America Shutdown Implemented To Ensure Our Healthcare Capacity Is Not Exceeded

[zubenelgenubi]

Introduction and scope of the guidelines - Infection Prevention and Control of Epidemic- and Pandemic-Prone Acute Respiratory Infections in Health Care - NCBI Bookshelf
Here is an actual link to something written by scientific and medical experts, not a bunch of truck drivers opinions

"When a new infectious disease is identified, the modes of transmission are not well understood. The epidemiological and microbiological studies needed to determine the modes of transmission and identify possible IPC measures may be protracted. Due to the lack of information on modes of spread, Airborne and Contact Precautions, as well as eye protection, should be added to the routine Standard Precautions whenever possible, to reduce the risk of transmission of a newly emerging agent (Annex B describes Standard and other precautions). These precautions should be implemented until further studies reveal the mode of transmission. Epidemiological and clinical clues can indicate when additional precautions are needed"

I have been reading actual scientific papers posted on National Center for Biotechnology Information
and Google scholar. The paper you linked to is for clinical settings, not meant as a guideline for the general public. That supports exactly what I've been advocating all along. Leave the masks for the sick and the caregivers. The gen pop doesn't use masks properly, which puts them at greater risk,.and the help masks would give if used correctly is negligible. To top it off, in order to actually get a benefit from.wearing a mask at all, you would have to remove them every ten minutes or so, carefully dispose of the used ones (or seal up for disenfection if reusable), wash your hands, and put on a new one. Masks that keep a space away from the mouth and nose can last longer, but should still be changed out regularly.

And as @DriveInDriveOut already pointed out, no one said respiratory illness can't be spread in warm/humid areas. They follow a very predictable pattern of new cases dropping significantly during summer months, and start increasing into fall. If they couldn't be spread in warm weather, they would die out pretty quickly, or at least be far easier to manage. This is well understood, even by dumb truck drivers.

Here's another article from nih.gov about masks. Read through the cited references too, they have more in depth info.

The surgical mask is a bad fit for risk reduction

 

[zubenelgenubi]

Myth busters


I know @DriveInDriveOut and others believe WHO are part of a vast Chinese conspiracy, but
COVID-19 virus can be transmitted in areas with hot and humid climates
The best way to protect yourself against COVID-19 is by maintaining physical distance of at least 1 metre from others and frequently cleaning your hands. By doing this you eliminate viruses that may be on your hands and avoid infection that could occur by then touching your eyes, mouth, and nose.

Where is the mask recommendation in this? It's not there. Wash your hands, keep your distance, cover your cough. These have been the recommendations for a while. Now suddenly we have to stay home, unless you don't, and wear masks, which actually increases risk. You think public opinion had nothing to do with those new recommendations? Cause science doesn't support them.

 

[Turdferguson]

To top it off, in order to actually get a benefit from.wearing a mask at all, you would have to remove them every ten minutes or so, carefully dispose of the used ones (or seal up for disenfection if reusable), wash your hands, and put on a new one. Masks that keep a space away from the mouth and nose can last longer, but should still be changed out regularly.

You're discussing wearing a mask to keep you from getting the illness, not slowing the spread which is the goal.


An average coronavirus patient infects at least 2 others. To end the pandemic, that crucial metric needs to drop below 1 — here's how we get there.

 

[Turdferguson]

Here's another article from nih.gov about masks. Read through the cited references too, they have more in depth info.

The surgical mask is a bad fit for risk reduction

That article seemed to focus on the psychological aspects of wearing masks more than anything scientific about wearing one

 

[Sportello]

That article seemed to focus on the psychological aspects of wearing masks more than anything scientific about wearing one

Never mind that it was years old, and had nothing to do with today's situation.

Notice how (s)he linked to a page of scholarly articles, but not to a paper (s)he has allegedly read?

 

[Turdferguson]

Never mind that it was years old, and had nothing to do with today's situation.

Notice how (s)he linked to a page of scholarly articles, but not to a paper (s)he has allegedly read?

I did, took you to some homepage

 

[zubenelgenubi]

That article seemed to focus on the psychological aspects of wearing masks more than anything scientific about wearing one

It is applicable in and of itself, but it cites other papers tbat have more technical information.

You're discussing wearing a mask to keep you from getting the illness, not slowing the spread which is the goal.


An average coronavirus patient infects at least 2 others. To end the pandemic, that crucial metric needs to drop below 1 — here's how we get there.

How can the two be separated? If people wearing masks increase their likelihood of catching a virus, that necessarily works against the goal of slowing the spread. I already explained what steps need to be taken for masks to do what people think they will, and the general population will not, and for practical purposes can not, take those steps. In fact, no one is even trying to get people to wear masks correctly, which makes them more harmful. Healthcare facilities I have visited don't even ensure their workers are using them correctly.

It's all theater, with the negativee side effect of increasing risks for individuals, which is one reason the paper I linked is applicable in and of itself.

As far as the R number is concerned, the concern is based on inaccurate predictive models suggesting worst case scenarios. There are better, more targeted methods of slowing the spread of viruses that don't include putting people at higher risk.

 

[Old Man Jingles]

I did, took you to some homepage

Did you know every site has a homepage?

 

[zubenelgenubi]

Never mind that it was years old, and had nothing to do with today's situation.

Notice how (s)he linked to a page of scholarly articles, but not to a paper (s)he has allegedly read?

Dude, every article up until about a month ago was explaining why we shouldn't wear masks. There is nothing about this situation that invalidates the science behind mask wearing. I posted the homepage link for that site for anyone who is not aware of it. I look for that address when I am looking for something more involved than what can be found at business insider.

I linked another article from the site that also cites other scientific papers that are available from Google scholar and the like. If you want articles that help you maintain your current level of thinking, then by all means, stick with vox, wired, Washington post, NY times, etc. If you want to go to the source and see what experts really say, then you have to dig a little deeper.

 

[floridays]

You're discussing wearing a mask to keep you from getting the illness, not slowing the spread which is the goal.


An average coronavirus patient infects at least 2 others. To end the pandemic, that crucial metric needs to drop below 1 — here's how we get there.

Turd to be intellectually honest, exactly how can this mask not do both.
The mask either protects and thwarts or none of the above.

You can't pass the virus through the mask (protects others) versus the mask doesn't protect the wearer it only prevents the transmission to others.
Not both simultaneously?

Smarter virus than we thought?
Stupid masks, or

Help me I'm in a couple of beers.

 

[Benben]

I think there may be a misunderstanding about masks.

In wearing a mask to protect yourself, the mask must have a filter, e.g. The N95 mask. These are commonly referred to as respirators. They filter out and protect you (the wearer) from inhaling contaminants.

99.9% of the masks you see the public wearing do not protect the wearer from others, rather the reverse is true. They primarily protect others from the wearer infecting them. Think, a surgeon wearing a mask to prevent contaminating a sterile field. These are commonly referred to by medical personal as "community comfort" masks.

As far as increased risks associated with wearing a community comfort mask, especially as it becomes damp from moisture due to exhaling, they are not intended to be a stand-alone measure. Employing social distancing methods while wearing the mask are imperative for both the wearer as well as for the public.

Hope this helps.

 

[floridays]

I think there may be a misunderstanding about masks.

In wearing a mask to protect yourself, the mask must have a filter, e.g. The N95 mask. These are commonly referred to as respirators. They filter out and protect you (the wearer) from inhaling contaminants.

99.9% of the masks you see the public wearing do not protect the wearer from others, rather the reverse is true. They primarily protect others from the wearer infecting them. Think, a surgeon wearing a mask to prevent contaminating a sterile field. These are commonly referred to by medical personal as "community comfort" masks.

As far as increased risks associated with wearing a community comfort mask, especially as it becomes damp from moisture due to exhaling, they are not intended to be a stand-alone measure. Employing social distancing methods while wearing the mask are imperative for both the wearer as well as for the public.

Hope this helps.

Basically then most wearing masks are doing noting more than wasting money and virtue signaling, even if neither is their purpose of wearing the mask?

What the hell is the reason for homemade cloth coverings, solidarity for the cause?

Social distancing works well to deter abortions, but I haven't heard the call for that one.

 

[Benben]

What the hell is the reason for homemade cloth coverings, solidarity for the cause?

Those are community comfort masks I spoke of.

 

[Benben]

Turd to be intellectually honest, exactly how can this mask not do both.
The mask either protects and thwarts or none of the above.
You can't pass the virus through the mask (protects others) versus the mask doesn't protect the wearer it only prevents the transmission to others.
Not both simultaneously?

Help me I'm in a couple of beers.

Think of a sneeze. We are taught to sneeze into our elbow. The elbow acts as a barrier to the sneeze being ejected out into the entire room. Now the elbow (in a gross oversimplification) holds everything that was just sneezed out. If someone walks by and breathes on the same elbow that elbow now contains the sneeze as well as that other person's breath.

Does that help any at all?

 

[floridays]

Those are community comfort masks I spoke of.

Those are community comfort masks I spoke of.

I got that part, community comfort = virture signaling for some.

How about the other masks, do they only work out and not in.

Simple question, is the virus so smart and dumb at the same time that it doesn't fully know how to defeat the pesky mask?
It can't go out of the mask but it can penetrate it?
I'm being serious walk me through this. I don't understand this one way mask thing.

 

[Old Man Jingles]

And what if a vaccine is never found ? Do we continue as is or do we just accept it .

We accept it and peeped like me shelter until herd immunity takes place.

 

[floridays]

Think of a sneeze. We are taught to sneeze into our elbow. The elbow acts as a barrier to the sneeze being ejected out into the entire room. Now the elbow (in a gross oversimplification) holds everything that was just sneezed out. If someone walks by and breathes on the same elbow that elbow now contains the sneeze as well as that other person's breath.

Does that help any at all?

Not much, I have never been taught to sneeze into my elbow before this current time but that is not the point.

The point is, we have been told a mask does not protect the wearer from contracting the virus.

My question again in a different way, how the hell is the virus smart enough to know if it is going out or in of a mask.
The mask is pervious , not protective to the wearer. If pervious to the wearer, how can it be protective for that a non wearer?
In surgical situations as far as my limited knowledge, the mask is to protect the patient, not the surgical staff.

I'm working through this, I'll figure it out or die first.
Take care of yourself and those you love.
Nice having a civil conversation with you.

 

[floridays]

We accept it and peeped like me shelter until herd immunity takes place.

My friend, I hope the herd clears your route to fall festivals, I'd guess summer concerts are mostly deep sixed but festivals roll in the fall. Get some sun whitey, you're lookin a bit pale.

 

[MAKAVELI]

We accept it and peeped like me shelter until herd immunity takes place.

Not all viruses have herd immunity.

 

[Old Man Jingles]

Not all viruses have herd immunity.

Yep, we’ve been through that