R1a Was Right!!

vantexan

Well-Known Member
Posters here SHOULD pull up as many links to non-IBT unions and CALL THEM. This work was already done over a year ago by myself and others I know, and I posted extensively about it here. Search "jurisdictional issues" and "union turf" with me as the poster. But by all means, call for yourself and report the findings you get here.

The conversation will go something like this:

You: Hi Mr. xxxxx I'm a Courier with FedEx Express and I'd like some information regarding potentially organizing Express Couriers under your union.

Organizer: Did you say FedEx Express?

You: Most certainly, FedEx Express, which has us under the Railway Labor Act

Organizer: Well................ You see...................

I linked a rather extensive list of labor unions up in one of my posts. You can pull that up, or you can merely search Wiki for a listing of labor unions, and use that list.

Call away and report back here what you find.

If you don't want to go to all that trouble, I understand. No other union OTHER THAN the IBT will even look at non-mechanics within FedEx Express. Won't happen, no time, no way. But by all means, go out and gather this information yourself and prove it to yourself then post your results here.

If you really want to organize - given the complete inactivity in the past 2 weeks after the announcement of no pay raises - you are going to have to make the IBT wake up and realize there is life out there in Expressland.

They aren't going to come to you, you are going to have to GO TO THEM. They aren't going to like being treated like they are something that you'd scrape off the bottom of your shoe (our resident twit made his feelings clear in that regard). And they aren't going to hand you a $100 gift card at a retailer of your choice just for signing one of their representation cards.

If you cannot or will not leave Express, you have only two alternatives: choose what Fred is doing TO YOU or make a choice to find out what the IBT can do FOR YOU.

Yep, he's a Teamster organizer. I think we know what the IBT WILL DO, nothing. Prove me wrong messiah.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
I had a plan and Ive been sticking to it but it hasn't been easy....herding pusillanimous cats is extremely hard!!! I think loop to loop is the best way to go about it...simplify it so you don't feel overwhelmed trying to unionize the whole station at once....
I agree that someone other then the Teamsters is a great idea...

Great idea! Organize within the station! Talk it up and let us know how big your unemployment check is too.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Posters here SHOULD pull up as many links to non-IBT unions and CALL THEM. This work was already done over a year ago by myself and others I know, and I posted extensively about it here. Search "jurisdictional issues" and "union turf" with me as the poster. But by all means, call for yourself and report the findings you get here.

The conversation will go something like this:

You: Hi Mr. xxxxx I'm a Courier with FedEx Express and I'd like some information regarding potentially organizing Express Couriers under your union.

Organizer: Did you say FedEx Express?

You: Most certainly, FedEx Express, which has us under the Railway Labor Act

Organizer: Well................ You see...................

I linked a rather extensive list of labor unions up in one of my posts. You can pull that up, or you can merely search Wiki for a listing of labor unions, and use that list.

Call away and report back here what you find.

If you don't want to go to all that trouble, I understand. No other union OTHER THAN the IBT will even look at non-mechanics within FedEx Express. Won't happen, no time, no way. But by all means, go out and gather this information yourself and prove it to yourself then post your results here.

If you really want to organize - given the complete inactivity in the past 2 weeks after the announcement of no pay raises - you are going to have to make the IBT wake up and realize there is life out there in Expressland.

They aren't going to come to you, you are going to have to GO TO THEM. They aren't going to like being treated like they are something that you'd scrape off the bottom of your shoe (our resident twit made his feelings clear in that regard). And they aren't going to hand you a $100 gift card at a retailer of your choice just for signing one of their representation cards.

If you cannot or will not leave Express, you have only two alternatives: choose what Fred is doing TO YOU or make a choice to find out what the IBT can do FOR YOU.

At Tigers, for example, the handlers, mechanics, and office staff were all IAM. I don't know about the drivers because a lot of them were contract carriers and not bona fide Tigers employees. One large company I am aware of has all of it's shop people covered by the IAM, and all the drivers by the IBT, so there does seem to be "turf".

Sometimes, however, unions do jump borders, especially when they want members. Back in 1996, the IBT had other unions also courting Express.
 

overflowed

Well-Known Member
I had a plan and Ive been sticking to it but it hasn't been easy....herding pusillanimous cats is extremely hard!!! I think loop to loop is the best way to go about it...simplify it so you don't feel overwhelmed trying to unionize the whole station at once....
I agree that someone other then the Teamsters is a great idea...

This takes time and patience. You need to talk to people you trust first and let the idea spread. Once the pack mentality spreads it actually gets easier. Watch out for the arse kissers they need not be approached or talked to. Make sure others understand that too. I think herding cats would be easier as well.
 
Im not talking about doing any type of organizing in the station....Im talking about somehow getting the word out to the people in each loop who may be helpful in taking care of their loop...I pretty much have a idea of who those people are in every loop in my station....either through a packet on their car windshield or something similar....

Great idea! Organize within the station! Talk it up and let us know how big your unemployment check is too.
 

Ricochet1a

Well-Known Member
yes, after the discussions I've had with co-workers over the past few weeks, sadly I've come to the conclusion that it would actually be easier to herd cats than to get these jokers to step out on a limb to better themselves.

Yes, that is conclusion I came too while doing my attempt at 'organizing' in late 2009-early 2010. The Express implanted propaganda (the 'you're special' malarky) has worked wonderfully - even in the face of all the takeaways.

My time at Express is nearly at an end, and as for these guys who still have another 10, 15, 20 years to go - I don't even feel sorry for 'em any more. I'm now 100% convinced that the Stockholm Syndrome is rampant at FedEx Express.

Fred wins ...... (in this world)

Stockholm syndrome is also prevalent among some of the posters here too...

I've come to the conclusion that the majority of posters (and all of the lurkers) are what I'd term 'internet gawkers'. They won't make ANY move to change the situation they're in, but they'll spend time reading/posting and just looking here, to find out if someone ELSE out there is taking some action (which they could then jump onto the bandwagon AFTER all the real work has been done).

I can state now (I said I'd wait a week to see what action occurred here prior to making a determination if sheep or wolves were present), that the sheep are so prevalent, that any howling which may occur, is completely drown out by all the bleating going on.

I know it may make those who have some desire to do something, angry to read that above statement; but reality must be faced.

One-quarter to one-third of the 'viewers' to this site are looking at FedEx content at any one time (I'm not saying 'posting activity', I'm saying VIEWERS). There are a lot of gawkers hoping to see some action taking place, so that they would have some hope of hanging on and waiting for some form of 'rescue'. For these people, there isn't going to be any 'rescue', because you're not willing to go to the effort to save yourselves.

At this point in the game, if there isn't at least ONE Courier in each of the medium to large stations out there stepping up (posting here) and wanting to do nothing more than distribute rep cards and communicate with a grassroots organization - then organizing will NEVER HAPPEN. The vast majority are gawkers, watching, waiting for someone else out there to do all the work for them. It isn't going to happen.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Yes, that is conclusion I came too while doing my attempt at 'organizing' in late 2009-early 2010. The Express implanted propaganda (the 'you're special' malarky) has worked wonderfully - even in the face of all the takeaways.



Stockholm syndrome is also prevalent among some of the posters here too...

I've come to the conclusion that the majority of posters (and all of the lurkers) are what I'd term 'internet gawkers'. They won't make ANY move to change the situation they're in, but they'll spend time reading/posting and just looking here, to find out if someone ELSE out there is taking some action (which they could then jump onto the bandwagon AFTER all the real work has been done).

I can state now (I said I'd wait a week to see what action occurred here prior to making a determination if sheep or wolves were present), that the sheep are so prevalent, that any howling which may occur, is completely drown out by all the bleating going on.

I know it may make those who have some desire to do something, angry to read that above statement; but reality must be faced.

One-quarter to one-third of the 'viewers' to this site are looking at FedEx content at any one time (I'm not saying 'posting activity', I'm saying VIEWERS). There are a lot of gawkers hoping to see some action taking place, so that they would have some hope of hanging on and waiting for some form of 'rescue'. For these people, there isn't going to be any 'rescue', because you're not willing to go to the effort to save yourselves.

At this point in the game, if there isn't at least ONE Courier in each of the medium to large stations out there stepping up (posting here) and wanting to do nothing more than distribute rep cards and communicate with a grassroots organization - then organizing will NEVER HAPPEN. The vast majority are gawkers, watching, waiting for someone else out there to do all the work for them. It isn't going to happen.

That's why I asked in another post if people were really serious. Judging from the handful of replies I got...they aren't. If you like the sheet sandwich Fred has been serving you every day, by all means, continue to dine in-style. But if you want anything to change, it requires action, not observation.

Fred has been doing us every which way for years, and most of you apparently like it.

I don't.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
Thank you....

Yes, after trying to organize FedEx he determined he better get out as quickly as possible. And that's what he wants for us. I'm not being anti-union, just fed up with the notion that the Teamsters will come to our rescue if we stick our necks out and risk our livelihoods. But Van, so what if you lose your job, you'll be helping others! I'm sorry, not going to risk my paycheck to get a situation where the most senior benefit the most, after much considered negotiating, and mid-range get left in the cold. That's essentially what happened in '97-'98, could have gotten a union in, topped out employees were mollified with substantial raises, and the rest of us since then have been told to eff off if we don't like it. And we're all paying now because of it. And things are very different now. FedEx has pretty much gotten the government to turn it's back on us, and it's glaringly apparent that there's not a snowball's chance in hell of getting a union in. The Teamsters were allied with UPS in attempting to get FedEx off the RLA. They both wanted and desperately needed our membership. So why since the FAA bill was passed have they gone completely off the radar? They know it's hopeless. They still want and need us but it's damn near impossible under the law to get us. It's not about them wanting to just focus on UPS. We're being sold false hope by a false messiah. A world class troll. Prove me wrong!
 

Ricochet1a

Well-Known Member
At Tigers, for example, the handlers, mechanics, and office staff were all IAM. I don't know about the drivers because a lot of them were contract carriers and not bona fide Tigers employees. One large company I am aware of has all of it's shop people covered by the IAM, and all the drivers by the IBT, so there does seem to be "turf".

Sometimes, however, unions do jump borders, especially when they want members. Back in 1996, the IBT had other unions also courting Express.

Two points...

1. The full 'impact' of the RLA wasn't realized back then in regards to Express. The RLA makes Express toxic to practically all unions out there now, due to the ENORMOUS expense in attempting to organize under those rules and by having all the work locations in Express dispersed with no communication between the employees of those dispersed locations (makes organizing a nightmare).

2. The past 15 years have shown that the tendency of Express Couriers to act like those 'cats' is well deserved . Despite what many may think, successful organizing drives DON'T require the unions to need to engage in a massive 'sales job'. Successful organizing drives are merely the guiding of already convinced employees (convinced that they're getting or will be screwed by their employer), to band together and organize.

I hate to use this analogy, but successful organizing it is more akin to a cattle drive, than a 'cat drive'. Cats can only be led somewhere if they see some sort of IMMEDIATE reward (treat, toy, what have you). Everyone here has seen just that - those who want an immediate treat or toy to get them to 'go along'. It doesn't work like that. If the reward of being in a collective group (that awkward cattle drive analogy), isn't enough for potential union members, then an organization drive will never work.

The pissed off employees must be willing to to recognize that: If you can't bring the mountain (IBT) to Mohammed (Express Couriers), bring Mohammed to the mountain.
 

MAKAVELI

Well-Known Member
Thank you....

Yes, after trying to organize FedEx he determined he better get out as quickly as possible. And that's what he wants for us. I'm not being anti-union, just fed up with the notion that the Teamsters will come to our rescue if we stick our necks out and risk our livelihoods. But Van, so what if you lose your job, you'll be helping others! I'm sorry, not going to risk my paycheck to get a situation where the most senior benefit the most, after much considered negotiating, and mid-range get left in the cold. That's essentially what happened in '97-'98, could have gotten a union in, topped out employees were mollified with substantial raises, and the rest of us since then have been told to eff off if we don't like it. And we're all paying now because of it. And things are very different now. FedEx has pretty much gotten the government to turn it's back on us, and it's glaringly apparent that there's not a snowball's chance in hell of getting a union in. The Teamsters were allied with UPS in attempting to get FedEx off the RLA. They both wanted and desperately needed our membership. So why since the FAA bill was passed have they gone completely off the radar? They know it's hopeless. They still want and need us but it's damn near impossible under the law to get us. It's not about them wanting to just focus on UPS. We're being sold false hope by a false messiah. A world class troll. Prove me wrong!

All of you need to take a chill pill. Understand one thing organizing a company as large and anti union as FedEx is going to be a long and arduous process. Anyone who thinks or wants otherwise is a fool. If successful it would go down in history as one of the great organizing campaigns. I have been through a successful campaign at a company who was much smaller and on a local level. I was very young and felt I could make a difference. What I did learn is patience. You have to be willing to outlast the company. Not think of it in terms as we have to get this done in one year so I can have a comfortable retirement. It will take longer than 1 year maybe 3 , 4, 5. You have to have the conviction to fight till there is nothing left in the tank. And most of all you have to think in terms as the people you work with who want change are your brothers and sisters. That means not thinking of just yourself but everybody collectively. It takes time to build that trust with your coworkers and time to get your coworkers to understand that organizing is the only way things are going to change for the better. So stop blaming each other, stop blaming the ibt and decide for yourself if you're in this as long as it takes or as soon as it gets a little tough you quit.
 

Ricochet1a

Well-Known Member
Yes, after trying to organize FedEx he determined he better get out as quickly as possible.

I don't think I "'tried to organize FedEx" - I got cards out to those in my station and tried to get some other Couriers in nearby stations to do the same.

I'm not being anti-union,

Oh yes you are. You've made your feelings about how regard 'organized labor' QUITE CLEAR. Something 'dirty' with which you may have to associate yourself with, in order to get what you 'deserve' so very much. You are an enabler of the status quo, since you hold yourself ABOVE those who recognize that organized labor is their only method of being ensured with a fair deal with their employer.

just fed up with the notion that the Teamsters will come to our rescue if we stick our necks out and risk our livelihoods.

So for those who believe that organized labor is in their best interest, how is talking to their co-workers about the possibility of organizing "risking their necks and livelihoods"? Given your tendencies, you would probably end up losing your job, given how you have demonstrated complete ignorance with regards to the use of proper judgment in such issues.

But Van, so what if you lose your job, you'll be helping others! I'm sorry, not going to risk my paycheck to get a situation where the most senior benefit the most, after much considered negotiating, and mid-range get left in the cold.

Who ever said you'd help others if you somehow 'lost your job'? At Express, Express doesn't fire employees, they get themselves fired....

Which leads us to his 'real issue'...

That's essentially what happened in '97-'98, could have gotten a union in, topped out employees were mollified with substantial raises, and the rest of us since then have been told to eff off if we don't like it.

See readers... our twit wasn't very high in progression back then. What did happen, is that FRED decided to throw some cash at those who were top of progression, to mollify them. IT WORKED. Fred got what he paid for. It wasn't the IBT's fault that Fred threw some cash at the high progression Couriers and made them lose heart - the high progression Couriers back then are the ones to blame, NOT the IBT. They took Fred's cash and decided that they ended up getting what they were really after - so who needed the IBT?

And the IBT learned that the Couriers could be bought off with a few pieces of silver, so why waste their effort on them again?

This is where our twit had HIS feelings hurt - since he felt he deserved something - and didn't get it. He up and quit Express only to come back and lose ALL PROGRESSION in the process. Who's fault is that? Is the IBT to blame for our twit's bad judgment?

...and it's glaringly apparent that there's not a snowball's chance in hell of getting a union in.

It has become glaringly apparent that the Couriers of 2013 Express (who are much worse off than the Couriers of 1997 Express), won't do a damn thing to improve their situation. You can cast blame where you want, in the end, the Couriers have no one but themselves to blame for their situation.

The Teamsters were allied with UPS in attempting to get FedEx off the RLA.

Strange bedfellows.... The IBT wanted Express out from under RLA to lower their organizing costs and get a significant number of stations organized (stations without Couriers that regard organized labor as something that needs to be 'cleaned off' or 'scraped off the bottom of their shoe'). UPS wanted Express out from under the RLA to up their labor costs, to take some pressure off of UPS (pressure to lower shipping rates to stay competitive). The enemy of my enemy in this case, can be UPS's 'friend' - as convoluted as it may seem.

They both wanted and desperately needed our membership.

Again, you delude yourself with a sense of importance you don't have. If IBT was 'desperate' for your membership, why aren't they actively campaigning? Truth is, the IBT sees Express as a dry well, no matter how much they put into trying to get something out of it, they know they'll turn up empty - so why even try?

So why since the FAA bill was passed have they gone completely off the radar? They know it's hopeless.

And why has the brown bailout website also gone dark? Fred won, the IBT realized that so they cut bait. It is hopeless, because of the demonstrated history of Couriers wanting guarantees in writing to just sign a damn rep card.

They still want and need us but it's damn near impossible under the law to get us.

The IBT wouldn't mind organizing Express, but they don't really 'need you'. It is difficult under RLA to organize, just not impossible.

May I suggest a bit of bedtime reading. The Little Engine That Could.

Here's the link:

Watty Piper’s 1930 The Little Engine That Could

We're being sold false hope by a false messiah.

If you need a messiah, look elsewhere in your life.

If you are looking for a story that demonstrates the importance of perseverance, your reading material is linked above.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
All of you need to take a chill pill. Understand one thing organizing a company as large and anti union as FedEx is going to be a long and arduous process. Anyone who thinks or wants otherwise is a fool. If successful it would go down in history as one of the great organizing campaigns. I have been through a successful campaign at a company who was much smaller and on a local level. I was very young and felt I could make a difference. What I did learn is patience. You have to be willing to outlast the company. Not think of it in terms as we have to get this done in one year so I can have a comfortable retirement. It will take longer than 1 year maybe 3 , 4, 5. You have to have the conviction to fight till there is nothing left in the tank. And most of all you have to think in terms as the people you work with who want change are your brothers and sisters. That means not thinking of just yourself but everybody collectively. It takes time to build that trust with your coworkers and time to get your coworkers to understand that organizing is the only way things are going to change for the better. So stop blaming each other, stop blaming the ibt and decide for yourself if you're in this as long as it takes or as soon as it gets a little tough you quit.

R1a just told you the Teamsters are the only union that will even consider rank and file Express employees for a union. They were there with UPS 2009-2010 fighting the good fight to get us organized. Where are they now? Why don't they return calls? Now he's saying they don't have to do anything, it's up to us to get it done for them. Really? Not one phone call returned? No words of encouragement? No "If we see some positive numbers from you guys we'll get some people out to pass out cards and flyers." And they were totally discouraged because some FedEx handlers let them down? Those handlers weren't under the RLA for one thing. And the Teamsters have been around for how long? How many companies have they organized? How many attacks by company goons have they endured in the past? And yet we are to believe they got turned off to the whole FedEx idea because some handlers were bought off? Without Congessional support to get us out of the RLA we are going nowhere. We're supposed to keep trying for years and years? If the Express Employees Relief Act had been passed we'd have local unions in quite a few stations by now. 5 years from now Express will be considerably smaller and FedEx can bust union attempts by firing organizers and putting manifests into the hands of newhires with the DRA. If even 5 years. If the Teamsters are our only hope then there's little hope at FedEx Express.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
I don't think I "'tried to organize FedEx" - I got cards out to those in my station and tried to get some other Couriers in nearby stations to do the same.



Oh yes you are. You've made your feelings about how regard 'organized labor' QUITE CLEAR. Something 'dirty' with which you may have to associate yourself with, in order to get what you 'deserve' so very much. You are an enabler of the status quo, since you hold yourself ABOVE those who recognize that organized labor is their only method of being ensured with a fair deal with their employer.



So for those who believe that organized labor is in their best interest, how is talking to their co-workers about the possibility of organizing "risking their necks and livelihoods"? Given your tendencies, you would probably end up losing your job, given how you have demonstrated complete ignorance with regards to the use of proper judgment in such issues.



Who ever said you'd help others if you somehow 'lost your job'? At Express, Express doesn't fire employees, they get themselves fired....

Which leads us to his 'real issue'...



See readers... our twit wasn't very high in progression back then. What did happen, is that FRED decided to throw some cash at those who were top of progression, to mollify them. IT WORKED. Fred got what he paid for. It wasn't the IBT's fault that Fred threw some cash at the high progression Couriers and made them lose heart - the high progression Couriers back then are the ones to blame, NOT the IBT. They took Fred's cash and decided that they ended up getting what they were really after - so who needed the IBT?

And the IBT learned that the Couriers could be bought off with a few pieces of silver, so why waste their effort on them again?

This is where our twit had HIS feelings hurt - since he felt he deserved something - and didn't get it. He up and quit Express only to come back and lose ALL PROGRESSION in the process. Who's fault is that? Is the IBT to blame for our twit's bad judgment?



It has become glaringly apparent that the Couriers of 2013 Express (who are much worse off than the Couriers of 1997 Express), won't do a damn thing to improve their situation. You can cast blame where you want, in the end, the Couriers have no one but themselves to blame for their situation.



Strange bedfellows.... The IBT wanted Express out from under RLA to lower their organizing costs and get a significant number of stations organized (stations without Couriers that regard organized labor as something that needs to be 'cleaned off' or 'scraped off the bottom of their shoe'). UPS wanted Express out from under the RLA to up their labor costs, to take some pressure off of UPS (pressure to lower shipping rates to stay competitive). The enemy of my enemy in this case, can be UPS's 'friend' - as convoluted as it may seem.



Again, you delude yourself with a sense of importance you don't have. If IBT was 'desperate' for your membership, why aren't they actively campaigning? Truth is, the IBT sees Express as a dry well, no matter how much they put into trying to get something out of it, they know they'll turn up empty - so why even try?



And why has the brown bailout website also gone dark? Fred won, the IBT realized that so they cut bait. It is hopeless, because of the demonstrated history of Couriers wanting guarantees in writing to just sign a damn rep card.



The IBT wouldn't mind organizing Express, but they don't really 'need you'. It is difficult under RLA to organize, just not impossible.

May I suggest a bit of bedtime reading. The Little Engine That Could.

Here's the link:

Watty Piper’s 1930 The Little Engine That Could



If you need a messiah, look elsewhere in your life.

If you are looking for a story that demonstrates the importance of perseverance, your reading material is linked above.

Just knowing you went to all that trouble is it's own reward. Just so you know, I was topped out in '90, I quit after getting a 39 cent raise after 4.5 years without a raise for topped out employees. Mgr told me, a domicile on my own, that I better enjoy that 39 cents, it'll be the last raise I'll see for a long time. If you are going to lie, get your facts straight. If you want perseverance, try some of the routes I've done over the years. You couldn't handle them, don't have what it takes. So don't tell me what I and thousands of others should be doing with our company, you couldn't hack it.
 
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MAKAVELI

Well-Known Member
All of you need to take a chill pill. Understand one thing organizing a company as large and anti union as FedEx is going to be a long and arduous process. Anyone who thinks or wants otherwise is a fool. If successful it would go down in history as one of the great organizing campaigns. I have been through a successful campaign at a company who was much smaller and on a local level. I was very young and felt I could make a difference. What I did learn is patience. You have to be willing to outlast the company. Not think of it in terms as we have to get this done in one year so I can have a comfortable retirement. It will take longer than 1 year maybe 3 , 4, 5. You have to have the conviction to fight till there is nothing left in the tank. And most of all you have to think in terms as the people you work with who want change are your brothers and sisters. That means not thinking of just yourself but everybody collectively. It takes time to build that trust with your coworkers and time to get your coworkers to understand that organizing is the only way things are going to change for the better. So stop blaming each other, stop blaming the ibt and decide for yourself if you're in this as long as it takes or as soon as it gets a little tough you quit.

R1a just told you the Teamsters are the only union that will even consider rank and file Express employees for a union. They were there with UPS 2009-2010 fighting the good fight to get us organized. Where are they now? Why don't they return calls? Now he's saying they don't have to do anything, it's up to us to get it done for them. Really? Not one phone call returned? No words of encouragement? No "If we see some positive numbers from you guys we'll get some people out to pass out cards and flyers." And they were totally discouraged because some FedEx handlers let them down? Those handlers weren't under the RLA for one thing. And the Teamsters have been around for how long? How many companies have they organized? How many attacks by company goons have they endured in the past? And yet we are to believe they got turned off to the whole FedEx idea because some handlers were bought off? Without Congessional support to get us out of the RLA we are going nowhere. We're supposed to keep trying for years and years? If the Express Employees Relief Act had been passed we'd have local unions in quite a few stations by now. 5 years from now Express will be considerably smaller and FedEx can bust union attempts by firing organizers and putting manifests into the hands of newhires with the DRA. If even 5 years. If the Teamsters are our only hope then there's little hope at FedEx Express.

The bottom line is van, I don't think anyone on this forum believes you are going to do any sort of grass roots organizing. I don't think it's in you. You want to blame everyone under the sun for express not being organized but unwilling to lift a finger yourself. Don't take it the wrong way but you are a fence sitter. Atleast I know exactly where Dano and bb stand. Anti union as they come. You on the other hand want to complain about the conditions we work in but not willing to fight for change. But would be first inline to accept any increase in wages and benefits that came about from being represented. If you personally do not want to fight, don't. Step aside and let those willing to fight be on the front lines. And yes if it takes years thats what it takes. If it takes 6 months, great. But that is fantasy land. I wonder if you have kids, do you tell them the same thing? Kids, the hard lesson in life is, don't fight for anything you want in life. Don't fight for what's right in life . And don't fight for your brother. It's just too hard, take too long, and you are just going to lose anyway. I thank my parents for instilling in me that you fight for what's right and fight till you have no fight left.
 

Ricochet1a

Well-Known Member
Wait a minute, did he or didn't he try to organize FedEx? How do we determine if he was determined?

I determined that my best course of action with my capabilities, was to get out of Express. It has worked WONDERFULLY for me.

I've always stated that if someone can get out of Express, make a plan, work the plan and execute the plan to get out.

For those that can't, they have but two options. Fred or IBT.

Everyone here keeps on looking for that 'third option'. Look as you will, but there is NO third option for those who stay in Express. Call up those other unions, talk their ear off. In the end, once you tell them you are a non-mechanic with Express, they will very quickly act to shut down the conversation and let you go.

You keep on asking for proof - I don't need to prove a thing, I'm out of Express.

Go prove if for yourself and report the results back here. Might be useful for you to actually do some 'work' in finding things out for yourself rather than relying on your chronically faulty judgment and conceptions about how the world actually works.

Oh, by the way. When you do start to call around (laughter abounds at that thought), don't talk about how you see organized labor as something that is 'dirty', 'underhanded', 'personally beneath you', or any other such language. It may make the conversation with the individual who may just come up with a potential 'third option', a bit turned off by you.
 

Ricochet1a

Well-Known Member
The bottom line is van, I don't think anyone on this forum believes you are going to do any sort of grass roots organizing. I don't think it's in you. You want to blame everyone under the sun for express not being organized but unwilling to lift a finger yourself. Don't take it the wrong way but you are a fence sitter. Atleast I know exactly where Dano and bb stand. Anti union as they come. You on the other hand want to complain about the conditions we work in but not willing to fight for change. But would be first inline to accept any increase in wages and benefits that came about from being represented. If you personally do not want to fight, don't. Step aside and let those willing to fight be on the front lines. And yes if it takes years thats what it takes. If it takes 6 months, great. But that is fantasy land. I wonder if you have kids, do you tell them the same thing? Kids, the hard lesson in life is, don't fight for anything you want in life. Don't fight for what's right in life . And don't fight for your brother. It's just too hard, take too long, and you are just going to lose anyway. I thank my parents for instilling in me that you fight for what's right and fight till you have no fight left.

Damn... you get the point across in just one paragraph!!!! I'm just too damn 'prolix' to accomplish that.

So here goes with my very first "like". You earned it!!!
 

MAKAVELI

Well-Known Member
The bottom line is van, I don't think anyone on this forum believes you are going to do any sort of grass roots organizing. I don't think it's in you. You want to blame everyone under the sun for express not being organized but unwilling to lift a finger yourself. Don't take it the wrong way but you are a fence sitter. Atleast I know exactly where Dano and bb stand. Anti union as they come. You on the other hand want to complain about the conditions we work in but not willing to fight for change. But would be first inline to accept any increase in wages and benefits that came about from being represented. If you personally do not want to fight, don't. Step aside and let those willing to fight be on the front lines. And yes if it takes years thats what it takes. If it takes 6 months, great. But that is fantasy land. I wonder if you have kids, do you tell them the same thing? Kids, the hard lesson in life is, don't fight for anything you want in life. Don't fight for what's right in life . And don't fight for your brother. It's just too hard, take too long, and you are just going to lose anyway. I thank my parents for instilling in me that you fight for what's right and fight till you have no fight left.

Damn... you get the point across in just one paragraph!!!! I'm just too damn 'prolix' to accomplish that.

So here goes with my very first "like". You earned it!!!

Thanks R1a. I just don't have your writing skills, so I have to keep it short.
 
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