Removing EDD (RDO) as an option

[soberups]

But an arbitrator in one case decided the list was inclusive (even against the intentions of both UPS and Teamsters when negotiating the list) meaning anything can be considered a cardinal offense. They just have to give the offense some scary sounding name, then they can fire you.

Made a funny face at a supervisor? Gross insubordination, you're fired! Stretch out your hand for a hand shake? Workplace violence, you're fired! Turn off ODO? Tampering with company intellectual property, planning systems and equipment, you're fired! Leave work once work is complete, even punching out and everything, then showing up for work again the next day? Job abandonment, you're fired!

See, it's pretty easy to make up cardinal offenses.

That is because other areas of the country have the phrase “other serious offenses” in their discharge language, which is pretty much a blank check for the company to make crap up.
We do not have that phrase in the Western Conference language.
Our language is very clear and very specific and if your offense is not one of the seven listed cardinal infractions then they have to issue you a warning letter and suspension prior to termination.
The other thing in my favor would be past practice.
During peak there was a line of guys waiting to get into the office every morning to turn ODO off.
It was common and accepted practice.
Plus, I have been instructed not to follow ORION.
So I am working as instructed and it is in the best interest of the company for me to have a readable and coherent manifest in order to do so.
Now, if I were to be given specific instructions to not turn off my ODO and did so anyway, that would be a different story.

 

[soberups]

Is dishonesty or failure to work as instructed on the list?
We all know management doesn't fabricate stuff.

“Provable dishonesty” is on the list but since I have been instructed to not follow ORION and since all drivers have been instructed to look through their manifest and break trace if needed to avoid service failures, it would not apply. There is nothing dishonest about clicking a mouse to reformat your manifest. If they did not want me to turn ODO off then the ability to do so would not be part of the software.

 

[1989]

But an arbitrator in one case decided the list was inclusive (even against the intentions of both UPS and Teamsters when negotiating the list) meaning anything can be considered a cardinal offense. They just have to give the offense some scary sounding name, then they can fire you.

Made a funny face at a supervisor? Gross insubordination, you're fired! Stretch out your hand for a hand shake? Workplace violence, you're fired! Turn off ODO? Tampering with company intellectual property, planning systems and equipment, you're fired! Leave work once work is complete, even punching out and everything, then showing up for work again the next day? Job abandonment, you're fired!

See, it's pretty easy to make up cardinal offenses.

You don’t make sense

 

[trickpony1]

You don’t make sense

He makes sense.
In all my years I have never, ever heard of "malicious obedience".

Scary.

 

[542thruNthru]

You are absolutely right.
But the problem for me is that after 31 years I still take pride in doing a good job.
That has been programmed into me.
I am simply unable to just flip a mental switch and embrace deliberate failure and forced stupidity as some sort of virtue.
It would be a lot easier if I could.
When the day comes that I no longer care about doing the job the right way, it will be time for me to retire.

I gave ‘em 3 choices.
1. Turn my ODO off.
2. Look the other way while I turn my ODO off.
3. Leave my ODO on and eat 50 missed stops per day because I followed it 100%.

They know I am not bluffing so most of the time they chose #1 and the rest of the time #2.

Making the tough choices is why they get paid the big bucks.

So what month are you retiring next year?

 

[1989]

He makes sense.
In all my years I have never, ever heard of "malicious obedience".

Scary.

You can make up anything you like. First show me the intent to fraud. Then we can go over the play by play.

 

[soberups]

So what month are you retiring next year?

Touche’

 

[zubenelgenubi]

You don’t make sense

Which part don't you understand? The part about a case that went to arbitration in which the arbitrator decided the cardinal offense list is inclusive (meaning it is not complete, or exclusive) is true.

The rest was tongue in cheek, some based on actual cases in which the company trumped up charges against union members, terminated them without following progressive discipline, and the union had to get them their jobs back.

 

[Raw]

I gave ‘em 3 choices.
1. Turn my ODO off.
2. Look the other way while I turn my ODO off.
3. Leave my ODO on and eat 50 missed stops per day because I followed it 100%.

They know I am not bluffing so most of the time they chose #1 and the rest of the time #2.

Making the tough choices is why they get paid the big bucks.

Why do you even care? Leave ODO on and miss 50 stops! You act like a scared rookie!

 

[gman042]

Why do you even care? Leave ODO on and miss 50 stops! You act like a scared rookie!

Maybe it has something to do with actually caring for the customers in which you have been charged to service each day. It is your job to deliver each and every package on your vehicle in a timely manner. I simply cannot and will not provide a service to my customers that is less than what they expect. Orion be damned. I will fix this farce of a program all day long to insure that my customers are taken care of in a proper way. That....is called work ethic and UPS will not take that away from me.

 

[Raw]

Maybe it has something to do with actually caring for the customers in which you have been charged to service each day. It is your job to deliver each and every package on your vehicle in a timely matter. I simply cannot and will not provide a service to my customers that is less than what they expect. Orion be damned. I will fix this farce of a program all day long to insure that my customers are taken care of in a proper way. That....is called work ethic and UPS will not take that away from me.

Wrong! You follow instructions and let the company worry about service!

 

[gman042]

Wrong! You follow instructions and let the company worry about service!

Nope...You signed on to be a delivery driver and you do the job to the best of your ability NOT to spite the company

 

[Raw]

Nope...You signed on to be a delivery driver and you do the job to the best of your ability NOT to spite the company

If every driver over-road Orion and did their own thing according to what they think how it should be run you would have total chaos and nothing will ever be fixed! Have management make the decisions and then they can adjust routes. Your someone who should lose their job for not following instructions. You are just a delivery person, act like it!

 

[gman042]

If every driver over-road Orion and did their own thing according to what they think how it should be run you would have total chaos and nothing will ever be fixed! Have management make the decisions and then they can adjust routes. Your someone who should lose their job for not following instructions. You are just a delivery person, act like it!

See....that is where you are wrong. I have been just a delivery driver for going on 2 decades now. I was part of a driver sort and load long before there was EDD or Orion. Guess what? There was not ever chaos....there was order. There were never service failures, there were properly trained drivers that knew the best way to run their routes. They were not the trained monkeys with no ability to string together 2 coherent thoughts.
I am so glad that I received that training so long ago and my customers are grateful for a properly trained driver that takes their best interests to heart.

 

[Raw]

See....that is where you are wrong. I have been just a delivery driver for going on 2 decades now. I was part of a driver sort and load long before there was EDD or Orion. Guess what? There was not ever chaos....there was order. There were never service failures, there were properly trained drivers that knew the best way to run their routes. They were not the trained monkeys with no ability to string together 2 coherent thoughts.
I am so glad that I received that training so long ago and my customers are grateful for a properly trained driver that takes their best interests to heart.

Only 2 decades? I`ve been a driver over 3 decades, seen a lot more than you have. Majority of drivers have under 10 years and can`t make proper decisions. Like I said, work as instructed and you may hit 3 decades!

 

[gman042]

Only 2 decades? I`ve been a driver over 3 decades, seen a lot more than you have. Majority of drivers have under 10 years and can`t make proper decisions. Like I said, work as instructed and you may hit 3 decades!

Congrats....Kudos to you

I am disappointed that you were able to sell your soul to the company so easily. Take a stand!

 

[soberups]

If every driver over-road Orion and did their own thing according to what they think how it should be run you would have total chaos and nothing will ever be fixed! Have management make the decisions and then they can adjust routes. Your someone who should lose their job for not following instructions. You are just a delivery person, act like it!

The reality is this; nothing will ever be fixed anyway.
UPS does not fix stupid mistakes, they double down on them. So blindly following ORION in order to deliberately fail will serve no useful purpose.
I dont follow ORION because it is stressful and unsafe.
I dont want to spend 14 hours a day making left turns, fighting traffic, and crawling over bulk stops using end-range motion in order to dig random stops off of shelves.
I dont want to show up at a winery pickup 5 hours early and be forced to bury all my remaining deliveries under 4 pallets/80 cases/ 3200 pounds of wine that fill up 2/3 of the package car.
The job is already hard enough.
The forced stupidity of ORION just makes it harder.
I have less than 5 years left in my career here and I am just trying to survive and not get hurt.

 

[soberups]

Wrong! You follow instructions and let the company worry about service!

Article 37 of the contract requires us to perform our duties in a manner that best represents the interests of the Employer.
We are also required to follow the 340 methods that we have been trained on.
Both of those requirements are in direct conflict with following ORION. They are mutually exclusive of one another.
The crap I would have to do in order to follow ORION today would have quite literally gotten me fired 6 years ago for stealing time, padding miles and methods violations.
My management knows this, so I have been instructed not to follow it.

 

[Chnandler Bong]

Maybe it has something to do with actually caring for the customers in which you have been charged to service each day. It is your job to deliver each and every package on your vehicle in a timely manner. I simply cannot and will not provide a service to my customers that is less than what they expect. Orion be damned. I will fix this farce of a program all day long to insure that my customers are taken care of in a proper way. That....is called work ethic and UPS will not take that away from me.

I absolutely agree with everything you said, but up to a point. My current center manager and driver sups acknowledge my ability to simultaneously service my customers and keep miles and time on the clock down below Orion numbers by doing the route the "old fashioned" way. But if we are assigned new sups, or if corporate starts holding my current sups accountable for Orion trace...then I'll have no other option than to follow it 100%. In the end, we have to follow instructions and our pensions/paychecks rely on actually keeping the job. I worry about the long term future of our company if they double down on this notion that Orion and a less knowledgeable work force is preferable to a highly experienced, independently thinking one.

 

[Poop Head]

job. I worry about the long term future of our company if they double down on this notion that Orion and a less knowledgeable work force is preferable to a highly experienced, independently thinking one.

It is if wanna pay them 18/hr with no benefits