to make it cheaper!!

 

[vantexan]

VanT: What do you think should be done with the poor who have no insurance and no money but also need healthcare? Should health care become the exclusive domain of the wealthy elite?

What I would've done in place of Obamacare is either build clinics, or lease existing buildings, around the country to provide healthcare for the poor. I'd pay for doctors' educations in exchange for some years working at low pay in those clinics. Same for registered nurses. How much people would pay for such service would be according to their income, but it would be at lower cost than private healthcare. Maybe the competition would bring down their costs a bit too. That's just my unlearned take on it, there are probably better ways to go. The system I'm proposing is pretty much what the government does on Indian reservations. Or maybe something similar to the V.A..

 

[bacha29]

Van you are still talking about huge sums of public money. Remember too many of the doctors in V.A. hospitals are there only long enough to fulfill any obligations to Uncle Sam with regard to the cost of their education. It is also the reason why you see so many foreign born doctors working in depressed rural areas in the U.S. Your friend Cruz promises to repeal Obamacare but has yet to provide the details to the alternative he keeps talking about and the Trump plan according to the Congressional Budget Office will cost 30 billion dollars a year more to operate than Obamacare and still leave 20 million Americans with no health insurance. It will be like it was before. People with no insurance waiting until they are gravely ill then go to the ER which is the most expense form of health care in existence leaving them destitute before Medicaid has to step in. 86% of a personal bankruptcy's in this country was once attributable to catastrophic medical bills. The goal is to bring that down.

 

[dezguy]

You frame the argument unfairly. Cuba isn't full of "Commies", it's controlled by Communists. At it's height most citizens of the Soviet Union weren't card carrying Communists, but they were controlled by that party. Let me ask, does Cuba develop life saving medicines for numerous diseases and conditions? Does it invent technology that allows doctors to diagnose and treat illnesses? Furthermore is it under the observation of the World Health Organization? If not then any claims about it's infant mortality or whatever are suspect. I'm sure their doctors do a fine job with what they have. But their system tells people what kind of treatment they can get, when they can get it, and limits how much they can get. That's the difference between their's and our's. But without a doubt our system needs an overhaul. Obamacare isn't what it needed because to cover the poor it put the costs on others. It's a huge drag on an already hurting middle class.

http://www.wired.com/2015/05/cimavax-roswell-park-cancer-institute/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/cuba-medical-innovations_us_56ddfacfe4b03a4056799015

Cuba may be a small, relatively poor country but it's not like they're in the stone age when it comes to medicine and medical innovation.

 

[vantexan]

Van you are still talking about huge sums of public money. Remember too many of the doctors in V.A. hospitals are there only long enough to fulfill any obligations to Uncle Sam with regard to the cost of their education. It is also the reason why you see so many foreign born doctors working in depressed rural areas in the U.S. Your friend Cruz promises to repeal Obamacare but has yet to provide the details to the alternative he keeps talking about and the Trump plan according to the Congressional Budget Office will cost 30 billion dollars a year more to operate than Obamacare and still leave 20 million Americans with no health insurance. It will be like it was before. People with no insurance waiting until they are gravely ill then go to the ER which is the most expense form of health care in existence leaving them destitute before Medicaid has to step in. 86% of a personal bankruptcy's in this country was once attributable to catastrophic medical bills. The goal is to bring that down.

But you don't do it by hindering everyone else. Obamacare isn't designed to continue to work as is, it's designed to destroy the health insurance industry and leave the gov't as the single payer. When that happens the quality of our healthcare will erode over time.

 

[vantexan]

http://www.wired.com/2015/05/cimavax-roswell-park-cancer-institute/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/cuba-medical-innovations_us_56ddfacfe4b03a4056799015

Cuba may be a small, relatively poor country but it's not like they're in the stone age when it comes to medicine and medical innovation.

That's 3. How does that compare with us? I never said they're using leaches or sawing off arms or whatever. There's a Cuban clinic in Nicaragua that does free eye surgery, for example. But it was suggested they are infinitely better than we are. Just not so.

 

[dezguy]

That's 3. How does that compare with us? I never said they're using leaches or sawing off arms or whatever. There's a Cuban clinic in Nicaragua that does free eye surgery, for example. But it was suggested they are infinitely better than we are. Just not so.

You asked for medical advances pioneered by Cuba. I provided. I'm not saying they are the be all, end all of medicine but their medical sector certainly isn't primitive and is actually fairly advanced given the fact they are a relatively poor country.

 

[vantexan]

You asked for medical advances pioneered by Cuba. I provided. I'm not saying they are the be all, end all of medicine but their medical sector certainly isn't primitive and is actually fairly advanced given the fact they are a relatively poor country.

When did I say they were primitive? It was said they are infinitely better than the U.S.. Just not so.

 

[FedExPseudoWife]

People were all over Ted Kennedy when he brought up the idea of expanding Medicare into a nationwide single payer system. How could it have been any worse than what we have now?

Been lurking for a while, never posted before now (plse don't kill me immediately As a 'Pseudowife' in a state which doesn't recognize "common law marriage" [unless already established in a state that does] and a medicare recipient [involuntary SSDI] all I have is "Medicare" - which is basically useless because it pays for almost nothing, had huge hospital-related deductibles, and takes $110 a month directly out of my benefis before I even see them. I could otherwise save for a couple-three months an use to actually SEE a doctor. I know you FedEx/Express guys got hit in the gut w/the employer health plan changes for those w/families/dependants, but fwiw, for a 'single' guy, no dependants, what Himself has here is like the damn golden yellow brick road by comparison - both in coverage, price, and in re deductibles/exclusions. But for those otherwise on the other side of that 'single guy' line - the recent changes and premiums/deductibles/coverages totally and completely suk.
jwfiw.

PS. added for clarification: I have been deemed and diagnosed "medically disabled" since about 1992.

 

[fatboy33]

Perhaps, Van. But I find it thoroughly nauseating that a country the size of Cuba has an infinitely better and more equitable health care system. If we're so great, why do we let our citizens starve or die in the streets? And here, if you dissent too loudly you risk being harassed by the FBI, IRS or other agencies.

I know a son of Cubans who left Cuba. He says, Cuba has no homeless issues. If a person needs bone marrow surgery, cancer treatments or anything, they have it...for free. The waiters and maids in Cuba are living great. The tips they received add up to more than their government paychecks. Then you have the Cubans who receive money from their families in Miami an other parts of the world. They live a great life. Do they all drive 4 series BMW's? No but they have what they need. Says a lot about the Great US of A when the lowest Cuban has happier than some Americans over their heads in debt. Greed will ruin America, unless something changes and we all know nothing ever will.

 

[59 Dano]

I know a son of Cubans who left Cuba. He says, Cuba has no homeless issues. If a person needs bone marrow surgery, cancer treatments or anything, they have it...for free. The waiters and maids in Cuba are living great. The tips they received add up to more than their government paychecks. Then you have the Cubans who receive money from their families in Miami an other parts of the world. They live a great life. Do they all drive 4 series BMW's? No but they have what they need. Says a lot about the Great US of A when the lowest Cuban has happier than some Americans over their heads in debt. Greed will ruin America, unless something changes and we all know nothing ever will.

Would you trade situations with an average Cuban?

 

[dvalleyjim]

Is this comment directed at me or just whomever in general?

Sorry. don't know who you are just stating that healthcare was not a monthly, yearly worry. You had it and didn't think about it. Now with the new healthcare I have to send forms every month, and year and get constant emails.

 

[Route 66]

They live a great life. Do they all drive 4 series BMW's? No

No, but they do all drive around in classic '57 Chevys - and that's pretty cool!

 

[MassWineGuy]

Money doesn't equal happiness. Just ask a UPS driver.

 

[MAKAVELI]

Money doesn't equal happiness. Just ask a UPS driver.

I don't see any UPS drivers that would switch to FedEx. Just ask one.

 

[vantexan]

Money doesn't equal happiness. Just ask a UPS driver.

Sure makes it easier to get by.

 

[bacha29]

Say what you want but I think Ted Kennedy was right when he called for an expansion of Medicare to cover all Americans. It has to be more efficient and give Americans what they want and that is to free from the economic ruination that a catastrophic medical event can bring.

 

[fatboy33]

Would you trade situations with an average Cuban?

My situation no. A 55 year old American making 30K having to find a way to pay for his daughter heart surgery...I think he would.

 

[burrheadd]

Money doesn't equal happiness. Just ask a UPS driver.

It's better to have money and not need it
Than to need money and not have it