How I would fix all the current problems in this Country.

roadrunner2012

Four hours in the mod queue for a news link
Troll
Dig up this thread and go back to a basic--EDUCATION.

Wow! I agree. This should be interesting.

Not very successful in my State nor the rest of the country.
Left Politicians scream for higher taxes and more money to throw at a failing system to satisfy teacher unions.

Right politicians scream for more tests to hold teachers accountable .

Neither is working and an uneducated society is dragging us down .

Simplified version, but okay, I'll follow those lines of thought. I'm ready for the solution offered in a Free Society.

Solution: American's are free to send their children to private schools -where the school and parent set the rules and the parents pay --only stipulation --government demands -no dropouts under the age of 18 .
Prisoner until 18 in a Private school that is under no gov't jurisdiction except saying you can't leave until you are 18? No matter your proficiency? Is corporal punishment allowed, I mean if the parents say it's okay with them? No gov't supervision, right?

Public funded schools : Not corporal punishment -but a progressive disciplinary system developed and put in place. Disrespecting teachers, disrupting the classrooms so that no learning can occur will not be tolerated. If any "child" does not take school seriously --and the parents have or have not been involved --THE STATE will not allow under 18 year olds to "drop out" --live a life of crime and welfare wreaking havoc on society.
Instead of "Charter Schools" State reformatories will teach skills such as computer programming, electrical, automotive etc--skills to enable one to contribute to society.
So send them to prison because they didn't go to Charter School to begin with? That should work out well. We already have more people than anyone in jail, and that's proven to be a winner.

Until "control" is taken --generation after generation will waste education opportunities, drop out, commit crime and burden society :dissapointed:

What type of "control"? You really sound like a scary, dictator type guy. Hope the NSA is checking IP's, for all of our well being ;)
 

beentheredonethat

Well-Known Member
Island1fox..
In your solution, are you saying private schools where parents pay the entire cost? or are you talking of a voucher system? Private schools are a great option if you as a parent can afford it. But I don't see how most could.

What is a progressive disciplinary system where no corporal punishment is involved? I'm not saying I disagree, but what is step 1, step 2, step 3... etc.
Why do you dislike charter schools and prefer reformatories?

What's your opinion of home schooling?

I agree in theory that education is important and it's critical our children get a good education.

I see the problem as the administration in schools often don't back the teachers and they let kids off with no penalties in the classroom. I also see teachers overall not being paid enough.

I believe our school system should have the following in place:

1. Longer school year. 180 days does not make sense. Summer vacation initially existed due to farmers needing their kids to work the fields. That doesn't occur anymore. No reason that school isn't much longer time period and longer school day.

2. Teaching salary should increase due to the longer work day and days working. Also, I see some kind of bonus for teachers to help offset college costs. Also, I see that instead of straight out pay rates based on seniority. They can receive incentive raises based on the average increase in their students test scores.

3. Speaking of test scores. One national tests instead of tests state by state. Give all the kids similar tests in reading\math\science\History etc. Rank the states\school districts and schools and most importantly teachers on how much progress has been made. I've spoken to companies that issue statewide tests. They indicate that the tests they give out are different to each state and some states like New Mexico are real easy compared to other states.

4. Alternate teaching. Not sure if people saw the 60 minutes article on "Khan Academy" (khanacademy.org). Great ideas are coming from private sector in how to teach students. New ideas like this should be implemented. Other great learning opportunities in STEM fields are being done by usfirst.org

5. Motivation: Not sure how to do it, but there needs to be motivation for kids (and possibly parents too) to get kids to go to school and try.
 

island1fox

Well-Known Member
If Public School system is funded by the public- if parents cannot control their children the State must. Idiots speak of too many people in jail yet let dropout rates skyrocket and schools continue to fail at alarming rates.

Prisoner or not --- should be against the law for anyone under 18 to drop out of school and run the streets.
Not all but many more would be saved if put in forced technical training schools.
 

wkmac

Well-Known Member
Seems to me if one wants to "fix" what is called "education" one might be best serviced starting with the Prussian Education Model and then moving forward in time. Does education serve a means to acquire knowledge and wisdom or does it control and confine it?

Motive and intent of the historical players is also important in determining if what we have now was in fact what they intended. This would seem an important point is seeing the way forward as to the question at hand.
 

wkmac

Well-Known Member
Humans are corrupt, evil, selfish and can't be trusted left to their own individual choices.

So the solution is to hand over monopoly power and the ability to use violence to a handful of above said humans to make sure the rest of us aren't corrupt, evil, selfish and act trustworthy.

Therefore a corrupt, evil, selfish and dishonest gov't is just unthinkable if not just impossible.

:wink2:
 

wkmac

Well-Known Member
Create an education system that produces thinking kids like this and you're on to something.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtiEQ7GNens

But then is that what education actually is in the first place? Besides the political powers of both sides would never do that as a kid like this would throw both sides out on their arse. Maybe that in itself speaks volumes as to why the schooling system is doing the fine job that it does. As the outcome benefits the ruling class!

:peaceful:
 

oldngray

nowhere special
You would eliminate all chlidren in trailer parks. Just sayin. Then who would vote republican?

Peace

TOS

Eliminating the trailer park vote would discriminate against Democrats. Republicans wouldn't mind except they believe in the right of every eligible voter to be allowed to vote, but only those eligible to vote, and vote only once. No trailer park votes would cause the Democrats to cry about voter suppression.
 

island1fox

Well-Known Member
Island1fox..
In your solution, are you saying private schools where parents pay the entire cost? or are you talking of a voucher system? Private schools are a great option if you as a parent can afford it. But I don't see how most could.

What is a progressive disciplinary system where no corporal punishment is involved? I'm not saying I disagree, but what is step 1, step 2, step 3... etc.
Why do you dislike charter schools and prefer reformatories?

What's your opinion of home schooling?

I agree in theory that education is important and it's critical our children get a good education.

I see the problem as the administration in schools often don't back the teachers and they let kids off with no penalties in the classroom. I also see teachers overall not being paid enough.

I believe our school system should have the following in place:

1. Longer school year. 180 days does not make sense. Summer vacation initially existed due to farmers needing their kids to work the fields. That doesn't occur anymore. No reason that school isn't much longer time period and longer school day.

2. Teaching salary should increase due to the longer work day and days working. Also, I see some kind of bonus for teachers to help offset college costs. Also, I see that instead of straight out pay rates based on seniority. They can receive incentive raises based on the average increase in their students test scores.

3. Speaking of test scores. One national tests instead of tests state by state. Give all the kids similar tests in reading\math\science\History etc. Rank the states\school districts and schools and most importantly teachers on how much progress has been made. I've spoken to companies that issue statewide tests. They indicate that the tests they give out are different to each state and some states like New Mexico are real easy compared to other states.

4. Alternate teaching. Not sure if people saw the 60 minutes article on "Khan Academy" (khanacademy.org). Great ideas are coming from private sector in how to teach students. New ideas like this should be implemented. Other great learning opportunities in STEM fields are being done by usfirst.org

5. Motivation: Not sure how to do it, but there needs to be motivation for kids (and possibly parents too) to get kids to go to school and try.

beenthere,


My point on Private schools --if you are a parent and pay full cost --I have no say on how YOUR children are educated --the only exception is that the State SHOULD HAVE the right to insist that a child attend school -at least until the age of 18 --although Obamacare has now recognized children up until age 26.


A Progressive disciplinary system could easily be developed with verbal warnings, documented warnings and suspensions --notifying both the student and the parent-----the real deterrent will be the mandatory technical school. If it comes down to a student either discharged or drops out --the state gives the parents and minor a few choices --military school and than active duty or a State controlled reformatory -to form social skills as well as to train in various technical career skills.
As far as motivation in the STATE technical school --weekend passes --telephone use, computer use, sports activities, tv, movies are all used as earned or not.
Homework and test scores will used to give or take above mentioned activities.

I do not favor Charter schools because only a selected FEW will escape the chaotic public system. We have to get control so that the teachers are given an opportunity to teach and then we can hold them accountable. The amount of violence and disruption on a daily basis would shock most American's if they were made aware of it.
Once the PUBLIC SCHOOL system --that we all pay for -children or not --is functioning properly --no need for "Charter schools" and most people would send their children to safe and efficient schools rather than homeschool.

The money saved by not diverting to a Charter School would support top notch Technical Schools with highly motivated and skilled professionals as Teachers and substitute parents. Not all but many "childen" will be saved from a wasted life of crime.

The out of control "student" is one of the major reasons the schools are failing. Teachers and students are in fear --the disruptions reduce learning for all ---no one wants to identify the REAL problem --because of political correctness.

In todays system Problem "students" after causing major disruption --DROP OUT --of schools --enter crime --gangs , drugs robberies --we PAY again ---they are sent to Prison --we PAY again---they come out of Prison --"father" children out of wedlock --we PAY again--they collect all "entitlement programs" --WE PAY AGAIN --their illegitimate children attend school ---AND THE CYCLE CONTINUES.:dissapointed:


This is almost as stupid as the dopey liberal press and millions of American's are tuned in to the Zimmerman trial.

There will be thousands and thousands of gang related killings in the inner cities --much of it minority on minority --with ILLEGAL GUNS --in tough GUN CONTROLL states --and --again because of political correctness --nothing is done. The press will just convince us the Zimmerman trial is --black vs White and is the most important. Go figure ????
 

804brown

Well-Known Member
Trailer Parks ? Those are the biggest Rednecks & Tea-partiers !
Lets face it some poor people vote for the dems on economic issues and some poor people vote repub on social issues. But on the whole they generally dont vote at all!! When these people wake up and realized they have been had, a third party challenge can make a difference.
 

wkmac

Well-Known Member
You vote democrat if you want to protect civil liberties and vote republican for small gov't and fiscal responsibility.


tumblr_lx7do6sgZK1qatdza.jpg


I'm with the bear on that one!
 

Upsmule

Well-Known Member
Trailer Parks ? Those are the biggest Rednecks & Tea-partiers !
Lets face it some poor people vote for the dems on economic issues and some poor people vote repub on social issues. But on the whole they generally dont vote at all!! When these people wake up and realized they have been had, a third party challenge can make a difference.

Exactly. Hopefully sooner than later.
 

beentheredonethat

Well-Known Member
A Progressive disciplinary system could easily be developed with verbal warnings, documented warnings and suspensions --notifying both the student and the parent-----the real deterrent will be the mandatory technical school. If it comes down to a student either discharged or drops out --the state gives the parents and minor a few choices --military school and than active duty or a State controlled reformatory -to form social skills as well as to train in various technical career skills.

No such thing as easy when you talk about schools\politics\children. I wish you were right, but easy is not a word I'd ever use.

Once the PUBLIC SCHOOL system --that we all pay for -children or not --is functioning properly --no need for "Charter schools" and most people would send their children to safe and efficient schools rather than homeschool.

I fear that even if you are right, the timing would be such that my grandchildren wouldn't see this enacted (and they haven't been born yet).

The money saved by not diverting to a Charter School would support top notch Technical Schools with highly motivated and skilled professionals as Teachers and substitute parents.

We don't have charter schools in my area, (we do have private schools, parochial schools etc), Yet we don't really have enough money for our school systems. The teachers aren't paid all too well especially new ones. I think a large part of problem is due to all the kids with IAP's that need one on one aids. Now, let me be clear. I think we do have a duty to teach all kids. However, my wife is a substitute teacher in town. She has done the elementary school and middle school. She subs for aids as well as teachers. She said the lion's share of the kids with IAP's (aka needing aids) are mostly due to parents who don't teach their kids to know their numbers before first grade or teach them the alphabet, basic spelling, basic reading etc. Also, many of these same kids eat nothing but JUNK food. Total junk, their snack is candy, basically just junk food. Then guess what, they misbehave after snack time.. I'd probably misbehave if my blood sugar level spiked like those kids.

The out of control "student" is one of the major reasons the schools are failing. Teachers and students are in fear --the disruptions reduce learning for all ---no one wants to identify the REAL problem --because of political correctness.

AGREED.
 
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