guns

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

My views on guns were shaped by a tragedy within my family. Details are not necessary (nor will be given) but suffice it to say that had there not been a gun in our home it never would have happened.

 

[cachsux]

And that is your right and your wish and I respect that.

Unlike others on here I won`t try and tell you why you should have one as hard as they are trying to tell us why we shouldn`t have one.

 

[dilligaf]

Dave, you have mentioned this before. I can't even begin to imagine what you went through and how it has affected you. I certainly understand your views on guns and wouldn't even begin to try and change your mind. You have the right to feel the way you do as everyone does. Whatever it was that happened, I'm sorry.

 

[dilligaf]

Now, with that said and with absolutely no intention of taking anything away from my post to Dave, there is a huge difference between having ones own beliefs and forcing those beliefs onto everyone else around them.

Dave has mentioned this before and to the best of my knowledge he has not once tried to force us to swallow his opinions on guns, unlike someone else who does it frequently and with determined vigor. This has been said time and time again. Klein, you constantly and consistently force your opinions down everyones throat. You seem to think you know everything. You inject yourself into every single thing that is posted. Your ways are tiresome and old. Go get a job.

 

[klein]

I didn`t watch the video. I took bbsams word on it`s content.


You talk so tough while the laws are in place, cops in the streets. Remove all that and when the bad guys are at your door feel free to cry out "but,but, we have laws!" and see how far it gets you. Laws are only meaningful when they`re enforced and someones there to enforce them. When that looter/rapist is taking all your stuff and has you bent over the kitchen table what will be going through your mind? Possibly "I wish I had a gun"?

Keep watching those mad max and other hollywood movies !
Just remember, my parents and grandparents went thru all that.
It was called WW2 in Germany, when everything was in rubel, no food, no police, no laws in the months just prior to the end of the war.

And , no they didn't go out, robbed or raped other germans !
They actually helped eachother out.
Farmers would give away potatoes or other produce and veggies.
Or people letting in strangers into their homes, because their's got destoyed.

An each to their own policy, would do nobody any good, and citizens would soon figure that out by themselves, that they need to co-operate to survive and rebuild.

 

[klein]

My views on guns were shaped by a tragedy within my family. Details are not necessary (nor will be given) but suffice it to say that had there not been a gun in our home it never would have happened.

I can relate to that Upstate, just that it didn't effect my opinion on guns, because I always felt they were unneccesary.
In my case it was a brother of mine, 10 years ago, almost to this date.

 

[Lue C Fur]

One statistic that you dont see is that most murders envolving guns are done to other drug dealers and and cons...so no loss. Try watching 48hrs on A&E and you will see what im talking about...great program!!!!

So when will they outlaw knives...there was another murder with one yesterday. Lets remember the Liberal mantra: Its not the killers fault...its the gun.

 

[wkmac]

Pardon me fellas but I'd like to lighten the mood a moment. Just read this howler and no matter where you stand on the gun issue, this should at least bring a laugh!

Told a friend that when I read it for some weird reason I thought of Blazing Saddles and "One move and the toy soldier gets it!" Yeah it's warped but then so is the policy too.....you know!

 

[soberups]

I can relate to that Upstate, just that it didn't effect my opinion on guns, because I always felt they were unneccesary.
In my case it was a brother of mine, 10 years ago, almost to this date.

I had a very close family member commit suicide while he was drunk.

He was a chronic alcoholic who had hit bottom. His life had become unmanageable and he was facing prison time. So he got drunk one last time and overdosed on some pills.

He, along with millions of other people, would be alive today if alcohol were banned.

The fact of the matter is that alcohol causes far more deaths per year than guns. And many gun deaths are also alcohol related. So the same arguments and statistics that are being thrown around to justify restrictions or bans on gun ownership would be equally valid if applied to alcohol. There is no constitutional right to drink alcohol, alcohol has no legitimate medical purpose, and many tens of thousands of lives per year would be saved if alcohol were banned or severely restricted.

Shouldn't we mandate "background checks" or "waiting periods" before buying alcohol? What about banning those "high capacity" 40 oz. bottles of beer? How about requiring child-proof "cap locks" on all alcohol bottles? And how many children would be saved if we required all people who bought alcohol to be fingerprinted and to keep their alcohol bottles locked up in a safe and kept seperate from drinking glasses and bottle openers?

I dont drink, so it would be easy for me to call for such absurd laws to be passed. Its emotionally convenient to blame the inantimate object...whether it be a gun or a bottle of vodka....rather than to advocate personal freedom and responsibility. But, unlike Klein, I will never allow my personal dislike of alcohol to overcome my respect for the rights of other people to make their own choices.

 

[wkmac]

And when you get through laughing and return to the subject matter, here's something to consider.

 

[Jones]

I had a very close family member commit suicide while he was drunk.

He was a chronic alcoholic who had hit bottom. His life had become unmanageable and he was facing prison time. So he got drunk one last time and overdosed on some pills.

He, along with millions of other people, would be alive today if alcohol were banned.

The fact of the matter is that alcohol causes far more deaths per year than guns. And many gun deaths are also alcohol related. So the same arguments and statistics that are being thrown around to justify restrictions or bans on gun ownership would be equally valid if applied to alcohol. There is no constitutional right to drink alcohol, alcohol has no legitimate medical purpose, and many tens of thousands of lives per year would be saved if alcohol were banned or severely restricted.

Shouldn't we mandate "background checks" or "waiting periods" before buying alcohol? What about banning those "high capacity" 40 oz. bottles of beer? How about requiring child-proof "cap locks" on all alcohol bottles? And how many children would be saved if we required all people who bought alcohol to be fingerprinted and to keep their alcohol bottles locked up in a safe and kept seperate from drinking glasses and bottle openers?

I dont drink, so it would be easy for me to call for such absurd laws to be passed. Its emotionally convenient to blame the inantimate object...whether it be a gun or a bottle of vodka....rather than to advocate personal freedom and responsibility. But, unlike Klein, I will never allow my personal dislike of alcohol to overcome my respect for the rights of other people to make their own choices.

I'm not an advocate of prohibition or gun control, but I don't think that argument really holds up. Getting drunk is something you do to yourself, I've never heard of a person drinking someone else to death. We do ban drunk driving, which actually is lethal to other people.

 

[bbsam]

Maybe we should ban being in possession of a firearm when drinking/drunk. If not against the law, my guess is that it's not too incredibly bright.

 

[cachsux]

Keep watching those mad max and other hollywood movies !
Just remember, my parents and grandparents went thru all that.
It was called WW2 in Germany, when everything was in rubel, no food, no police, no laws in the months just prior to the end of the war.

And , no they didn't go out, robbed or raped other germans !
They actually helped eachother out.
Farmers would give away potatoes or other produce and veggies.
Or people letting in strangers into their homes, because their's got destoyed.

An each to their own policy, would do nobody any good, and citizens would soon figure that out by themselves, that they need to co-operate to survive and rebuild.

How did these benevolent relatives help out the Jews,the gypsies,the gays, or any one else that Hitlers boys rounded up?

 

[soberups]

I'm not an advocate of prohibition or gun control, but I don't think that argument really holds up. Getting drunk is something you do to yourself, I've never heard of a person drinking someone else to death. We do ban drunk driving, which actually is lethal to other people.

A huge percentage of murders and incidents of child abuse and domestic violence are directly related to alcohol use. And the "ban" on drunk driving does not change the fact that far more people die as a result of drunk driving than from guns.

I'm not advocating prohibition. I am advocating the freedom to make personal choices.

 

[wkmac]

I've often wondered if the 20th century US Military buildup, the Cold War and state public policy opposition to so-called global communism by the state partnership with private industrial concerns had never happened and then look at American society, just how many guns we'd see across it and what types would they be? When I think of the fact that between production runs for the American Empire State, those production lines need to be running something to make the profits continue and the state apparatchik makes policy to move those products among the booboisie to keep it all going, one has to question just whose hands are the bloodiest in all of this!

 

[klein]

A huge percentage of murders and incidents of child abuse and domestic violence are directly related to alcohol use. And the "ban" on drunk driving does not change the fact that far more people die as a result of drunk driving than from guns.

I'm not advocating prohibition. I am advocating the freedom to make personal choices.

You might want to do research before you post things like that :

In the United States the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) estimates that 17,941 people died in 2006 in alcohol-related collisions.

In 1999, there were 28,874 gun-related deaths in the United States - over 80 deaths every day. (Source: Hoyert DL, Arias E, Smith BL, Murphy SL, Kochanek, KD. Deaths: Final Data for 1999. National Vital Statistics Reports. 2001;

The years don't match, but nowhere will it ever get close.

 

[Babagounj]

So how many of those alcohol related deaths were done by illegal non-licensed drivers ?
{which IMHO should have all been prevented, but that for another thread }

 

[Lue C Fur]

You might want to do research before you post things like that :
Hey genius...try reading comprehension or did you fail that part of school but got good grades in alcohol abuse. Go re-read Sober's post...i will make it easy for you: "The fact of the matter is that alcohol causes far more deaths per year than guns. And many gun deaths are also alcohol related". Notice he did not say alcohol realted collisions. Im sure i dont have to explain any further but if you need more im sure Sober can explain to you better.
In the United States the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) estimates that 17,941 people died in 2006 in alcohol-related collisions.

In 1999, there were 28,874 gun-related deaths in the United States (how many were suicides? How many were "Justifiable" gun related deaths....hmmm?) - over 80 deaths every day. (Source: Hoyert DL, Arias E, Smith BL, Murphy SL, Kochanek, KD. Deaths: Final Data for 1999. National Vital Statistics Reports. 2001;

The years don't match, but nowhere will it ever get close.

 

[cachsux]

I'm not an advocate of prohibition or gun control, but I don't think that argument really holds up. Getting drunk is something you do to yourself, I've never heard of a person drinking someone else to death. We do ban drunk driving, which actually is lethal to other people.

You then must have never been on the recieving end of a drunken fist.

 

[cachsux]

[/COLOR]

Careful, don`t get a warning.