Telematics...UPS is wiring your truck

[dannyboy]

If the companies that build UPS trucks can't do it, UPS needs to find new builders

And that is why I brought up the point of the newer trucks being scrapped. They cant find parts, neither factory or after market. They dont exist. This is the real world, cant just wiggle yer nose and make it happen. And this is all powerful UPS that you seem to think can demand suppliers to bend to their wishes.

As for the rest, I can not divulge all of what I know as it was shown to me in confidence. There are internal documents that I was allowed to access, both company and supplier.

I will continue when the information from sober is posted.

Not to sound ugly, but you aint got what it takes to hurt my feelings.

And that is a bad thing?

d

 

[brownman15]

by putting the sensors in for safety ups is going against it's own company policy that they Insist Upon Integrity in their People.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

by putting the sensors in for safety ups is going against it's own company policy that they Insist Upon Integrity in their People.

Insisting upon and receiving integrity are two entirely different things. Perhaps this is the same reason Nanny Cams have become so popular.

 

[trplnkl]

In the structure of UPS, one can only reasonably expect or require integrity form those below them on the company totem pole.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

In the structure of UPS, one can only reasonably expect or require integrity form those below them on the company totem pole.

Woud you say that it is unreasonable to expect or require integrity from subordinates if one is unwilling to act with integrity towards them?

 

[trplnkl]

Woud you say that it is unreasonable to expect or require integrity from subordinates if one is unwilling to act with integrity towards them?

Not only unreasonable but highly hypocritical.

 

[dannyboy]

by putting the sensors in for safety ups is going against it's own company policy that they Insist Upon Integrity in their People.

Interesting

Ever watch some of the documentaries on crime. The most vicious and dishonest kingpin expects and demands honesty and integrity from his henchmen.

But yet the kingpin has people that check up on his people, who also check up on people........There is no trust in someone that is not trustworthy themselves.

There will always be people at UPS that are dishonest and thieves. No real way to get them all out before they do damage.

But the overwhelming majority are what Jim Casey had envisioned. And there are actually some in management. But they are in the minority when it comes to honesty and integrity. And it seems the further up the food chain, the worse it becomes. They only know how to hide the bodies better.

 

[pretzel_man]

Woud you say that it is unreasonable to expect or require integrity from subordinates if one is unwilling to act with integrity towards them?

by putting the sensors in for safety ups is going against it's own company policy that they Insist Upon Integrity in their People.

Perhaps you mistook a couple of posts, where the poster was indeed upset about being FORCED to wear their seatbelts, for the overall objection most have with the Telematics system. The debate as to what the real purpose of the system is for. UPS claims it is for SAFETY, which brings up many posts to show where UPS could do better for the buck in other ways for increasing real safety. Some drivers contend that instead of safety being the real purpose, that progressive disapline ending in termination is the real purpose. I think you will find most here feel seatbelts should always be used.

Once again, Safety is a portion of this system. It includes:
- Automotive efficiency analysis to reduce parts and breakdowns
- Idle time analysis to reduce fuel consumption
- Safety analysis
- Lunch and break analysis (were they taken per existing practices)
- Off area analysis
- Performance analysis (overallowed by stop, area, and time of day)
- etc.

So, how did UPS come to this system being deployed?

A few years ago, a few managers see that telematics systems can be purchased off the shelf.

They buy some and install them in Roswell, Georgia to see what they can learn. Over the years, they fine tune the analysis capabilities to the list seen above.

If safety were the only item, there were certainly cheaper ways of doing this. If automotive were the only item, there were also cheaper ways.

After Roswell, corporate gives them permission to test in a few more locations (in Atlanta I think). They see improvement in all the areas listed above.

Testing then goes to 1,500 more drivers last year with similar results. This year, each district gets a telematics center, as well as a whole district in New England.

The complaint here seems to be "why don't you trust me, I'm already doing everything right."

Think about it. UPS is a frugle (or cheap) company. If the test sites didn't show improvement why would UPS spend this money?

The majority of drivers do a great job and telematics proved that. Some needed a little reminder and seeing their results in telematics gave them the insight for change. A very, very few were seen abusing their position...

Supervisors are taught how to use the system for a "virtual OJS". They can learn a lot in a short time through the tool.

As with any tool, it can be abused. I'm sure it will happen and will never defend a management person that abuses it. That risk doesn't make the tool bad.

P-Man

 

[scamp73]

Says who? I thought they had to physically observe punishable behavior.

its already happened in our building,guys are being pulled in from everything from idle time to seat belts

 

[scamp73]

its already happend in our building,the higher ups see the reports,then complain to the center managers,then the sups pull us in the office,and their aggravation is then funneled to us telling us "we need to do a better job"when were doing the best we can.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

I think Steve's point was that they can't use Telematics or GPS or any other electronic or other monitoring system to discipline us on the first offense. It sounds as though they are simply bringing you in to the office to discuss the report and to show where you what areas you need to work on. I assume there is no formal discipline being taken during these discussions--am I correct?

 

[scamp73]

i've always followed the rules,but the driveways are the biggest problem on my route,theres only so much you can do.

 

[hellfire]

ok,,here is a problem i see with the enforcement of telematics-- say driver A is one of those piggs we all hate to work near,, allways boo hooin about to many airs,, allways calling for help to make 9/5, allways needs help with bulk,, we all know one or two,, anyways the company is gonna target him and pull his electronic records and fire him---now laws will allow him to get a lawyer and fight and in theory allow him to access the records of every driver in the center/building to see if they too did not buckle/close/use brake,, whatever at some point. IM A 26YR DRIVER at some point,,hell many points ,,,,,i dont close /buckle/ brake perfect. THERE IS NO DRIVER IN THE CO that follows methods 100 percent of the time,,anyways my point is if warning letters/ teminations do start the legality and long term effects will remove every driver out there,, so relax about this telematics stuff untill the troubles begin -- sometime there is such a thing as too much information

 

[soberups]

Re:Seatbets; 3 point vs 2 point

You ever see the basic truck before they add the body? Who installs the seat? Grumman or Olson or who ever installs the body, but all the cars I have seen have the seat and belt installed at the frame/engine/trans manufacture. And all the data I have been shown does not show that it was offered at the vehicle manufacturer as an option until much later on. d

EXHIBIT A:

This is a 1996 P-1000 package car, vehicle #136100. It is an International, with the Powerstroke diesel, manual trans, power steering. The body is installed by Grumman/Olson. It came from the factory with a 3 point seatbelt. The belt mounts in 2 points below the seat on the pedestal, and at a 3rd point on the corner of the door frame.

The 3rd mounting point consists of a black steel plate, to which is bolted the loop that the belt passes through and the spool mechanism that the belt is attached to that allows it to extend and retract.

This black steel plate is attached to the frame with 4 bolts, that go through holes drilled in the upright "rib" as well as the cross piece that goes over the top of the door, as seen below. This will be compared to a lap-belt only model in the next post.

 

[soberups]

Re:Seatbets; 3 point vs 2 point

EXHIBIT B:

Here we have another 1996 P-1000, vehicle ID# 135645. It is also an International, with a Grumman/Olson body. It is identical in every way to #136100 in the previous post. Same year. Same model. Same assembly line. The only difference between them is that #135645 only has a lap belt. It was built earlier in the calendar year, prior to the DOT madate for 3 point belts taking effect.

You can see in the center of the photo that, just like the previous vehicle, it too has the upright "rib" and horizontal cross piece that frames the door and serves as the anchor point for the 3 point belt. The 3 point belt simply was not installed on this particular unit.

A replacement 3 point belt assembly...inluding the black steel mounting plate... could be attached to this vehicle with nothing more than a set of socket wrenches and a correctly sized drill bit. It was designed from the factory to be able to mount a 3 point belt; UPS simply decided that the life of the driver was not worth the small additional expense.

 

[soberups]

Re:Seatbets; 3 point vs 2 point

EXHIBIT C:

Here we have an older unit, a 1988 P-1000, vehicle ID#106963. This unit is a GMC with the 4.3 liter gas engine and 4 speed transmission. The body is also by Grumman/Olson, and this particular series of P-1000's is identical with P-800's of the same year in every way except for the size of the package compartment.

Like #135645 from the previous post, this vehicle came from the factory with only a lap belt. However, even though it is 8 years older than the 1996 model, it also has the same reinforced upright rib and cross piece around the door frame, although it is a bit difficult to see due to the poor quality of my phone camera and the fact that it was geting dark. If you look carefully however you can see the upright rib with the same round rivets in it as the other vehicles. This vehicle too could have a factory 3-point seat belt assembly installed, with nothing more than basic hand tools. The attachment points (seat pedstal and door frame) are absolutely identical.

Without a 3 point belt, the driver of #135645 or #106963 is virtually doomed in the event of a frontal collision or rollover. With only a lap belt holding him in, his head will be propelled at high speed through the windshield. Or his upper body will flail around in the seat like a rag doll, with his neck getting snapped and his head violently striking the side door and bulkhead as the vehicle rolls.

With the 3 point belt and high-backed seat in vehicle #136100, the drivers head and upper body will be secured in place and saved from whiplash or decapitation.

"Safe by choice"----does UPS really mean it, or is it nothing more than a hollow catch phrase?

 

[trplnkl]

Thank you, There very good posts that proves more than one thing.

 

[brownmonster]

Maybe if a newspaper aquired the same info as you posted the all talk, no investment corporation might be exposed for what it truly is. That being said, I have a 1995 diesel with the lap belt and when it's in the shop and I get one with the 3 point belt I find it kind of a pain in the butt. I guess you have to get used to it.

 

[stevetheupsguy]

Thank you, There very good posts that proves more than one thing.

Yeah it does. Sober is a man of his word, and he's got really huge cojones.

 

[soberups]

Steve,

Do me a favor and print these pix off. Take them into your next Safety Committee meeting, and ask why it is that your vehicle doesnt have a 3 point belt. Challenge the issue. Demand an honest response.You drive an old P-800, which is identical to the P-1000 except shorter. A 3 point belt would bolt right in. This is an issue that affects you personally.

On several occasions I have brought this to the attention of the "Safety Commitee" in my building, but instead of a straight answer I just get a blank stare and some mumbling about how its "against policy to modify the vehicle" followed by a copy of the 10-point commentary and a doughnut.