Drivers, know your worth

[The Brown Shadow]

good. We can make sure out best in class compensation package keeps with inflation. We shouldn’t accept a pay cut.

Just as long you realize that they will be paid for with lay offs. Is that an acceptable outcome?

 

[tadpole]

We can look across the landscape and see that UPS employees have best in class compensation. That is thanks to the Teamsters for sure. But there are way too many people saying “look record profits, gimme gimme gimme.” Those record profits were mostly due to Covid and the shift to e-commerce in 2020. There is a history of shipping companies going belly up. After this strike probably many employees will be on lay off for the next couple of years.

If our raises keep falling short of inflation, this won't be such a good job any more.

 

[Memester]

Just as long you realize that they will be paid for with lay offs. Is that an acceptable outcome?

I’m low seniority and would likely be one of the ones laid off

So yes

 

[The Brown Shadow]

If our raises keep falling short of inflation, this won't be such a good job any more.

Agreed.

But I believe in picking your battle and compromise. Do we want big raises for PT or FT or for everybody. If your answer is “everybody” than it prolly means strike. Which means UPS will have less profits the next couple of years. The up side will be that the gimme gimme gimme crowd will not have as persuasive argument next contract.

 

[The Brown Shadow]

I’m low seniority and would likely be one of the ones laid off

So yes

What job you do?

 

[BadIdeaGuy]

Agreed.

But I believe in picking your battle and compromise. Do we want big raises for PT or FT or for everybody. If your answer is “everybody” than it prolly means strike. Which means UPS will have less profits the next couple of years. The up side will be that the gimme gimme gimme crowd will not have as persuasive argument next contract.

We are a brotherhood.

It’s time we acted like one.

 

[RangerMan06]

Agreed.

But I believe in picking your battle and compromise. Do we want big raises for PT or FT or for everybody. If your answer is “everybody” than it prolly means strike. Which means UPS will have less profits the next couple of years. The up side will be that the gimme gimme gimme crowd will not have as persuasive argument next contract.

The only people getting let go or laid off will be management and corporate. After this contract we'll be busier than we've ever been uncloging this mess. UPS will have to hire more hourly due to no forced sixth punch and to avoid 4x penalty pay on 9.5s.

 

[Cowboy Mac]

TLDR You don’t deserve to avoid our bad govt leaders decisions by demanding higher pay. We got it better than all other shipping employees. Let’s keep those good things for future employees too.

Longer version:
Everybody has less disposable funds because of the current inflation. I am not special and “deserve” to avoid that by demanding a wage increase. We all could avoid that by demanding our govt to have accountability in finances. But nobody cares about that I guess.

As a feeder driver I have better wages, time off, and medical benefits than any other driver out there. I want to keep those for me and all future UPSers.

The fact is that the currency is never going to deflate so we need raises to keep up with inflation. $50/hour sounds ridiculous at first but when you put it into perspective, the average starting wage in 1930 was $0.43/hour. Prices go up over time. Wages go up over time.

Also this contract is not just about feeder drivers, this is about all employees wages and working conditions. Feeders is like a whole other world than package car and part time work. You really do have it good as a feeder driver. I’m saying this as someone who covers in feeders.

But what about the people coming up, we need to make it better for them. Create more opportunities for feeder positions. Make the package car driver position more bearable. Better wages for Part Timers so maybe instead of having to work a full time job and PT at UPS, maybe they can work 2 PT jobs while they put their time in to go driving.

 

[I have NOT been lurking]

We are a brotherhood.

It’s time we acted like one.

Not until a certain generation retires

 

[The Brown Shadow]

The only people getting let go or laid off will be management and corporate. After this contract we'll be busier than we've ever been uncloging this mess. UPS will have to hire more hourly due to no forced sixth punch and to avoid 4x penalty pay on 9.5s.

That is not how it was in 97. I was low seniority driver and on lay off a bunch the next 2 years. I would displace 2 PT workers when I bumped into the warehouse. We barely hired any pkg car drivers the 5 years following the strike.

I completely agree with making pkgs more bearable. That is why I am feeder now. You can’t get it all and that is why we are going to strike, because people think we can get it all.

 

[The Brown Shadow]

The fact is that the currency is never going to deflate so we need raises to keep up with inflation. $50/hour sounds ridiculous at first but when you put it into perspective, the average starting wage in 1930 was $0.43/hour. Prices go up over time. Wages go up over time.

Also this contract is not just about feeder drivers, this is about all employees wages and working conditions. Feeders is like a whole other world than package car and part time work. You really do have it good as a feeder driver. I’m saying this as someone who covers in feeders.

But what about the people coming up, we need to make it better for them. Create more opportunities for feeder positions. Make the package car driver position more bearable. Better wages for Part Timers so maybe instead of having to work a full time job and PT at UPS, maybe they can work 2 PT jobs while they put their time in to go driving.

I worked pkgs for 24 years. And I worked PT here too doing every job in the warehouse at some point. I regularly clean up after unmotivated pt workers all the time—most feeders don’t, but hey I am part of the team.

 

[RangerMan06]

That is not how it was in 97. I was low seniority driver and on lay off a bunch the next 2 years. I would displace 2 PT workers when I bumped into the warehouse. We barely hired any pkg car drivers the 5 years following the strike.

With all due respect that was before internet and people wanting their packages ASAP.
Also add in the fact that the biggest supplement will no longer be required to take 1hr lunches, adding to the 9.5 problem. And an increase of SUREPOST. There is just no way around UPS not hiring more employees.

 

[Cowboy Mac]

I worked pkgs for 24 years. And I worked PT here too doing every job in the warehouse at some point. I regularly clean up after unmotivated pt workers all the time—most feeders don’t, but hey I am part of the team.

So do you have anything to say about the other points I brought up? I’m not saying you haven’t done your time. I’m still doing mine, but I don’t see why we can’t make it easier for those coming up.

 

[The Brown Shadow]

With all due respect that was before internet and people wanting their packages ASAP.
Also add in the fact that the biggest supplement will no longer be required to take 1hr lunches, adding to the 9.5 problem. And an increase of SUREPOST. There is just no way around UPS not hiring more employees.

With all due respect I been talking to drivers and supervisors and we have been losing lots of accounts with not 1 day of striking, just the threats. Just wait for the fall out and you will see. After we catch up following the strike there will be ramifications.

 

[The Brown Shadow]

So do you have anything to say about the other points I brought up? I’m not saying you haven’t done your time. I’m still doing mine, but I don’t see why we can’t make it easier for those coming up.

I meant this for you:
I completely agree with making pkgs more bearable. That is why I am feeder now. You can’t get it all and that is why we are going to strike, because people think we can get it all.

Pick and choose what you want. We can’t have it all.

Me? I say end 22.4, keep progressive raises at status quo this time, increase starting PT to $20. Everything else status quo, because we really have it good.
And extra 9.5 penalty provisions would be good too. Excessive OT is a problem.

 

[RangerMan06]

With all due respect I been talking to drivers and supervisors and we have been losing lots of accounts with not 1 day of striking, just the threats. Just wait for the fall out and you will see. After we catch up following the strike there will be ramifications.

I agree UPS strategy of dragging this out will cost them business and already has. I just have no faith in our competition keeping it. Especially with peak around the corner

 

[The Brown Shadow]

I would also like to see driver starting wage increased to $27 with jumps of $5 each year until they are top scale. Ideally the starting wage would increase with annual raises.

 

[The Brown Shadow]

I agree UPS strategy of dragging this out will cost them business and already has. I just have no faith in our competition keeping it. Especially with peak around the corner

Fed Ex makes new accounts sign 1 year contracts. Then they increase their shipping rates on that company after the year is over. Use that as a strategy to get new accounts next year.

 

[Cowboy Mac]

I meant this for you:
I completely agree with making pkgs more bearable. That is why I am feeder now. You can’t get it all and that is why we are going to strike, because people think we can get it all.

Pick and choose what you want. We can’t have it all.

Me? I say end 22.4, keep progressive raises at status quo this time, increase starting PT to $20. Everything else status quo, because we really have it good.
And extra 9.5 penalty provisions would be good too. Excessive OT is a problem.

I can agree that we can’t have it all. At least right away. At this point I would be okay with a little bit less of a raise than we are expecting but take care of the PTers (starting wage and catch up raises). Plus all the other things we already have agreements on.

That would get us 80% of the way to where we need to be, and we can push the rest of the way in the next contract. I’m more focused on things that have long term benefits, that will stay in the contract long term. IE: air conditioning and heat issues, ice and water, excessive overtime protections.

I feel like wages are fleeting and if you waste so much bargaining leverage on starting pay, you have to do it all over again next contract because of inflation.

I prefer to get everything we want without a strike. But we shall see what happens this week.

 

[RangerMan06]

Fed Ex makes new accounts sign 1 year contracts. Then they increase their shipping rates on that company after the year is over. Use that as a strategy to get new accounts next year.

FedX Has too many problems to count. They can take all the business they want on paper but they can hardly service their accounts now.