Is Smith Ready To Make the Move to Ground?

[MrFedEx]

hahaha I will have to try that!!! Thanks Fred does that come from your cookbook how to keep your sweatshop workers nurished so they produce.

It's called "Fred's Cookbook For Impoverished Wage Slaves", $29.99 at Amazon.com.

 

[MrFedEx]

Right, which is basically what I said. Many RTD's are part time because there isn't enough FT work for them. Unfortunately, MFE doesn't get that.

How many UPS feeder drivers are PT? None that I know of. How does UPS find work when there isn't enough work for their truck drivers? Here's my point, which you'll undoubtedly miss by a mile. Quality companies make a commitment to their employees to maximize their own (the employee's) profitability as well as that of the organization. If someone wants to be PT, that's fine, but if they want FT, FedEx needs to step-up the number of job shares in order to retain a quality workforce. It's pretty expensive to train a Class A CDL driver, give them some experience wrecking things, and then lose them to another company willing to pay them what they are worth. The new federal government safety standards are going to create a severe shortage of safe and highly qualified Class A CDL drivers.


Once again, FedEx proves it's a second rate organization, even compared with WalMart, which pays it's truckers well above the industry standard. Why? Because it pays to retain top-notch drivers in the long run. Cheaper, better service, fewer accidents, and decreased liability for starters.

It's very obvious that you know nothing about trucking. Quit embarassing yourself and FedEx.

 

[newgirl]

Right, which is basically what I said. Many RTD's are part time because there isn't enough FT work for them. Unfortunately, MFE doesn't get that.

What I posted is a FT day. And this is a rinky dink ramp. There is FT work but the part timers don't fight to have the FT positions created. Everyone has given up fighting. And there are those that don't care.

 

[newgirl]

I thought I read a post by a UPSer that UPS is using contractors to run some of their loads and taking runs away from their trailer drivers (not sure what they are called.) That's taking a play right out of Fred's playbook.

As for reducing costs, I think that if you look at the economy as a whole, a lot of companies are making a profit by reducing costs, not by selling more stuff. We are doing the same thing. Making money by saving money is not a way to grow a company. X on the domestic side is kind of topped out. This project condor thing is the first new idea they have come up in a long time but is it going to take away from our other services?

If, as a shipper, what am I looking for service wise? Is UPS SDA a popular service at UPS? Were customers asking for it? Will we keep E2? I wonder what the proce structure will be? Will it take away from E2 like SO took away from P1?

 

[MrFedEx]

I thought I read a post by a UPSer that UPS is using contractors to run some of their loads and taking runs away from their trailer drivers (not sure what they are called.) That's taking a play right out of Fred's playbook.

As for reducing costs, I think that if you look at the economy as a whole, a lot of companies are making a profit by reducing costs, not by selling more stuff. We are doing the same thing. Making money by saving money is not a way to grow a company. X on the domestic side is kind of topped out. This project condor thing is the first new idea they have come up in a long time but is it going to take away from our other services?

If, as a shipper, what am I looking for service wise? Is UPS SDA a popular service at UPS? Were customers asking for it? Will we keep E2? I wonder what the proce structure will be? Will it take away from E2 like SO took away from P1?

Fred has been outsourcing RTD work for years now, because he can do whatever he wants. UPS can only hire temporary drivers or contract work out during peak, when the regular workforce cannot handle the amount of freight. In short, their union contract protects FT work.

When I was a RTD, our ramp had 6 overnight runs between our ramp and a ramp in a neighboring state. There are still 6 runs, but they're all handled by contractors because they're just a bit cheaper. quadro doesn't want to acknowledge just how much RTD work has been outsourced because it makes FedEx look bad. The RTD job has intentionally been cut-back to mainly part-timers who do only station runs, and not the inter-city hauls that used to be so prevalent.

Like I said, quadro knows squat about trucking, and his ignorance really shows on this issue.

 

[quadro]

You're way too easy. Part-timers do not receive disability, nor overtime, and can be scheduled more or less to exactly fit FedEx needs. Since they probably have no seniority, they are also at the bottom of the 20-year wage progression. When they're needed for extra hours, FedEx specializes in pressuring them to comply..like at peak. Fred would love to have Express be all part-timers. If you want, I can keep right on going.

It's like shooting fish in a barrel. Where shall I start??? Hmm, well let's start with this: PT absolutely do get overtime if they work overtime, just like a FT employee so no savings there.

Seniority. There are plenty of PT employees who have seniority and even if there weren't it wouldn't make a difference. I'll explain why in a moment.

Disability. You are correct on that one and that may or may not make a difference.

You keep talking about how PT'ers are pressured to work. Does that happen? I've no doubt sometimes it does however I see way more PT'ers asking for extra hours than not wanting to work.

So here's the deal. There is plenty of full-time work at FedEx as is evidenced by the number of FT employees and the number of FT postings each week. You would need to replace each FT employee with a PT employee if you cut the FT employee's work in half. Even if you somehow were able to work it so that you only increased by a third or a quarter, that's a lot of new employees. Even at starting pay, the cost to train those employees, the cost of all their benefits which, except for disability, are the same as a FT employee, the cost of extra swing drivers needed to cover all the extra routes created, all of that would far outweigh the savings from lower wages and disability.

The whole concept of making Express a part-time workforce is ludicrous anyway. It's not going to happen but to finish the thought, all the FT employees who are made to go PT are still making the same wage they were making as a FT employee so you've still got hundreds of topped out employees thus reducing any savings even further.

Shall I keep on going?

 

[MrFedEx]

It's like shooting fish in a barrel. Where shall I start??? Hmm, well let's start with this: PT absolutely do get overtime if they work overtime, just like a FT employee so no savings there.

Seniority. There are plenty of PT employees who have seniority and even if there weren't it wouldn't make a difference. I'll explain why in a moment.

Disability. You are correct on that one and that may or may not make a difference.

You keep talking about how PT'ers are pressured to work. Does that happen? I've no doubt sometimes it does however I see way more PT'ers asking for extra hours than not wanting to work.

So here's the deal. There is plenty of full-time work at FedEx as is evidenced by the number of FT employees and the number of FT postings each week. You would need to replace each FT employee with a PT employee if you cut the FT employee's work in half. Even if you somehow were able to work it so that you only increased by a third or a quarter, that's a lot of new employees. Even at starting pay, the cost to train those employees, the cost of all their benefits which, except for disability, are the same as a FT employee, the cost of extra swing drivers needed to cover all the extra routes created, all of that would far outweigh the savings from lower wages and disability.

The whole concept of making Express a part-time workforce is ludicrous anyway. It's not going to happen but to finish the thought, all the FT employees who are made to go PT are still making the same wage they were making as a FT employee so you've still got hundreds of topped out employees thus reducing any savings even further.

Shall I keep on going?

 

[quadro]

How many UPS feeder drivers are PT?

I've no idea and it's irrelevent as we are talking about scheduling at FedEx.

None that I know of. How does UPS find work when there isn't enough work for their truck drivers?

How do you know there isn't enough work available? Do you do their schedules?

Here's my point, which you'll undoubtedly miss by a mile. Quality companies make a commitment to their employees to maximize their own (the employee's) profitability as well as that of the organization. If someone wants to be PT, that's fine, but if they want FT, FedEx needs to step-up the number of job shares in order to retain a quality workforce. It's pretty expensive to train a Class A CDL driver, give them some experience wrecking things, and then lose them to another company willing to pay them what they are worth. The new federal government safety standards are going to create a severe shortage of safe and highly qualified Class A CDL drivers.

I think you missed your own point. How do you maximize an employee's profitability? You give them as much work as possible. How do you do that if you dilute the work by having more FT employees than there is work for?

Once again, FedEx proves it's a second rate organization, even compared with WalMart, which pays it's truckers well above the industry standard. Why? Because it pays to retain top-notch drivers in the long run. Cheaper, better service, fewer accidents, and decreased liability for starters.

It's very obvious that you know nothing about trucking. Quit embarassing yourself and FedEx.

What I know about trucking is also irrelevant. What I know about scheduling and work flow is much more germane to the issue. The problem with job shares in the sense you are using which is combine two PT jobs into one FT, is that you run a large risk of not having an employee where you need them when you need them. If, for example, you have a PT RTD who could be full time if he was an RTD in the a.m. as well as an a.m. courier, what happens when the there's a late aircraft and he or she is needed to double turn and cannot get back to the station in time to run the route? How do you resolve the pay issue between what an RTD gets paid and what a courier gets paid? While that last item shouldn't prevent a job share from happening, it is a very real concern that needs to be worked out to avoid issues that turn into very expensive lawsuits. I know this because I've been there, done that. I've seen the issues first hand and no matter how well intentioned it was, it created some extremely bad outcomes.

Ad hominem arguments seem to be your M.O. recently. I wonder why that is?

 

[quadro]

What I posted is a FT day. And this is a rinky dink ramp. There is FT work but the part timers don't fight to have the FT positions created. Everyone has given up fighting. And there are those that don't care.

Yeah, I know what a FT day is at a ramp. My point was that there's only so much work to go around and you have to balance the number of FT and PT employees as best as you can to get the work done.

 

[MrFedEx]

It's like shooting fish in a barrel. Where shall I start??? Hmm, well let's start with this: PT absolutely do get overtime if they work overtime, just like a FT employee so no savings there.

Seniority. There are plenty of PT employees who have seniority and even if there weren't it wouldn't make a difference. I'll explain why in a moment.

Disability. You are correct on that one and that may or may not make a difference.

You keep talking about how PT'ers are pressured to work. Does that happen? I've no doubt sometimes it does however I see way more PT'ers asking for extra hours than not wanting to work.

So here's the deal. There is plenty of full-time work at FedEx as is evidenced by the number of FT employees and the number of FT postings each week. You would need to replace each FT employee with a PT employee if you cut the FT employee's work in half. Even if you somehow were able to work it so that you only increased by a third or a quarter, that's a lot of new employees. Even at starting pay, the cost to train those employees, the cost of all their benefits which, except for disability, are the same as a FT employee, the cost of extra swing drivers needed to cover all the extra routes created, all of that would far outweigh the savings from lower wages and disability.

The whole concept of making Express a part-time workforce is ludicrous anyway. It's not going to happen but to finish the thought, all the FT employees who are made to go PT are still making the same wage they were making as a FT employee so you've still got hundreds of topped out employees thus reducing any savings even further.

Shall I keep on going?

Amazing "logic". Sure, PT people get OT when they work it, which isn't often. That doesn't save money? The flexibility to have PT people come-in and fill a hole on straight time instead of paying a full-timer OT to do it is huge, which you just flat ignore. You've also ignored answering the RTD questions...because you cannot without looking like an apologist.

How many people can afford to transfer to one of those FT opportunities when their house just lost 40% of it's value, or it's in one of Fred's many markets where pay just plain sucks? Oh yes, you get to be a swing driver most of the time. Where do I sign-up? And where do you get the idea that most PT people make anywhere near their FT counterparts? Most PT couriers I know are low seniority/low pay, which is just where Fred wants them...hungry and willing to plug those holes on straight time.

Your barrel is empty because all the wood has been shot away. Keep trying.

 

[bbsam]

Intresting conversation I to like spam and try not to think about how its made. Unfortunatley for me the Spam we eat is our steak because I work for Ground and can't afford real meat. I am thinking about upgrading to tongue for thanksgiving however I am sure it might taste a little like spam and then maybe next year I can actually afford a Turkey. I just wonder how it will go over with my kids but its ok I have plenty of top ramen to make them.

You might try your local soup kitchen. They usually have Turkey dinners.

 

[vantexan]

You might try your local soup kitchen. They usually have Turkey dinners.

Geez man are you actually telling a FedEx employee to take his family to a soup kitchen on Thanksgiving if he doesn't make enough to provide his family a turkey dinner?

 

[bbsam]

Geez man are you actually telling a FedEx employee to take his family to a soup kitchen on Thanksgiving if he doesn't make enough to provide his family a turkey dinner?

We eat at one. Help with the clean up too.

 

[vantexan]

We eat at one. Help with the clean up too.

Thought you were at home frying Spam.

 

[FedExer267]

You might try your local soup kitchen. They usually have Turkey dinners.

Typical contractor remark. Ype I should take my kids to a soup kitchen for Thanksgiving because working 60 to 70 hours a week dosent provide me a liveable wage. Something wrong with that picture.

 

[bbsam]

Typical contractor remark. Ype I should take my kids to a soup kitchen for Thanksgiving because working 60 to 70 hours a week dosent provide me a liveable wage. Something wrong with that picture.

No. You should do whatever makes you happy. That's why we go. Good time.

 

[FedExer267]

Ya I suppose or maybe Contractors could have a heart and maybe give their employees Turkeys to cook for Thanksgiving

 

[bbsam]

I would, but I doubt you'd like anything I cook. Notice I said I help clean up. I'm not aloud to help cook.

 

[FedExer267]

I was speaking of Contractors in general. Some employees who get treated decently like the little gestures as well.

 

[quadro]

You're way too easy. Part-timers do not receive disability, nor overtime, and can be scheduled more or less to exactly fit FedEx needs. Since they probably have no seniority, they are also at the bottom of the 20-year wage progression. When they're needed for extra hours, FedEx specializes in pressuring them to comply..like at peak. Fred would love to have Express be all part-timers. If you want, I can keep right on going.

Amazing "logic". Sure, PT people get OT when they work it, which isn't often. That doesn't save money? The flexibility to have PT people come-in and fill a hole on straight time instead of paying a full-timer OT to do it is huge, which you just flat ignore. You've also ignored answering the RTD questions...because you cannot without looking like an apologist.

How many people can afford to transfer to one of those FT opportunities when their house just lost 40% of it's value, or it's in one of Fred's many markets where pay just plain sucks? Oh yes, you get to be a swing driver most of the time. Where do I sign-up? And where do you get the idea that most PT people make anywhere near their FT counterparts? Most PT couriers I know are low seniority/low pay, which is just where Fred wants them...hungry and willing to plug those holes on straight time.

Your barrel is empty because all the wood has been shot away. Keep trying.

I've quoted your original post to refresh your memory. You made a categorical statement that PT'ers do not get overtime. That is simply false and misleading. You then try to cover yourself by making a ridiculous statement about PT people getting overtime when they work it. First of all, who get's overtime when they don't work it? I'd like to work there. Secondly, you question my logic and yet you back up my statement that PT'ers get overtime.

I haven't ignored anything (although you would know as you are an expert at that). I explained my position and view on RTD's. I don't claim to know how UPS operates or how much Walmart pays their drivers. I did point out that it was irrelevant as I understand scheduling and work flow and know what the Express RTD's do.

You still haven't explained how you can save money by almost doubling your courier workforce and showing how the disability savings and lower wage will make up for that. Here, I'll help you out to start you off. Cut a FT courier to a PT courier. Assuming he was making $26/hour, you still have to pay him $26/hour but for only 20 hours. Now you hire a PT courier who makes $18/hour (I think it would be more as I think if the topped out courier is at $26, I don't think the range is $8 but I'll go with $18). So you save $8/hour X 20 hours = $160/week or about $700/month. You have to spend money on benefits, training, etc for the new employee. Your $8/hour savings diminishes as time goes on. You are stemming 2 routes out and back each day instead of 1, etc, etc. Eats away at your $700/month savings pretty quickly. As bad as morale may or may not be now, you absolutely destroy it with this move. All things being equal there is no way that Express will go to an all PT workforce. As much as you'd like to scare people into thinking that FedEx would do this, it isn't going to happen.

As for people being able to afford to move, at least FedEx gives them the opportunity. As much as you'd like to blame Fred, it really isn't his fault that the real estate market did what it did. Regardless of that, enlighten us all and show us a company that says to its employees "hey, we know our part time employees could use the money so we're going to make you full time. We don't have the work but we feel bad for you. What's that? The existing full timers? Well they can afford to have their hours cut more so that you new full timers have something to do. What's that? You don't want us to cut their hours? Ok, we won't. We know you'll stand behind us and pat us on the back for making the decision that drives us into bankruptcy. But hey, who the heck wants to plan for the future anyway."