UPSers are DOOMED

[tieguy]

Maybe in your part of the country this might be true, but here management would disagree with you on your statement. What you consider grief alot of us consider it to be accountability. Now i understand that you cant make all fo the people happy, when you negioate a contract you have to take into account the age groups. The 20s to 30 year olds are worried about the money, the 30 to 40 years olds are worried about the benefits and the older employees are worried about retirement. One would say that the older employees had their voices heard over the rest this time.

I just hope that one day we can elect a group thats in it for the love of it and not the money. Here i see the younger agents going above and beyond and you can see the fire in these guys which spreads to the stewards. What im saying is that these are the guys with the most to lose. If they lose an election they are right back working with us at the companys mercy at that point. But the older agents either have a different style or have lost the fight in them. Maybe older isnt better, maybe we need to elect a group of younger teamsters who love representing the contracts and members. Guys and gals that are not in it for the cash.

I'm sure some have lost their fire and i would imagine some have also learned when to pick their battles?

To assess their performance I think you have to ask yourself where they failed. If you think the answer is no give and take when they negotiate a contract then we might as well all fill out our fdx applications. From what I saw it appears they tried to poll the members and then negotiate based off that information.

Looks like a complete failure with 804's negotiations. Obviously the members were not going to be happy with the pension changes proposed.

West PA's issues don't seem to be that significant and if the seniority issue is really the hot button then that issue seems to contradict traditional union philosophy about overall seniority applying at all times.

I can't get a good feel for the other supplements that failed.

The part time wage issue seems to be a wash. We basically raised the starting wage a buck fifty with the progression and spread out the accrual of benifits to pay for some of it. There was a strong camp that once believed we should offer part timers more in wages and no benifits. This change seems to come in sitting on the fence.

The thing thats odd to me is you folks against the contract don't seem to appreciate the knowledge and experience of your BA's. I Rarely sit in on a local hearing or panel and hear a BA that has not done his homework. They seem to be very knowledgable and seem to fully understand the contract issues. Yet many of you who have posted here act as if you feel you have some higher calling that gives you an insight that the BA does not have.

If so then jump in there and take the heat. As I said before I've seen the heat stewards and BA's take from the members and I would rather have my job then theirs any day. You guys are not too kind to your own.

 

[705red]

I'm sure some have lost their fire and i would imagine some have also learned when to pick their battles?

To assess their performance I think you have to ask yourself where they failed. If you think the answer is no give and take when they negotiate a contract then we might as well all fill out our fdx applications. From what I saw it appears they tried to poll the members and then negotiate based off that information.

Looks like a complete failure with 804's negotiations. Obviously the members were not going to be happy with the pension changes proposed.

West PA's issues don't seem to be that significant and if the seniority issue is really the hot button then that issue seems to contradict traditional union philosophy about overall seniority applying at all times.

I can't get a good feel for the other supplements that failed.

The part time wage issue seems to be a wash. We basically raised the starting wage a buck fifty with the progression and spread out the accrual of benifits to pay for some of it. There was a strong camp that once believed we should offer part timers more in wages and no benifits. This change seems to come in sitting on the fence.

The thing thats odd to me is you folks against the contract don't seem to appreciate the knowledge and experience of your BA's. I Rarely sit in on a local hearing or panel and hear a BA that has not done his homework. They seem to be very knowledgable and seem to fully understand the contract issues. Yet many of you who have posted here act as if you feel you have some higher calling that gives you an insight that the BA does not have.

If so then jump in there and take the heat. As I said before I've seen the heat stewards and BA's take from the members and I would rather have my job then theirs any day. You guys are not too kind to your own.

Tie i dont judge the teamsters by the give and take when it comes to negiotaions. I understand there has to be some give and take, but honestly all i see is give. Yes it appears the cs pension has been addressed and i hope all involved are happy. But i honestly feel that this contract is nothing short of a complete sell out to the company. Sups working and bigger penalty pay for 9.5 but thats only good if your local can enforce the contract. From what i have read here that does not happen across the country as it does here. It wasnt always perfect here, i remember 5 years ago when we had outsiders (freight) as our ups agents and others. The problem here is either they had stones but didnt know and understand the contract or they were very smart but didnt have the stones. Who do you think suffered? The ups rank and filers took it and took it good. Now we have some very great agents and they believe in the stewards. We get sent to labor classes and they even hold their own classes, but more inportant they ensure us that we are in charge of our buildings and that they work for us! Now thats how it sholud be.

Now we have roughly 4 years to look at our choices for the next ibt election. We should look to run everyone of these ibt reps out at this time. Even the yes voters know that we could have got better, just look at 804 their no vote did not mean a strike and they received what they wanted in doing so. Now if we (upsers) can stand together and assist in bettering our position across the country why not give it a shot? Whoever we elect must hold other locals accountable in representing the members best interest. Now lets wait and see in these smaller locals were upsers were nothing more than the pension cash cow and see how they are treated with the cs withdraw. We are 200,000 strong and its about time that our voices get heard!