Have you heard of the Orion System, what do you know?

Brownslave688

You want a toe? I can get you a toe.
You would think none of us have any clue how to do our job. I can't wait to so rural routes on this. Yeah it cut ten miles on my day but had me driving 35 on gravel all day instead of 60 on blacktop. Now I'm back 2-3 hours later than I should of been.
 

grgrcr88

No It's not green grocer!
Heard Monday they are sending our DPS sup on special assignment to start implementing the Orion system in our area! Can't wait!!
 

Bubblehead

My Senior Picture
What I am curious about is how it determines that I have time for the tangents and deviations it creates during a day in relation to commercial stop commit times?
Does it even know whether a stop is commercial or residential?
Does it assume that my allowances are accurate?
It will be interesting as we are scheduled to go live on it in September.
I guess we will be down to 339 methods, as there will be no way to be sure what my next 5 stops are?
 

Dracula

Package Car is cake compared to this...
Well, we all know UPS, so my guess is that it will be implemented during the next peak period.
 

sortaisle

Livin the cardboard dream
I've said it before in other posts...UPS is creating Skynet. The T-1000 will be delivering packages for them one day. Either way even if Orion is implemented, I still do my route the way I think it should be done. (when I drive anyway,) I shuffle through my air first to see what I can deliver with the ground, then I'll hit my heaviest bulk stops so I can move through my truck, and try to deliver everything in trace (if the trace makes sense.) If I have to break for a few air stops at 10 then I will. All that to say, Ehff ORION's face.
 

'Lord Brown's bidding'

Well-Known Member
Why is everyone assuming that on some level Orion-and those who program it-will not go off to some degree the avg or mean time a driver gets to a particular area, and then base its trace off of how the area has been run off of based on maximum efficiency, or something along those lines. They have measured and stored times. For that matter, they should be able to tell if a stop is residential or commercial based on the history of what the driver chose, say for the last year. (Isn't this how MyChoice-which is up and running fine, just no one uses it and UPS doesn't advertise it-picks the 2hr window?)
 
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cosmo1

Perhaps.
Staff member
Why is everyone assuming that on some level Orion-and those who program it-will not go off to some degree the avg or mean time a driver gets to a particular area, and then base its trace off of how the area has been run off of based on maximum efficiency, or something along those lines. They have measured and stored times. For that matter, they should be able to tell if a stop is residential or commercial based on the history of what the driver chose, say for the last year. (Isn't this how MyChoice-which is up and running fine, just no one uses it and UPS doesn't advertise it-picks the 2hr window?)



Because that would make sense and we're talking about UPS. Mutually exclusive.
 

OptimusPrime

Well-Known Member
I've said it before in other posts...UPS is creating Skynet. The T-1000 will be delivering packages for them one day. Either way even if Orion is implemented, I still do my route the way I think it should be done. (when I drive anyway,) I shuffle through my air first to see what I can deliver with the ground, then I'll hit my heaviest bulk stops so I can move through my truck, and try to deliver everything in trace (if the trace makes sense.) If I have to break for a few air stops at 10 then I will. All that to say, Ehff ORION's face.

Could be rough sledding. The T-1000 has problems with cold/heat.
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
Beyond that, they said that when it gets the final release to all the centers in the hub, that it would require something like an 80% or 85% adherence to the DIAD. That's the biggest issue to me. If that was the case, I would have been fired in a week...

The company has two options as far as I am concerned.

Option A; I will continue to go out every day and use my 26 years of driving experience and 18 years of area knowledge on my route to make the best, most productive decisions I can regarding how to deal with the needs of the customers and the day-to-day variables of the job.

Or.........

Option B; I shut my brain off completely and run the route 100% their way, unthinking and unquestioning, according to EDD or ORION or whatever the hell program they want to implement. Not 80%, not 90%, but 100 effing percent. Their plan, their fail. Missed businesses? Not my problem. Missed pickups? Not my problem. Out of fuel on some back-ass country road at 9:30 at night? Not my problem. You want "compliance", by God you will get "compliance".

What will NOT be an option...is for me to make an already difficult job even harder for myself by trying to do "percentage on trace" arithmetic in my head so that I can generate an arbitrary 85% compliance metric on a report that some IE nitwit will look at and masturbate to in his cubicle. I have a route to run in the real world, and if some guy I have never met isnt happy with the numbers I generate he can kiss my ass.
 

Brownkeg8

Member
Does Orion take into account the fact that on many routes you simply MUST get some bulk stops off early to enable you to be able to move on the car? Or does it send you to deliver a stop off the middle of shelf 7 when the back three quarters of the car are still corked.

Does the plan adjust if you are running behind the original planned schedule. What if you have to shag a misload or three.. are you now going to be late for the business stops ORION thought you would get to at 1645 or does it rearrange on the fly so you make it before 5pm and avoid a missed?

It would be impressive if it would do these things but I bet for quite some time to come it's going to come down to the driver's route knowledge and skill to make it work.


Easiest way to explain is your car is loaded according to the PAS system just as it is now. They then run the orion program and it programs your shortest route for the day, this route never changes throughout the day. Now the problem is you are selecting from any shelf if that street will save you mileage and often you may be pulling from multiple shelves in a very short time, basically you are picking through the load not just grabbing the next stop. This orion plan will change daily and your last air stop will often include doing resi's that are in that area. So basically you will find yourself delivering at 10:15 am out your back door to grab the 7500 work or as we all know scratching your head trying to figure out how they expect you to find 6500 work in a bulked out truck.
 
friend........that......somebody who plays with a keyboard and a mouse ...is going to tell you how to do your route???? How about when you open your back door and there is so much crap falling out?? How are you supposed to deliver tha in order??? Why dont they try something new??? (i DONT KNOW LIKE GETTING US OUT OF THE BLDG ON TIME!!!!) Or like puttting the right package in the correct car!!!Or like keeping my route the same so that I may have some kind of a routine!!!! Oh wait that makes way too much sense!!!!!DEAR GOD...PLEASE GIVE ME STRENGTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Ms.PacMan

Well-Known Member
I have about 3-4 resi air per day. This could be very interesting if I'm delivering 3-4 neighborhoods of resi's in the morning.

I'm kinda looking forward to it - it sounds totally farked up!
 
Its the worst system ever. It will have you do anything to attempt to cut miles like making left hand turns to make delivers on busy streets. Its so flawed it tells you how many miles you should run that day based off the way they want u to run the route but most of the time if you follow what it says 100 percent you end up doing more miles.
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
A few questions about ORION:

1- Does ORION take bulk stops, load quality or pickup containment issues into account when resequencing deliveries?

2- Will I.E. increase the time allowance we are given for selecting a package since ORION has us hunting for and pulling consecutive stops off of different shelves instead of utilizing the 30-60 inch shelf selection method?

3. Can ORION differentiate between a paved 55MPH highway and a single- lane washboard gravel road when it plans the "optimum" travel route for our next stop(s)?

4. Will ORION know how to resequence deliveries in order to avoid traffic jams, school zones, or businesses with shift changes that cause congestion or dock access issues?

5. Will ORION be able to take into account the fact that the driver who drops off/ retrieves a pup trailer from a fixed point in his loop must (a) drop that trailer before making any deliveries and (b) return to that point to retrieve the trailer after completing his deliveries when it resequences those deliveries?

6. Will ORION factor in (a) commit times for NDA, (b) commit times for NDA saver, (c) scheduled pickup times, (d) closing times for businesses,(e) On Call Air stops (friend) "Smart" pickups that may or may not drop out of the pickup log, or (g) commit times for My Choice stops when it resequences our deliveries?

7. Will ORION factor in the need for us to arrange meet points and take stops off of other drivers in the loop who have 8 hr requests or 9.5 hr grievances when it resequences our deliveries?

8. Will local management be empowered to make exceptions to the "85% compliance rule" based upon unique circumstances or operational issues once ORION is implemented?

9. Will input from drivers with decades of experience and area knowledge be sought out and acted upon when ORION is implemented?

10. Will a system be in place to identify, troubleshoot and correct any flaws with ORION in a timely manner once it has been implemented?

11. Have the people who are responsible for implementing ORION ever driven a package car, delivered a package or managed a package center?

12. Will the efficacy of the ORION program be reevaluted in an honest and open-minded manner if it has been proven not to fullfill its goals of increasing productivity and decreasing miles?


....nope, thats kinda what I figured...
 

UPSGUY72

Well-Known Member
A few questions about ORION:

1- Does ORION take bulk stops, load quality or pickup containment issues into account when resequencing deliveries?

NO

2- Will I.E. increase the time allowance we are given for selecting a package since ORION has us hunting for and pulling consecutive stops off of different shelves instead of utilizing the 30-60 inch shelf selection method?

No if anything shorten it.

3. Can ORION differentiate between a paved 55MPH highway and a single- lane washboard gravel road when it plans the "optimum" travel route for our next stop(s)?

NO just like anything it only as good a the person inputting the information .

4. Will ORION know how to resequence deliveries in order to avoid traffic jams, school zones, or businesses with shift changes that cause congestion or dock access issues?

No

5. Will ORION be able to take into account the fact that the driver who drops off/ retrieves a pup trailer from a fixed point in his loop must (a) drop that trailer before making any deliveries and (b) return to that point to retrieve the trailer after completing his deliveries when it resequences those deliveries?

Nope

6. Will ORION factor in (a) commit times for NDA, (b) commit times for NDA saver, (c) scheduled pickup times, (d) closing times for businesses,(e) On Call Air stops (friend) "Smart" pickups that may or may not drop out of the pickup log, or (g) commit times for My Choice stops when it resequences our deliveries?

IT will tell you you have to be at your first delivery stop right after your start time. It doesn't into account driving time.

7. Will ORION factor in the need for us to arrange meet points and take stops off of other drivers in the loop who have 8 hr requests or 9.5 hr grievances when it resequences our deliveries?

Nope

8. Will local management be empowered to make exceptions to the "85% compliance rule" based upon unique circumstances or operational issues once ORION is implemented?

who cares

9. Will input from drivers with decades of experience and area knowledge be sought out and acted upon when ORION is implemented?

They will ride around with you for a day or two if your lucky.

10. Will a system be in place to identify, troubleshoot and correct any flaws with ORION in a timely manner once it has been implemented?

the People implementing Orion into you building will be there for months if not a good year working out all the problems.

11. Have the people who are responsible for implementing ORION ever driven a package car, delivered a package or managed a package center?

Some have some haven't and some are computer geeks that haven't a clue. One of my old ORS is working on ORION traveling around the country.

12. Will the efficacy of the ORION program be reevaluted in an honest and open-minded manner if it has been proven not to fullfill its goals of increasing productivity and decreasing miles?

No UPS will make it work not matter what number have to be manipulated. Kind of like putting a square peg in a round hole eventually it going to fit after you break off the corners.


....nope, thats kinda what I figured...
 

The Other Side

Well-Known Troll
Troll
Not abandoned ... new efforts will be made to improve it. I heard they actually hiring developers to work on the system.

This system is just another attempt to make "optimal decisions" for the company even if it costs them an extra thousand dollars a week to do the business wrong.

I.T. people have too much time on their hands, and not enough time on the road actually doing the job.

Peace

TOS
 

GoForBroke

Active Member
A few questions about ORION:

1- Does ORION take bulk stops, load quality or pickup containment issues into account when resequencing deliveries?
It can take bulk stops into account, but others item not so much

2- Will I.E. increase the time allowance we are given for selecting a package since ORION has us hunting for and pulling consecutive stops off of different shelves instead of utilizing the 30-60 inch shelf selection method?
no allowance changes will be made, unless the to/from paths are changed

3. Can ORION differentiate between a paved 55MPH highway and a single- lane washboard gravel road when it plans the "optimum" travel route for our next stop(s)?
sort of, it know the speed limits of the the raods travelled. and if needed the ORION team can change the speed limit

4. Will ORION know how to resequence deliveries in order to avoid traffic jams, school zones, or businesses with shift changes that cause congestion or dock access issues?
specific time windows can be added to stops to account for congested times(school lets out, docks close early) there is a future enhancement in the works for ORION to be able to re-optimize out on the road

5. Will ORION be able to take into account the fact that the driver who drops off/ retrieves a pup trailer from a fixed point in his loop must (a) drop that trailer before making any deliveries and (b) return to that point to retrieve the trailer after completing his deliveries when it resequences those deliveries?
yes! fixed daily meet points can be added to a route. this is used extensivley in centers that have satellite routes

6. Will ORION factor in (a) commit times for NDA, (b) commit times for NDA saver, (c) scheduled pickup times, (d) closing times for businesses,(e) On Call Air stops (friend) "Smart" pickups that may or may not drop out of the pickup log, or (g) commit times for My Choice stops when it resequences our deliveries?
YES to A, B, C, D. no to E, friend, G until ORION is able to optimize dynamically(on the fly) those items can be accounted for.

7. Will ORION factor in the need for us to arrange meet points and take stops off of other drivers in the loop who have 8 hr requests or 9.5 hr grievances when it resequences our deliveries?
no, but you should have those items accounted for when dispatching the routes. if you put together a good dispatch plan, pm distaching should not exist

8. Will local management be empowered to make exceptions to the "85% compliance rule" based upon unique circumstances or operational issues once ORION is implemented?
85% trace is tracked on a center average. so some will be above and some will be below

9. Will input from drivers with decades of experience and area knowledge be sought out and acted upon when ORION is implemented?
every bid route route will have at least 2 punch to punch rides, and every cover driver will have at least one. the purpose of the rides are to gather input of the route and area from the experienced and knowladgeable drivers

10. Will a system be in place to identify, troubleshoot and correct any flaws with ORION in a timely manner once it has been implemented?
the ORION team will be in the center for several months, a 60 center for example takes about 5 months to complete. they can work out the flaws. they will also train the center team on troubleshooting as well.

11. Have the people who are responsible for implementing ORION ever driven a package car, delivered a package or managed a package center?
the team memebers that will be riding with drivers have all been drivers and on car sups. the data people, not neccasarily.

12. Will the efficacy of the ORION program be reevaluted in an honest and open-minded manner if it has been proven not to fullfill its goals of increasing productivity and decreasing miles?
it has aready proven its efficacy. thats why the deployment has been ramped up so much


....nope, thats kinda what I figured...

Don't listen to the comments of some jaded person from a test site, who does not not fully know the past, present, and future of the program.
 

stink219

Well-Known Member
Does Orion take into account the fact that on many routes you simply MUST get some bulk stops off early to enable you to be able to move on the car? Or does it send you to deliver a stop off the middle of shelf 7 when the back three quarters of the car are still corked.

Does the plan adjust if you are running behind the original planned schedule. What if you have to shag a misload or three.. are you now going to be late for the business stops ORION thought you would get to at 1645 or does it rearrange on the fly so you make it before 5pm and avoid a missed?

It would be impressive if it would do these things but I bet for quite some time to come it's going to come down to the driver's route knowledge and skill to make it work.


Easiest way to explain is your car is loaded according to the PAS system just as it is now. They then run the orion program and it programs your shortest route for the day, this route never changes throughout the day. Now the problem is you are selecting from any shelf if that street will save you mileage and often you may be pulling from multiple shelves in a very short time, basically you are picking through the load not just grabbing the next stop. This orion plan will change daily and your last air stop will often include doing resi's that are in that area. So basically you will find yourself delivering at 10:15 am out your back door to grab the 7500 work or as we all know scratching your head trying to figure out how they expect you to find 6500 work in a bulked out truck.
That is the total antithesis of the "methods". Bring it on!! It sounds like I will get more OT.
 

Jones

fILE A GRIEVE!
Staff member
Don't listen to the comments of some jaded person from a test site, who does not not fully know the past, present, and future of the program.
What will be the expectation as far as drivers running their routes in trace? What will be the consequences (if any) for consistently not meeting those expectations?
I ask because our PDS is an incompetent and currently very few drivers run their routes anywhere close to the way he chooses to loop them. If your system is screwed up I will probably run my route the way you want me to for a little while just to make a point, but eventually I will just go back to doing things the right way unless I start getting threatened with discipline for not following trace.
 
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