Fred Says: "Live Within Your Means"

[vantexan]

Just scraping by? No, we just prioritize. We have fun, trust me. But doing the fun stuff requires that we don't do cable, or drive a fancier car, and we have to SAVE. Our tax return does not buy fancy new toys...it goes into our savings account.

Like others have said, corporate greed has gotten ridiculous. In places like Australia and Europe, many business owners live in normal houses and live average lives. They don't abuse their employees like employers in America. However, way too many people are reliant on the government for aid, and that is crippling our country. Go ahead and tell me its because of low wages...but if you're carrying around a cell phone with a data plan, driving a car that's less than 5 years old, eating fast food more than twice a week, and buying unnecessary electronics, please don't blame your lack of money on other people. Live on a budget that requires a few sacrifices and THEN complain. And when that happens, I'll side with you. But people in Africa live on less than $2 a day and have dirt floors and eat one meal a day - usually cassava mush or rice and beans. They're probably thinking of us Americans as greedy. "Do they really need two cars per family? And three meals a day plus snacks plus drive thru food? You mean to tell me that ALL have clean beds? And I've never seen a movie, but they watch them every day?" Perspective, guys.

And for the record, if you're working a full time job AND are on welfare, you're breaking the law. Just saying.

While many in Africa get by on $2 a day that doesn't mean people here could do the same unless they are homeless. Things cost more here. We should however, whether here or in Africa, be always striving to better the lives of average citizens. Pretty tough to do in countries that are corrupt from top to bottom. Those people living on $2 a day aren't doing it because they want to. And rather than thinking we're all being extremely excessive and wasteful they are wishing they could be in a wealthy country too. I agree that constantly buying the latest and greatest this or that is a bit excessive but being able to buy things that enhance our lives is a reward for the hard work we put in. That's the flip side of living in a wealthy country. The $2 a day African has time to visit with family and friends and isn't putting in long structured days being pushed to be more productive. We on the other hand spend our lives hustling to just cover the basics, too often stressed to hold everything together. With some jerk acting like he'll take it all away if we don't jump through his hoops. Perspective indeed.

 

[sjh]

I agree with a lot of this, but your initial write up still sounds like scraping by. Your making some expenses sound very exuberant which I don't necessarily agree, they aren't necessities but come'on we are Yankee's right? There is also a perspective that we have a standard of living above others, no matter what standards some other country has. Should we accept Africa's standards because they can survive doing it? It just isn't a popular thought, however staying within your budget is, yours is just a low one.

Haha, read that again. I can imagine those corporate CEO's saying this same thing while eating caviar at their formal dining room. "There is also a perspective that we have a standard of living above others, no matter what standards [our employees] have. Should we accept [their] standards because they can survive doing it?"

My point is not to say we need to live in $2 a day, but to remind people that we live in the land of excess. I completely agree with you, TUT, when you said you should be "going forward financially instead of backwards." Well-worded. And I don't disagree with anyone that FedEx is stingy beyond belief and doesn't respect it's little minions. Trust me, we've been burned at the stake by them. I guess I have a lot of current, relevant back story with this subject, so I'm ultra-passionate at the moment, haha. That back story includes two very close families to us who have reached the point that they cannot pay their bills. One just nearly lost her house, and yet when she recently got a chunk of money (workmans comp settlement), her first instinct was to spend it on herself. She can't even work her job anymore! It irks me to hear people complain, but not willing to sacrifice. Both families complain that its a lack of income that prevents them from being able to pay their bills. I tend to disagree, considering both these families make similar incomes to us.

TUT - I'm not sure what part of my write-up sounds like scraping by? Was it the cell phone with no data? We both have iphones, but I struggle with the folks that have all the things listed on my aforementioned list, but complain that they can't afford their house payment. And I'm not implying you can't have any of those things. Just be sure you can afford the REAL necessities first before you make those a priority and than complain you can't afford to make it.

As for my budget being low? Haha, I said it was about priorities. But I'll think it over again during my week-long family vacation to Disney after Christmas. And the second trip in June. Or maybe I can discuss it with my husband when we're lying on the beach in the Caribbean during our anniversary in May. Or perhaps I'll get to it sooner, like when I'm on vacation in September. The likelihood, though, is I'll think about it while I'm scraping by painting my own nails while watching a Netflix movie and eating a home-cooked meal.

 

[TUT]

Haha, read that again. I can imagine those corporate CEO's saying this same thing while eating caviar at their formal dining room. "There is also a perspective that we have a standard of living above others, no matter what standards [our employees] have. Should we accept [their] standards because they can survive doing it?"

My point is not to say we need to live in $2 a day, but to remind people that we live in the land of excess. I completely agree with you, TUT, when you said you should be "going forward financially instead of backwards." Well-worded. And I don't disagree with anyone that FedEx is stingy beyond belief and doesn't respect it's little minions. Trust me, we've been burned at the stake by them. I guess I have a lot of current, relevant back story with this subject, so I'm ultra-passionate at the moment, haha. That back story includes two very close families to us who have reached the point that they cannot pay their bills. One just nearly lost her house, and yet when she recently got a chunk of money (workmans comp settlement), her first instinct was to spend it on herself. She can't even work her job anymore! It irks me to hear people complain, but not willing to sacrifice. Both families complain that its a lack of income that prevents them from being able to pay their bills. I tend to disagree, considering both these families make similar incomes to us.

TUT - I'm not sure what part of my write-up sounds like scraping by? Was it the cell phone with no data? We both have iphones, but I struggle with the folks that have all the things listed on my aforementioned list, but complain that they can't afford their house payment. And I'm not implying you can't have any of those things. Just be sure you can afford the REAL necessities first before you make those a priority and than complain you can't afford to make it.

As for my budget being low? Haha, I said it was about priorities. But I'll think it over again during my week-long family vacation to Disney after Christmas. And the second trip in June. Or maybe I can discuss it with my husband when we're lying on the beach in the Caribbean during our anniversary in May. Or perhaps I'll get to it sooner, like when I'm on vacation in September. The likelihood, though, is I'll think about it while I'm scraping by painting my own nails while watching a Netflix movie and eating a home-cooked meal.

SJH your plan for you sounds great and always there are leasons like that we all should have to a point, certainly. It took many years for my wife to settle down and really understand the value of a $ and how instant gratification is like a quick sugar high. We also have one family we are friends with where the wife is out of control and is exactly what you write about, spends on junk, always complains, can't see herself and what she is doing....

I also wanted to answer your questions on "how I concluded scraping by", perhaps I am wrong, but I will answer your question from your original post.

-We rent, but we rent cheap
-I menu plan every meal,
-And we save for every purchase.
-For example, $9 every month gets put into our savings account so we can pay our annual Costco membership
-we do the same for our car insurance, etc.
-We drive an inexpensive, paid-off car
-and one complete beater.
-Eat out maybe twice a month as a family, and then groupon our dates.
-The only movies we ever go out to see are drive-ins with the kids a couple times a year.
-We don't have cable - just netflix.
-If I spend too much, that's it. I did that with food last month. but my kids will eat oatmeal

To me that looks like you have to really plan each month for survival (or in your case taking from your unemployment nest egg) on things that aren't luxury imo. There are some nice little things in there, but far from being spoiled and over the top. I'd like to see you have a bit more breathing room than that, perhaps not even doing more than what you are doing today, but not having to crunch numbers often to know you can do the above without really looking into you ledger, knowing you have it covered no sweat.

Now if I am wrong it must be a cultural/comprehension/expectations difference and for that I apologize. But to me it's all good as this is what a public forum is about, this is very anonymous and we get to compare ideas and get blunt replies.

And my last words in my first reply. That is not what a strong economy makes. What you are doing are signs of a weak economy. To me you sound wonderful and deserve even just a wee bit more, but then again you do have several months in the bank... Eh what do I know...

 

[DontThrowPackages]

SJH your plan for you sounds great and always there are leasons like that we all should have to a point, certainly. It took many years for my wife to settle down and really understand the value of a $ and how instant gratification is like a quick sugar high. We also have one family we are friends with where the wife is out of control and is exactly what you write about, spends on junk, always complains, can't see herself and what she is doing....

I also wanted to answer your questions on "how I concluded scraping by", perhaps I am wrong, but I will answer your question from your original post.

-We rent, but we rent cheap
-I menu plan every meal,
-And we save for every purchase.
-For example, $9 every month gets put into our savings account so we can pay our annual Costco membership
-we do the same for our car insurance, etc.
-We drive an inexpensive, paid-off car
-and one complete beater.
-Eat out maybe twice a month as a family, and then groupon our dates.
-The only movies we ever go out to see are drive-ins with the kids a couple times a year.
-We don't have cable - just netflix.
-If I spend too much, that's it. I did that with food last month. but my kids will eat oatmeal

To me that looks like you have to really plan each month for survival (or in your case taking from your unemployment nest egg) on things that aren't luxury imo. There are some nice little things in there, but far from being spoiled and over the top. I'd like to see you have a bit more breathing room than that, perhaps not even doing more than what you are doing today, but not having to crunch numbers often to know you can do the above without really looking into you ledger, knowing you have it covered no sweat.

Now if I am wrong it must be a cultural/comprehension/expectations difference and for that I apologize. But to me it's all good as this is what a public forum is about, this is very anonymous and we get to compare ideas and get blunt replies.

And my last words in my first reply. That is not what a strong economy makes. What you are doing are signs of a weak economy. To me you sound wonderful and deserve even just a wee bit more, but then again you do have several months in the bank... Eh what do I know...

Not too bad for the so called richest country in the world. The problem is, no....one of the problems are, there's no limit set. Years ago, high taxes levied on anyone making insane amounts of money made it non advantageous to make so much. Everything that stood in the way of greed as been eliminated. Some will say this is fine because its capitalism. Back in this countries infancy, capitalism was making men wealthy at the expense of the slave. Today we are the modern day slave. Really? " I mean if I dont like the job I can quit and go somewhere else". You mean, go from one slave owner to a little more "nicer" one? The modern day CEO/slave owner only gives you the illusion of being free. The original slave had a roof over his head, food, clothes, a wife and kids. I see not a lot of difference in your budget list and how slaves lived over 150 years ago. The slave had no money but he didnt need it because the slave owner provided for his basic necessities. You do have money but you must use it(all/most) to provide for your basic necessities. We are all free people here but we live like slaves and it will only get worse.

 

[sjh]

Wow, do I really sound that poor?

TUT - no worries on the blunt replies. But maybe I need to clarify more. My husband and I are not poor. If you haven't picked up from other threads, we own multiple FedEx routes, worth quite a lot where we live. We've kept our income lower than most (and avoided a pay raise for 3 years) so we can pay off business debt. We'd rather sacrifice now and reap the rewards later. What we pay in debt right now equates to a 6-figure salary, and in January it will nearly all be gone.

But I guess, in your eyes, what would make me appear less poor? A car payment? More restaurant receipts? In my eyes, we live debt-free in one of the best cities in America, in one of the better neighborhoods in that city, eat really well, have a good savings, paid-off cars, own a business where my husband gets to be home with our kids quite a bit, and we travel...and we do all that an average income. We don't "crunch" numbers, and we're not barely getting by. We don't have to live paycheck to paycheck But we DO spend our money wisely instead of freely. And that's my underlying point. Don't complain about your income until you're doing everything YOU can to make it work for you.

And as for a weak economy? We employ 9 people full-time and pay an insane amount in taxes as a result. I think we're doing our fair share to strengthen the economy, yeah? =)

 

[TUT]

duped

 

[TUT]

Wow, do I really sound that poor?

TUT - no worries on the blunt replies. But maybe I need to clarify more. My husband and I are not poor. If you haven't picked up from other threads, we own multiple FedEx routes, worth quite a lot where we live. We've kept our income lower than most (and avoided a pay raise for 3 years) so we can pay off business debt. We'd rather sacrifice now and reap the rewards later. What we pay in debt right now equates to a 6-figure salary, and in January it will nearly all be gone.

But I guess, in your eyes, what would make me appear less poor? A car payment? More restaurant receipts? In my eyes, we live debt-free in one of the best cities in America, in one of the better neighborhoods in that city, eat really well, have a good savings, paid-off cars, own a business where my husband gets to be home with our kids quite a bit, and we travel...and we do all that an average income. We don't "crunch" numbers, and we're not barely getting by. We don't have to live paycheck to paycheck But we DO spend our money wisely instead of freely. And that's my underlying point. Don't complain about your income until you're doing everything YOU can to make it work for you.

And as for a weak economy? We employ 9 people full-time and pay an insane amount in taxes as a result. I think we're doing our fair share to strengthen the economy, yeah? =)

Yeah I'll just file it under personality/limits of medium differences.

Here is what I find ideal lower level for quality American living.

-Own a $100k to 200K house
-$125 at the grocer a week on avg
- Each adult has a car, car value of 12K'isn when bought, good for 7 years.
- Eat out when we have the fancy, but also know in our minds there is a limit.
- Have a $125 cable/internet bill.
- Catch a movie now and again, like eating out, sort of have an internal limit on what is reasonable for you.
- Put money away into some type of retirement, that is straight from the paycheck. And carry a rainy day fund that you like to keep a couple to several K in it.
- Don't have to save for yearly renewals, the monthly budget has enough left over for misc things of that nature.
- When paying the bills, have the income to cover it, review credit balances that they aren't escalating. Same as checkbook, that it stays positive and preferably growing.
- One solid vacation per year. Figure $2500 overall cost.

This is a system where you figure out your means, and each month you do a quick check of checking and credit to see how you done. If a large unexpected expense happens or what have you... then you buckle down a month or two.

Hey you aren't wrong by any means and from your replies as you say you got income, your first list just sounds like you really had to budget hard to make it. It's just how you like to grind it, there is never nothing wrong with staying on top of it, but I'd like to be a bit more loose and just know how I can live day to day without total micromanagement.

Another core principal. The next generation should do better than the last and the older generation should expect that and not ever say "kids these days", because really it is "adults these days". This isn't spoiled (in general) this is technology enhancing lives and breaking down barriers. To bad we are failing here at this time.

 

[sjh]

Touche.

I can see how my first list sounds stingy, but we choose to live like that because it has its own rewards. But sorry, a $100-$200k house?? That's laughable. Here you'd be living in a 1 bedroom condo in the ghetto for that amount. Our rent equates to a $250-$300k mortgage, and that's considered cheap here. =)

Thanks for the discussion. I'd have to say in the big picture, we tend to disagree; we just have different paths getting there.

 

[TUT]

Touche.

I can see how my first list sounds stingy, but we choose to live like that because it has its own rewards. But sorry, a $100-$200k house?? That's laughable. Here you'd be living in a 1 bedroom condo in the ghetto for that amount. Our rent equates to a $250-$300k mortgage, and that's considered cheap here. =)

Thanks for the discussion. I'd have to say in the big picture, we tend to disagree; we just have different paths getting there.

As anyone knows, house cost does depend on area, however there are more places in the US where 100k to 200k easily buys you a moderate house. But as you say some places that isn't possible, myself I'm at 350K for 2000 square.

 

[TUT]

I found this pretty funny. It is a McDonalds budget tool for their employees:
We Have Some Problems With Visa’s Sample Budget For McDonald’s Employees – Consumerist

 

[EffOff]

Things aren't any better at the FedExOffice end either. Over a decade of service and I barely make $30,000 a year. Work like a damn dog. Have sustained injuries thanks to the job. "Insurance" is a freaking joke ($1000 deductible, give me an effing break). Meanwhile everything has gone up, rent, services, food, gas...little things Freddy boy doesn't have to worry about. This isn't a job for idiots either. Experience counts a LOT in order to keep jobs from getting effed up, but Fred and company don't care about that. We're McDonalds-level employees as far as he's concerned. Screw him and screw Fedex. No wonder new hires skip out within months.

 

[EffOff]

You can find ways to save money, its just getting family on board to agree to cuts. Cutting down on eating out and restricting "on demand" movies saved quite a bit after you realize just how much you were spending.

Oh, that's rich. Where I work, I don't know anybody below ass't manager who still has cable. People have cut to the bone. Get real.

 

[EffOff]

I'm sorry but budget all you want, when everyday items like milk cost 1.75 gal in 2007, and now tops 3.50+ per gal, and Gasoline was ~1.99 in 2007 and now 3.40+- When you look at Cost of living, it has skyrocketed, so have corporate earnings, yet employee wages are stagnant to the point that our purchase power has actually decreased. Because of the cost of living increases and healthcare costs, I actually earn LESS than I did in 2007!

Sure you can feed your family Ramen noodles, and dollar store burgers. For friend's Sake we live in America a supposed 1st world country, and people with FULL time jobs are on Welfare because they can't afford healthcare or to put food on the table, something is wrong, and it has mostly to do with corporate greed.

AND government interference. To make everything "fair", don't you know.

 

[EffOff]

That's the ole american dream... just scraping by. Good for your frugalness, but it doesn't really make a strong economy.

Yeah, let's hear it for the working poor...

 

[EffOff]

As long as they have theirs, it's all good. We're just the worker bees that "make it happen". This is Tea Party Capitalism taken to it's logical extreme...how are you liking it?

The heck you talking about? The Tea Party doesn't rule this country. The Redistributioner-In-Chief and his minions do, at present, spending like mad and sicking the IRS on their political opponents while the Grand Old pusillanimous just flail around trying to be like Democrats. The Tea Party is talking about a tax revolt, and I'm listening. I'm still paying taxes on a car I already paid taxes on when I bought it. Social Security is set up to make damn sure you die before you get what you are owed, so the gov't can spend all that good money on pork. The gov't has turned into Jabba the Hutt, gobbling revenue and keeping the lot of us in chains. Taking our money away and spending it on crap, to make things more "fair". Thanks to gov't mismanagement the dollar is toilet paper and inflation has reduced what was once a decent salary into poverty-level subsistence. Don't blame a three-year-old political movement for the crappy job situation. It began long ago, probably with FDR, positively with LBJ's "Great Society", and Mr. Hope and Change and the castrated opposition party are making things worse.

 

[Hate 150lb Packages]

Things aren't any better at the FedExOffice end either. Over a decade of service and I barely make $30,000 a year. Work like a damn dog.
​

I fear it's the same for each opco. There are no red headed step children in Fred's family. The only difference with Ground is that he pays other people (contractors) to do his whipping, so he doesn't have to get his hands dirty. That's the model he wants for each opco. Pretty soon your id will have a big white V inside of that orange square.

 

[MrFedEx]

The heck you talking about? The Tea Party doesn't rule this country. The Redistributioner-In-Chief and his minions do, at present, spending like mad and sicking the IRS on their political opponents while the Grand Old pusillanimous just flail around trying to be like Democrats. The Tea Party is talking about a tax revolt, and I'm listening. I'm still paying taxes on a car I already paid taxes on when I bought it. Social Security is set up to make damn sure you die before you get what you are owed, so the gov't can spend all that good money on pork. The gov't has turned into Jabba the Hutt, gobbling revenue and keeping the lot of us in chains. Taking our money away and spending it on crap, to make things more "fair". Thanks to gov't mismanagement the dollar is toilet paper and inflation has reduced what was once a decent salary into poverty-level subsistence. Don't blame a three-year-old political movement for the crappy job situation. It began long ago, probably with FDR, positively with LBJ's "Great Society", and Mr. Hope and Change and the castrated opposition party are making things worse.

Fred is a shining example of GOP-brand capitalism at work. Like the Koch's, he thinks globally, as in $34,000 per year puts a US worker in the "top 1%" of wages worldwide. Of course, people in Third World countries can live on far less than what it takes to "make it" in the USA. You can blame the government, but only to the degree that they allow people like Smith to be "job creators" offering crap jobs with crap benefits. Tea Partiers are crazy. Sorry you are drinking the Lipton.

 

[vantexan]

Fred is a shining example of GOP-brand capitalism at work. Like the Koch's, he thinks globally, as in $34,000 per year puts a US worker in the "top 1%" of wages worldwide. Of course, people in Third World countries can live on far less than what it takes to "make it" in the USA. You can blame the government, but only to the degree that they allow people like Smith to be "job creators" offering crap jobs with crap benefits. Tea Partiers are crazy. Sorry you are drinking the Lipton.

I love how you use one hated thing(friend.Smith) to cast aspersions on something you feel threatened by(Tea Party). The Tea Party is mostly a bunch of older voters who were worried that gov't overspending, as well as Obamacare, were going to threaten their Social Security and Medicare. Their rallies were peaceful, they didn't storm Wall Street. They have very little in common with corporate CEO's. But just like Paul Ryan you seem in them the potential to stop the gov't gravy train which is the lifeblood of the Democrat Party. If one puts his party loyalty above responsible gov't then one isn't a patriot. And running trillion dollar deficits is so irresponsible that it's beyond mind boggling. But go ahead, mingle the Tea Party with fatcat Republicans to lead your naive followers down the primrose path.

 

[MrFedEx]

I love how you use one hated thing(friend.Smith) to cast aspersions on something you feel threatened by(Tea Party). The Tea Party is mostly a bunch of older voters who were worried that gov't overspending, as well as Obamacare, were going to threaten their Social Security and Medicare. Their rallies were peaceful, they didn't storm Wall Street. They have very little in common with corporate CEO's. But just like Paul Ryan you seem in them the potential to stop the gov't gravy train which is the lifeblood of the Democrat Party. If one puts his party loyalty above responsible gov't then one isn't a patriot. And running trillion dollar deficits is so irresponsible that it's beyond mind boggling. But go ahead, mingle the Tea Party with fatcat Republicans to lead your naive followers down the primrose path.

The Tea Party is a bunch of loons and crackpots with a minimal number of supporters. I would classify Mr. Smith as a Tea Party zealot, as well as the Koch Brothers. You kooks rant about government spending and the "gravy train", and then you complain when the government attempts to stop any of the gravy...like SS, Medicare, farm subsidies, pork barrel projects and the rest of it. Every Tea Partier I have ever met loves Corporate America, and "exceptional individuals" like the Koch's, Waltons, and Fred Smiths of this world. They are just dumb enough to believe that these fatcat TPer's have the average American's best interests at heart.

Rand Paul in 2016!! Yeah!! God, some people are just plain dumb.

 

[sjh]

The Tea Party is a bunch of loons and crackpots with a minimal number of supporters. I would classify Mr. Smith as a Tea Party zealot, as well as the Koch Brothers. You kooks rant about government spending and the "gravy train", and then you complain when the government attempts to stop any of the gravy...like SS, Medicare, farm subsidies, pork barrel projects and the rest of it. Every Tea Partier I have ever met loves Corporate America, and "exceptional individuals" like the Koch's, Waltons, and Fred Smiths of this world. They are just dumb enough to believe that these fatcat TPer's have the average American's best interests at heart. Rand Paul in 2016!! Yeah!! God, some people are just plain dumb.

How much do you actually know about the Tea Party movement? I believe their goal is to LIMIT government. The less government, the better. The leader of the movement wants social security abolished. I would peg Fred as a bleeding-heart Republican, not a TPer.