Taking a pay-cut?

[browniehound]

Hey everyone. This person posted this subject in "the competition" section of the site. I posted my reply as to why I think he is nuts and totally off-base with his coments in that section. I'm afraid however that it will not get the visabilty it deserves over there, so I'm going to re-post my argument here as to why us drivers deserve what we get paid. Thanks and here it is:

I know this might be a pipe dream, but this is what I proposed to my center manager after he handed me a sales lead card. I told him every one from Eskew on down to the pt or maybe just the ft should take a 5 to 10 % wage decrease and earmark the monies for shipping rate reductions or no rate hike. I hate having to go with my tail between my legs and giving the cd(rate hike) to my shippers. For once i would like to say to them because of all (mgt and hourlys) scrafice there will be no rate hike or maybe even just a slight decrease in rates. This could generate a lot of new bus. Yes ups is making a profit as of now, but lets be pro active. Were like the mom and pop store, we have service but not the price. thats how walmart killed its competion by price and very little service. Im not saying abonden service. but if we were to get price and service we would kill the competiton. We must never forget most of us would have a lot less if it werent for ups. By no means is ups perfect. Id rather make a few dollars lesss and hr than go to somewhere else and make basically nothing.

When my workload gets reduced to maybe twice the workload of a Fed-ex driver instead of 6 times the workload, I might consider taking a pay cut. Other than that, there is no way in hell I'm taking a pay-cut. Nobody at UPS should be taking a pay cut. We as drivers make the most in the industry becuase we work the hardest, are the most efficient, are the friendliest, and the most respected of all delivery drivers. We are paid the most because we DO THE MOST and deserve it. If a Fed-ex express driver is getting paid 22 bucks an hour to deliver 75 stops and 150 pieces in one day, then are not UPS drivers justifed in getting paid 27 bucks an hour to deliver 175 stops and 325 pieces in one day????

You may say we are uneducated and thus don't deserve the money. The fact is though we are highly efficent at what we do and are deserving of a higher wage than out less-efficient, less profitable counter parts.

Has anyone ever seen a full 1200 cubic-inch DHL or Fed-ex truck? I know I never have. These DHL guys are getting paid 22 bucks an hour to basically drive around and do the least work out of all of us.

So that is point number 1 I will make as to that us UPS drivers are not over compensated.

 

[browniehound]

Also, I want a show of hands . Who here would go to their center manager and suggest they deserve a $6,500 a year pay cut?1 1 1 1 Only somebody softer than grapes

 

[upsgrunt]

Brownie-
I agree 1000%, but I see an error. We are not all uneducated, dumb, truckdrivers. I have a degree from a major Midwestern University in Communications and Advertising and have been a driver for 21 years; Another driver in our center has a Masters in Russian History. My point is, degree or not, we (drivers) are not dumb by any means. In fact, I believe we could save the company tons of money if they would just listen to our ideas and give them a chance. Not only could we save them money, we could make the job more bearable for ourselves and our families. I know, I know that this is just a pipe dream, but I know in my heart that we could.

 

[area43]

I did repost it in the discussion section. It had 18 hits. As of now in va ,drivers can retire 25yrs of service at any age at 2500 dollars a month. If ups would take a big hit, being that there are only 15 companies contributing to the fund. We would lose. My point is that i believe most drivers would take a few dollars less an hour if it resulted in a more secure retirement.

 

[surviv'n_it]

Brownie-
I agree 1000%, but I see an error. We are not all uneducated, dumb, truckdrivers. I have a degree from a major Midwestern University in Communications and Advertising and have been a driver for 21 years; Another driver in our center has a Masters in Russian History. My point is, degree or not, we (drivers) are not dumb by any means. In fact, I believe we could save the company tons of money if they would just listen to our ideas and give them a chance. Not only could we save them money, we could make the job more bearable for ourselves and our families. I know, I know that this is just a pipe dream, but I know in my heart that we could.

You are exactly right about the education issue. I have a degree and so do most of the drivers I work with. In fact many even have masters degrees. I always tell people that a lot of UPS drivers are doing this job by choice as they could always enter another career based on their education. The money UPS pays is excellent and often more than jobs pay with a masters degree.

 

[browniehound]

Brownie-
I agree 1000%, but I see an error. We are not all uneducated, dumb, truckdrivers. I have a degree from a major Midwestern University in Communications and Advertising and have been a driver for 21 years; Another driver in our center has a Masters in Russian History. My point is, degree or not, we (drivers) are not dumb by any means. In fact, I believe we could save the company tons of money if they would just listen to our ideas and give them a chance. Not only could we save them money, we could make the job more bearable for ourselves and our families. I know, I know that this is just a pipe dream, but I know in my heart that we could.

Grunt, I didn't in any way mean to denegrade UPS drivers. I too, have a college education as do many other drivers I know. And I never said or meant to say in anyway that drivers are dumb. I was trying to draw attention to the fact that people who claim we are overpaid will make the argument that we as drivers are uneducated and therefore don't deserve the wage we recieve.

The fact is, a college education is not required to be a UPS driver. This however doesn't nulify the fact we work the hardest and are much more efficient than the competition and therefore deserve the higher compensation.

Again, I apologize if you took my comment the wrong way. I was trying to defend us drivers, not call us stupid. I hope I was clearer in this post.

 

[browniehound]

Grunt, also, in previous posts I may have referred to ourselves as "dumb truck drivers" being sarcastic and to prove a point. I think I said that because during the strike some people in management told our customers that we were unskilled and uneducated laborers and don't deserve what we were demanding in the contract. And now these same people are asking us "uneducated and unskilled laborers" to get sales leads and grow the business because the competition is kicking their ass. OK, I'll get sales leads, but we need someone with their harvard MBA to increase our market share and increase our revenue. I didn't go to school for that and if I did, I wouldn't ask a driver to do MY job.

 

[upsgrunt]

Brownie-
No harm done here! I felt nothing of what you mentioned. I should have been more clear in my post of my intent for UPS as a company to realize that drivers are not simply hired from the neck down as I have heard from managers before. In defending what we make and the fact that we very much earn it, consider this: Have you ever considered that drivers are very much industrial athletes? Our season starts Jan 1st and last 11 months- then the grueling playoffs in December for 30 days and then a new season starts Jan. 1st. We have no "off" season. No time to heal nagging injuries. No time to get our strength or legs back. Consider also that most NBA, NFL, or other professional sports teams play for about an hour or two. We put in 9 or 10 hours every "game". For the schmuck who thinks that 30 and hour to "deliver a box" is ludicrous try this: play a 10 hour soccer game carrying a bowling ball. Do that 5 days in a row and tell me how your weekend goes! Then do it for 20, 25, 30 years and tell me that UPS doesn't get a pretty good deal for their money!

 

[ExupserNaples]

That would be a 1200 cubic feet package car, I think 1200 cubic inch is USPS

 

[Cementups]

and DHL drivers make $10-10.50/hr. I'm sorry to say this, but you couldn't get me out of bed for that amount of change.

 

[upsgrunt]

NO. Ups now has 1200 and 1400 sizes in package cars. Our center is getting nothing less than 12's now.

 

[Pip]

NO. Ups now has 1200 and 1400 sizes in package cars.

To the best of my knowledge 1200 cu. ft. package cars is the biggest UPS has. I haven't seen nor heard of any 1400 cu. ft. package cars yet.

If your referring to the package car numbers starting with 14xxxx. Those will all be 1000's and 1200 cu. ft. cars. You can't neccessarily go by the package car number anymore to figure the car sizes.

 

[Fredless]

and DHL drivers make $10-10.50/hr. I'm sorry to say this, but you couldn't get me out of bed for that amount of change.

The part timers do it everyday, and we haven't seen a pay raise since the 1980s.

 

[westsideworma]

The part timers do it everyday, and we haven't seen a pay raise since the 1980s.

Hence the reason we generally attract the bottom of the barrel. I am a part timer, I'm using UPS for schooling and little else. Why did they drop the rate for the PT people? It was higher in the early 80s (according to people who were hired then), why did it change?

I joked with a fellow part timer (a new hire) he was saying there was something wrong with his check (it was like 134 bucks or something), I was like wow you had 200 bucks deducted too huh? You better get on payroll for that ASAP...he thought i was serious haha.

 

[Fredless]

I attribuite it to being our own fault. Most part timers are in it during college and/or high school..or they know its only for a few years before they go full time. Therefore, the apathy is extremely high.

Its simple. Full timers generally care more about the Union politics, they show up to the meetings, they vote on the contract issues. Will they stick their neck out there for us? Hell no. If UPS proposed to keep the current top out rate around 28 dollars an hour, to raise the part timer rate to retain good people or get them, its a safe bet it would be turned down immediately.

The question is to the full time drivers, when is enough, enough? Are you going to continuously press UPS for higher wages to starve the part timers even more? Or even starve the company to run it into the ground like the UAW has done to General Motors and Ford? I'm not saying the top out rate is outrageous, in fact, I think the full time drivers for what they go through now deserve around 30-31 dollars an hour as top out rate..but again, when does the line get drawn in the sand?

 

[over9five]

Geez, Fred, don't blame us! You guys outnumber us 3 to 1. If you went to the meetings, you could easily run the union!

 

[brownmonster]

Partimers get the same wage increase as a fulltimer although we make 2 to 3 times as much. On a percentage partimers come out better. Most of our partimers work for the benefits, unheard of at most part time jobs. That being said, yes partimers need to be making more.

 

[Cementups]

they didn't lower the starting wage. My brotherhad a jb at UPS in 1987 and it was $8.50/hr. So the wage is still the same but given increases in minuimum wage and cost of living, then I suppose you could say that they are paid less. You can get a job these days at a convenience store making about the same amount of money and not having to do the physical labor involved at UPS.

 

[Fredless]

Geez, Fred, don't blame us! You guys outnumber us 3 to 1. If you went to the meetings, you could easily run the union!

You obviously did not read the second paragraph in my post, nor the very first sentance. I did not blame you.

Secondly, not in my local. In the smaller centers, part timers are out numbered and in my hub which has 3 centers, it is 50/50 right now. Overall, I'm sure its still 3 to 1 like you stated.

 

[crumbs]

To the best of my knowledge 1200 cu. ft. package cars is the biggest UPS has. I haven't seen nor heard of any 1400 cu. ft. package cars yet.

If your referring to the package car numbers starting with 14xxxx. Those will all be 1000's and 1200 cu. ft. cars. You can't neccessarily go by the package car number anymore to figure the car sizes.

our center does in fact have 1300 cubes, (and thats not going by the number)