Lead On... to the death of Expres...

TUT

Well-Known Member
I'm going to side with "UpstateNYUPSer" on this one. I know for a FACT that FedEx sales will quote rates that are at least 10% lower than UPS rates -

I went back to re-read. Taking it very literally, it states Fedex will go in and offer 10% off from UPS published rates. I can tell you any customer that ships semi-regularly will get a discount. So if Fedex went in with 10% of UPS rates (which also means 10% of Fedex rates since the published rates are the same, there is once source of equality between the two), you can sleep tidy at night knowing UPS is going in with a discount as well. Either can be lower then the others bid, it's very competitive. If UPS wants to tell their drivers to make them feel better that they only lose business to Fedex because Fedex gave a much better price, I can tell you that is fantasy-land (and it works both ways). Either can lose business for a wide variety of reasons.

Heck Fedex doesn't get some business because they aren't union, where they get other business from companies that won't work with union companies if they can help it. Wide, varying reasons.
 

59 Dano

I just want to make friends!
No, we got thrown under the bus by a combination of meddling politicians who pushed banks to make idiotic loans to millions, greedy Wall Streeters who tried to capitalize on all that flowing money by creating derivative investments that few could actually explain but at their core was a house of cards, greedy corporate types who wanted in on that action and are willing to sell the country down the tubes to do it, and average people who should know enough about their finances to know it was going to hammer them eventually taking a loan they couldn't afford, and finally a opportunistic Federal government that is taking advantage of hard times to concentrate power into Washington while corporate greed is concentrating wealth into fewer and fewer hands. The first decade of this millennium has been a perfect storm for screwing the average joe who has no control over these major issues but sure has to live with the consequences of their mishandling.

In short, people were being people.
 

59 Dano

I just want to make friends!
But those who benefit the most from our system have a responsibility to govern/manage wisely. They don't get a free pass because they are just being people.

They have no more responsibility to do that than you or I do. They probably have a much greater incentive to do so and, all things considered over the long run, I think they do a nice job of it.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
They have no more responsibility to do that than you or I do. They probably have a much greater incentive to do so and, all things considered over the long run, I think they do a nice job of it.

It seems you are enamored with those in power. Given the events of the last ten years to say our leadership, corporate or political, has done a nice job is a head scratcher. And yes, those who are in positions of power and benefit from their power do have a responsibility to govern/manage wisely. Otherwise it's just about enriching themselves. Seems you want them to be able to do that with no repercussions. Only there are always repercussions from a lack of leadership.
 

59 Dano

I just want to make friends!
It seems you are enamored with those in power. Given the events of the last ten years to say our leadership, corporate or political, has done a nice job is a head scratcher.

10 years out of 200+? I specifically said that I think they do a good job over the long run. It's too easy to pluck out whatever small chunk of time we want to illustrate whatever we want. But the last 10 years weren't so bad until the housing bubble burst and the related effects. I'm not enamored with anyone, I just think they do a decent job. As bad as things have been over the last few years, half of Europe would gladly trade places with us, and I don't think that's much of an exaggeration at all. I don't know of any other country that could have dealt with this as well as we did.

And yes, those who are in positions of power and benefit from their power do have a responsibility to govern/manage wisely. Otherwise it's just about enriching themselves. Seems you want them to be able to do that with no repercussions. Only there are always repercussions from a lack of leadership.

Those in the political world don't wield their power or influence very well because they don't stand to benefit from it if it's good, nor do they lose much of anything if it's bad. Those in business have every reason to manage wisely because they make good money from it when they do. I mean, if we're going to cast the wealthy as greedy pigs who are consumed with nothing more but adding to their massive riches, let's at least give them credit for being smart enough to know how to do it.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
10 years out of 200+? I specifically said that I think they do a good job over the long run. It's too easy to pluck out whatever small chunk of time we want to illustrate whatever we want. But the last 10 years weren't so bad until the housing bubble burst and the related effects. I'm not enamored with anyone, I just think they do a decent job. As bad as things have been over the last few years, half of Europe would gladly trade places with us, and I don't think that's much of an exaggeration at all. I don't know of any other country that could have dealt with this as well as we did.



Those in the political world don't wield their power or influence very well because they don't stand to benefit from it if it's good, nor do they lose much of anything if it's bad. Those in business have every reason to manage wisely because they make good money from it when they do. I mean, if we're going to cast the wealthy as greedy pigs who are consumed with nothing more but adding to their massive riches, let's at least give them credit for being smart enough to know how to do it.

Why stop at 200? But I'm talking about decisions made that are directly affecting us right now. Our leadership has made a mess of things. Again you are casting my views in the most extreme i.e. "wealthy as greedy pigs" but the truth is simply they want the power and the wealth and the perks and thus in the process of obtaining that their decisions affect countless lives. They have an obligation to do the right thing(which obviously means different things to different people) so that as few as possible are harmed by their decisions. But are they putting the nation and it's citizens above their own pursuits? I think you know the answer.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
It seems you are enamored with those in power. Given the events of the last ten years to say our leadership, corporate or political, has done a nice job is a head scratcher. And yes, those who are in positions of power and benefit from their power do have a responsibility to govern/manage wisely. Otherwise it's just about enriching themselves. Seems you want them to be able to do that with no repercussions. Only there are always repercussions from a lack of leadership.

Our "leadership" at FedEx has been abysmal. And it is absolutely about enriching themselves...at our expense. Express, for the last 15 years, has basically been a series of takeways facilitated by Mr. Smith's cozy relationships in Washington, DC. There don't seem to be many barriers preventing Fred from pulling off the biggest one yet. He pays for his power and then uses it to abuse us and create quasi-legal entities like Ground. If Fred hadn't purchased so many politicians, there is no way he'd have Ground or the RLA with which to pound Express into submission. He wants to shift business from a less-profitable opco to a more-profitable opco, and he can do it because he has paid-off the right people for a long time.

The massive new aircraft purchase is the most recent example of the top execs doing a Homer, and then patting themselves on the back for being so effing smart. The intelligent move would have been to buy 767F's when they first came out, not over 15 years later. They blew it, and now everyone else pays the price. The consequences for the Big Boys? None, unless you count even higher compensation for making dumb decisions.

The Ground switchover will be the biggest feather ever in Fred's tinfoil cap, and the repercussions will eventually be felt down the line even more strongly than they are today. Ground is going to come tumbling down someday, because you cannot operate a "pretend" business forever and not have it catch up with you. The ISP contractor model at Ground is a front for a scam operation that will not last long-term. Having employees who are supposedly contractors will not stand the legal test in the long run.
 

Cactus

Just telling it like it is
The ISP contractor model at Ground is a front for a scam operation that will not last long-term. Having employees who are supposedly contractors will not stand the legal test in the long run.
Exactly. Especially with the revolving door of "help" that Ground goes through.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Exactly. Especially with the revolving door of "help" that Ground goes through.

There will eventually be a class-action, and FedEx will "deny wrongdoing and vigorously defend itself'. I fully expect that Ground drivers will eventually be true employees, especially if they keep having so many accidents. The LCD(Lowest Common Denominator) model only works to a certain point, and then bad things happen, as demonstrated in the case of the $450 per week flat rate Ground driver in CA that turned in front of the motorcyclist. Maybe the Ground driver is actually competent, but you generally get what you pay for, and $450 per week isn't much. As others have pointed out, the incentive to not work 60 hours for an abusive ISP would probably incentivize many people to cut corners on safety.

If Fred could import illegals to drive for Ground he'd do it in a heartbeat, because it's all about the money. There is no moral compass, no conscience, no caring for the people whose lives get ruined or ended. Profit-Profit-Profit.
 

Ricochet1a

Well-Known Member
I was forwarded a number of the number of pieces that went through the Express system for FY12 that were directly linked to the sales lead (Lead On) program. This number was slightly over 400,000 pieces. I'm not absolutely confident in this number, but I have no other reason to doubt it. Supposedly there is a poster going up in Express stations, which gives the total number of pieces generated by the Lead On program in FY 12 - so if any Express employees have seen this poster, please confirm the number.

To put this in context...

Express is moving an average of 2,600,000 pieces a day right now. The "Lead On" program brought in that 400,000+ number (annual). If one uses 250 operating days a year (one could use 257), divide the volume gained by Lead On by annual operating days, to get a figure in the 1200 range.

So in a network that is moving 2,600,000 pieces a day, 1,200 of those were a result of sales leads generated by Couriers. Put in percentage terms, it is 0.0462%.

Does "drop in the bucket" come to mind?

Express knows damn well that the Couriers aren't going to perform some miracle and generate even an additional 26,000 pieces a day (1% jump in volume), forget about restoring those "missing" 200,000 pieces a day moving through the system.

The whole push for Lead On, is a subterfuge for what is going to happen.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
I was forwarded a number of the number of pieces that went through the Express system for FY12 that were directly linked to the sales lead (Lead On) program. This number was slightly over 400,000 pieces. I'm not absolutely confident in this number, but I have no other reason to doubt it. Supposedly there is a poster going up in Express stations, which gives the total number of pieces generated by the Lead On program in FY 12 - so if any Express employees have seen this poster, please confirm the number.

To put this in context...

Express is moving an average of 2,600,000 pieces a day right now. The "Lead On" program brought in that 400,000+ number (annual). If one uses 250 operating days a year (one could use 257), divide the volume gained by Lead On by annual operating days, to get a figure in the 1200 range.

So in a network that is moving 2,600,000 pieces a day, 1,200 of those were a result of sales leads generated by Couriers. Put in percentage terms, it is 0.0462%.

Does "drop in the bucket" come to mind?

Express knows damn well that the Couriers aren't going to perform some miracle and generate even an additional 26,000 pieces a day (1% jump in volume), forget about restoring those "missing" 200,000 pieces a day moving through the system.

The whole push for Lead On, is a subterfuge for what is going to happen.

Exactly. All smoke and mirrors leading to a "justification" for what it about to occur. As we both know, this has been the plan for the last 4 years.
 

Cactus

Just telling it like it is
I was forwarded a number of the number of pieces that went through the Express system for FY12 that were directly linked to the sales lead (Lead On) program. This number was slightly over 400,000 pieces. I'm not absolutely confident in this number, but I have no other reason to doubt it. Supposedly there is a poster going up in Express stations, which gives the total number of pieces generated by the Lead On program in FY 12 - so if any Express employees have seen this poster, please confirm the number. To put this in context...Express is moving an average of 2,600,000 pieces a day right now. The "Lead On" program brought in that 400,000+ number (annual). If one uses 250 operating days a year (one could use 257), divide the volume gained by Lead On by annual operating days, to get a figure in the 1200 range. So in a network that is moving 2,600,000 pieces a day, 1,200 of those were a result of sales leads generated by Couriers. Put in percentage terms, it is 0.0462%.Does "drop in the bucket" come to mind?Express knows damn well that the Couriers aren't going to perform some miracle and generate even an additional 26,000 pieces a day (1% jump in volume), forget about restoring those "missing" 200,000 pieces a day moving through the system. The whole push for Lead On, is a subterfuge for what is going to happen.
Yep. That sure is a lot of push for such little in realistic results. Another branch of the smoke and mirrors system.
 
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