Discipline for not knowing the dumb questions (depth of knowledge)

tourists24

Well-Known Member
It really isn't difficult. It's no different as working as directed. If you do it on the road,it's not difficult to remember if you think about while you're doing it and you are on the clock. Take backing for instance. How hard is it to think as you are doing it? How hard is it at an intersection to look left,right,left. We do this automatically and the whole point of the DOK is we all get comfortable,and that leaves margin for error or distraction. I've avoided an average of five accidents a month lately, I've done this because of the methods and DOK and I think about them so much as I'm doing them, that I can recite when neccessary. I do it to cover my ass myself and not the union having to if it came to that.
Its nice you see it this way but trust me,,,, it IS different for some people to recite them back out from memory. What argument can you make for a 26 year safe driver that cant recite them on demand.
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
Its nice you see it this way but trust me,,,, it IS different for some people to recite them back out from memory. What argument can you make for a 26 year safe driver that cant recite them on demand.

The more important argument would be...why should he even have to in the first place?

 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
Imagine....

Imagine if every "Safety Committee" at every operation nationwide decided to network among themselves, grow a pair and start making demands to the company rather than simply complying with silly word games and audits.

Imagine if the "United Safety Committees of UPS" issued the company an ultimatum...to immediately remove from service every remaining package car that lacks power steering and a 3 point seat belt. The penalty for failure to comply with said ultimatum; the immediate disbandment of all Committees nationwide, along with a group letter to OSHA explaining the reasons for disbanding, and instructions to every single driver nationwide to FAIL the next Keter audit or Commentary/DOK/acronym regurgitation.

UPS has spent a lot of money, effort and time trying to get us to regurgitate their drivel. Its obviously quite important to them to pass the audits and look good on the reports. I would rather see that money, time and effort expended on things that actually matter...like ergonomic and safety improvements to equipment, and addressing egress and overcrowding issues in facilities. If our "safety committees" really wanted to, they could force the company to address these issues in a meaningful way, as sort of a quid pro quo for our willing participation in the DOK/commentary/acronym regurgitation that is such a high priority to the company. I know its a pipe dream, but perhaps some day it could come true.
 

kingOFchester

Well-Known Member
Imagine....

Imagine if every "Safety Committee" at every operation nationwide decided to network among themselves, grow a pair and start making demands to the company rather than simply complying with silly word games and audits.

Imagine if the "United Safety Committees of UPS" issued the company an ultimatum...to immediately remove from service every remaining package car that lacks power steering and a 3 point seat belt. The penalty for failure to comply with said ultimatum; the immediate disbandment of all Committees nationwide, along with a group letter to OSHA explaining the reasons for disbanding, and instructions to every single driver nationwide to FAIL the next Keter audit or Commentary/DOK/acronym regurgitation.

UPS has spent a lot of money, effort and time trying to get us to regurgitate their drivel. Its obviously quite important to them to pass the audits and look good on the reports. I would rather see that money, time and effort expended on things that actually matter...like ergonomic and safety improvements to equipment, and addressing egress and overcrowding issues in facilities. If our "safety committees" really wanted to, they could force the company to address these issues in a meaningful way, as sort of a quid pro quo for our willing participation in the DOK/commentary/acronym regurgitation that is such a high priority to the company. I know its a pipe dream, but perhaps some day it could come true.
Sober,

I think you know I have respect for you and a lot of the knowledge you share on BC. I don't always agree with you, but do respect you.

I can only respond by what I see in our building. What I say is the truth for my Center. I can tell you that a higher percentage of our drivers are in their trucks sorting, loading and picking off missloads at least 30 minutes prior to start time. I know for a fact that over 10% of the drivers are in their trucks 1hour before start time. I can name 2 drivers that are in their trucks 2 hours ahead of start. One who prerecords his entire truck. Every part time sup loads trucks every single day. They do sorting. They do pick off. The better part of their day is spent doing union work. Just recently, thanks to a fellow driver in my center and a poster here on BC, have I stopped going in my truck before the start time other then to put my lunch bag in the truck. I would guess that a big percentage of the drivers skip their entire lunch. Most skip at least part of their lunch. Supervisors shuttling work is the norm. I could go on and on. Our building truly is a free for all and pretty much everyone is their for themselves. This is not what the union was suppose to be about, but yet it is what it is. I am a member of the safety committee. There are several reasons why I am on the committee. 1) I get paid for my time. It helps me pay my bills. It helps to fill in the gap when I quit my full time job to go driving and in progression. I was making more part time and working full time another job when I started at UPS driving. If, our center looked out for one another and followed the contract, then I would of a much harder time being on the committee. I have been told before that I should make a stance. That sounds all well and good, but not so much in reality. Before I went driving, their was a driver that followed the contract to the T. He became a Steward and pushed to get poeple out of their trucks in the AM. He pushed to get the drivers to follow the contract. He lasted a very short time as the drivers didn't want a part of what he was trying to do.

So, as wrong as it may be, as self centered it is, as hypocrtical it may be......I am at UPS to make money for me. I now follow the contract. I don't finger friend' my truck. I am taking my lunch, but if UPS wants to pay me extra to hand out papers in the AM, so be it. In my center it is pretty much every man for them self. People do not want to help out fellow drivers. They don't want to follow the contract unless it benefits them. So I will continue to extract as much money as I am able to.

Oh 2nd reason I do safety, I like to help the new drivers. A lot of who I worked part time with.
 
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happybob

Feeders
Don't feed the troll.

Whatever, my point was that you can call it BS, or drivel, but the DOK isn't going away any time soon. You can hate it, think it's stupid or believe it is a conspiracy but you have an employer that pays you 80 grand a year and wants you to know it. One of the first things I learned 35yrs ago from an old Teamster was when you stop banging your head against a wall it feels good.

$100,000 per year, thank you very much!
 

happybob

Feeders
Sober,

I think you know I have respect for you and a lot of the knowledge you share on BC. I don't always agree with you, but do respect you.

I can only respond by what I see in our building. What I say is the truth for my Center. I can tell you that a higher percentage of our drivers are in their trucks sorting, loading and picking off missloads at least 30 minutes prior to start time. I know for a fact that over 10% of the drivers are in their trucks 1hour before start time. I can name 2 drivers that are in their trucks 2 hours ahead of start. One who prerecords his entire truck. Every part time sup loads trucks every single day. They do sorting. They do pick off. The better part of their day is spent doing union work. Just recently, thanks to a fellow driver in my center and a poster here on BC, have I stopped going in my truck before the start time other then to put my lunch bag in the truck. I would guess that a big percentage of the drivers skip their entire lunch. Most skip at least part of their lunch. Supervisors shuttling work is the norm. I could go on and on. Our building truly is a free for all and pretty much everyone is their for themselves. This is not what the union was suppose to be about, but yet it is what it is. I am a member of the safety committee. There are several reasons why I am on the committee. 1) I get paid for my time. It helps me pay my bills. It helps to fill in the gap when I quit my full time job to go driving and in progression. I was making more part time and working full time another job when I started at UPS driving. If, our center looked out for one another and followed the contract, then I would of a much harder time being on the committee. I have been told before that I should make a stance. That sounds all well and good, but not so much in reality. Before I went driving, their was a driver that followed the contract to the T. He became a Steward and pushed to get poeple out of their trucks in the AM. He pushed to get the drivers to follow the contract. He lasted a very short time as the drivers didn't want a part of what he was trying to do.

So, as wrong as it may be, as self centered it is, as hypocrtical it may be......I am at UPS to make money for me. I now follow the contract. I don't finger friend' my truck. I am taking my lunch, but if UPS wants to pay me extra to hand out papers in the AM, so be it. In my center it is pretty much every man for them self. People do not want to help out fellow drivers. They don't want to follow the contract unless it benefits them. So I will continue to extract as much money as I am able to.

Oh 2nd reason I do safety, I like to help the new drivers. A lot of who I worked part time with.

So you want to add a few more extra dollars to your pay check? Those supervisors you see loading and finger friend.ing the trucks in the morning, file a damm grievance and get paid lots of extra money for sups doing bargaining unit work. Those company kiss a.. drivers loading, sorting, finger fing their trucks in the a.m. file a grievance forcing the company to pay them for the time they are working in the truck, and file to get yourself paid if any of them are juior to you. You are right, its all about the bejamins, and the more you file the more you make.
 

Bubblehead

My Senior Picture
It really isn't difficult. It's no different as working as directed. If you do it on the road,it's not difficult to remember if you think about while you're doing it and you are on the clock. Take backing for instance. How hard is it to think as you are doing it? How hard is it at an intersection to look left,right,left. We do this automatically and the whole point of the DOK is we all get comfortable,and that leaves margin for error or distraction. I've avoided an average of five accidents a month lately, I've done this because of the methods and DOK and I think about them so much as I'm doing them, that I can recite when neccessary. I do it to cover my ass myself and not the union having to if it came to that.
:hypnosis:
 

Indecisi0n

Well-Known Member
Imagine....

Imagine if every "Safety Committee" at every operation nationwide decided to network among themselves, grow a pair and start making demands to the company rather than simply complying with silly word games and audits.

Imagine if the "United Safety Committees of UPS" issued the company an ultimatum...to immediately remove from service every remaining package car that lacks power steering and a 3 point seat belt. The penalty for failure to comply with said ultimatum; the immediate disbandment of all Committees nationwide, along with a group letter to OSHA explaining the reasons for disbanding, and instructions to every single driver nationwide to FAIL the next Keter audit or Commentary/DOK/acronym regurgitation.

UPS has spent a lot of money, effort and time trying to get us to regurgitate their drivel. Its obviously quite important to them to pass the audits and look good on the reports. I would rather see that money, time and effort expended on things that actually matter...like ergonomic and safety improvements to equipment, and addressing egress and overcrowding issues in facilities. If our "safety committees" really wanted to, they could force the company to address these issues in a meaningful way, as sort of a quid pro quo for our willing participation in the DOK/commentary/acronym regurgitation that is such a high priority to the company. I know its a pipe dream, but perhaps some day it could come true.

I am on the committee and i agree that for the most part it's a joke. Every serious topic i bring up gets shot down or is told "we will look into it" knowing that nothing will be done. I come in early and hand out papers that end up in the trash can. Oh well sounds like a fun way to start my morning.
 

menotyou

bella amicizia
I am on the committee and i agree that for the most part it's a joke. Every serious topic i bring up gets shot down or is told "we will look into it" knowing that nothing will be done. I come in early and hand out papers that end up in the trash can. Oh well sounds like a fun way to start my morning.
I ended up quitting. The extra hours were cool, but when they tried having me sit in on disciplinary stuff, I drew the line.
 

Indecisi0n

Well-Known Member
I ended up quitting. The extra hours were cool, but when they tried having me sit in on disciplinary stuff, I drew the line.

I enjoy answering the questions and helping the new guys out but once it is expected of me to "rat" out other drivers I will quit.
 

Indecisi0n

Well-Known Member
It's ridiculous that they spend thousands of dollars training us and retraining the training, yet spend millions trying to catch us being human.

Was posted on these forums: Funny how we are all squeaky clean in order to get hired and after that occurs we suddenly all become thefts.
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
I am on the committee and i agree that for the most part it's a joke. Every serious topic i bring up gets shot down or is told "we will look into it" knowing that nothing will be done. I come in early and hand out papers that end up in the trash can. Oh well sounds like a fun way to start my morning.

I dont have a problem with someone being on the "safety committee" to make a few extra bucks, as long as that person can be honest and accept the fact that nothing that they do on the committee will ever actually matter. I have considered doing it myself, but I would rather get the extra sleep in the morning.
 
A

anonymous6

Guest
Management people "somehow" have to justify their jobs.... And paycheck.... Everyday....


it's the same psychology of prison guards vs prisoners. if you google that relationship . it is very interesting stuff. sociology experiments have been done between college students who were all friends at the beginning and then split into two mock groups... one guards and one prisoners.

at the end of the experiment both groups hated each other.


orangputeh
 
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Covemastah

Hoopah drives the boat Chief !!
I WOULD NEVER answer to a Unoin member quizzing me on anything on safety!!
This is out of control,,are they union members or German collaboraters like the Vichy French ???
 

menotyou

bella amicizia
I WOULD NEVER answer to a Unoin member quizzing me on anything on safety!!
This is out of control,,are they union members or German collaboraters like the Vichy French ???
I know Indecis0n's heart is in the right place. They were happy to accept my resignation as I had opinions that they didn't want me expressing to the new DM. I still haven't met him. I know I will, though. I know I will.
 

Indecisi0n

Well-Known Member
I WOULD NEVER answer to a Unoin member quizzing me on anything on safety!!
This is out of control,,are they union members or German collaboraters like the Vichy French ???

Not all members (centers) are like this. The only "audits we do is a shoe audit where we check off if someone has the right shoes/boots. There is no name associated with the check list. Funny when i do it everyone passes :happy-very:Again I answer noobs questions and handout little check lists. That is pretty much my safety job and I enjoy it.
 

jaker

trolling
Well today I am supposed to go to the safety zone for my monthly crap intake for the next 3 days , I wonder what It will be over

It still amazed my how our job is to deliver pkgs , but they hold us up in the morning with safety or stupid start time crap and then complain why we are in late
 
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