And So It Begins...

[Fred's Myth]

Again another non defense of the system. No argument for why it makes sense for an employer to choose your doctor. I’m still waiting for a good argument for our current system.

You obviously don't know how the system works.

Under FedEx Anthem Blue Cross, and I assume other employers as well, each medical provider receives a retainer for accepting FedEx employees, and are paid at a lower rate than their standard rates, in exchange for that retainer. Not all medical providers will accept this framework, and if they did, it would be prohibitively expensive to retain them all, to provide FedEx employees unfettered choice. Those providers that do, receive a guaranteed income, and FedEx saves money through reduced negotiated fees.
FedEx still covers medical providers outside their network, but the employee is responsible for a greater portion of the non-negotiated fees. So your argument is hollow.

 

[It will be fine]

You obviously don't know how the system works.

Under FedEx Anthem Blue Cross, and I assume other employers as well, each medical provider receives a retainer for accepting FedEx employees, and are paid at a lower rate than their standard rates, in exchange for that retainer. Not all medical providers will accept this framework, and if they did, it would be prohibitively expensive to retain them all, to provide FedEx employees unfettered choice. Those providers that do, receive a guaranteed income, and FedEx saves money through reduced negotiated fees.
FedEx still covers medical providers outside their network, but the employee is responsible for a greater portion of the non-negotiated fees. So your argument is hollow.

So your employer chooses your doctor. Great system.

 

[Fred's Myth]

So your employer chooses your doctor. Great system.

You really ARE dense. Refusing to face reality doesn't change reality.

 

[It will be fine]

You really ARE dense. Refusing to face reality doesn't change reality.

I’m still waiting for an argument for why this is a good system.

 

[Fred's Myth]

I’m still waiting for an argument for why this is a good system.

Lower costs for employee & employer, employer able to attract better, qualified employees.

Win-win.

 

[It will be fine]

Lower costs for employee & employer, employer able to attract better, qualified employees.

Win-win.

Lower costs than what? Everyone on individual plans? State sponsored coverage? National healthcare plans? Your argument sounds like a subsidy for large corporations to squash startup competition by limiting the available labor pool. How is that beneficial?

 

[vantexan]

People claiming that some want open borders can never name a single elected official asking for open borders. It is something FOX news tells them, so they repeat it because they are either ignorant, stupid, or just trolling.

Except Democrats are doing everything possible to keep the border from being shut down.

 

[bbsam]

We hear plenty of complaints about democratic fixes to healthcare. I never hear any defense of the employer based system. Probably because it’s the worst system imaginable, there’s a reason it doesn’t exist anywhere else on the planet.

I agree. That’s why I asked.

 

[bbsam]

Based on your reasoning, no employer paid benefits are worthwhile.

As I understand it, you are an employer. That would explain your viewpoint.
As an employee, benefits would make the difference as to where I choose to work.

FYI, employers offer benefits to attract quality employees. It works. You should try it.

When employers can get away without providing healthcare, they do.

And if they can attract decent workers with junk policies, they do.

Don’t kid yourself. If UPS and Fedex could walk away from providing healthcare, they’d run.

 

[Cactus]

I'm curious - what insight into this does Yang have that no one else has? I've always been intrigued that people will entertain predictions made by people with no experience or insight on the subject that they're making predictions about. They don't usually attribute these predictions to any metrics or anything like that, but people listen anyway. It's hard enough for those who have expertise in those fields to make accurate predictions, let alone "random rich guy says [whatever]."

Yang just says stuff like this to piss you off.

And it worked. Go Yang!!!

 

[vantexan]

I dunno, but technology and automation have been killing jobs for 200 years and here we sit with more open jobs in this country than we have idle workers to fill them. Something tells me that one of us has unrealistic expectations, and it ain't me.

The only time in our history that automation released millions from their jobs was when the invention of the cotton gin made it no longer economically viable to keep millions of blacks as slaves. And they've been struggling ever since. Seriously, when have we ever seen the extinction of tens of millions of jobs at any time in our history? I don't think the research labs and universities developing all this stuff are just doing it for the fun of it. A lot of people are going to be on the outside looking in but you don't care as long as you've got yours.

 

[MAKAVELI]

The only time in our history that automation released millions from their jobs was when the invention of the cotton gin made it no longer economically viable to keep millions of blacks as slaves. And they've been struggling ever since. Seriously, when have we ever seen the extinction of tens of millions of jobs at any time in our history? I don't think the research labs and universities developing all this stuff are just doing it for the fun of it. A lot of people are going to be on the outside looking in but you don't care as long as you've got yours.

Slaves = jobs? You are severely ignorant my Native brotha.

 

[vantexan]

I’m still waiting for an argument for why this is a good system.

We used to have a $100 annual deductible with FedEx paying everything else for the employee. It got more expensive over time, but exploded under Obamacare.

 

[vantexan]

Slaves = jobs? You are severely ignorant my Native brotha.

Oh get off your high horse, was making a point.

 

[MAKAVELI]

Oh get off your high horse, was making a point.

And your point is 100% flawed.

 

[Fred's Myth]

...millions of blacks as slaves... And they've been struggling ever since. Seriously...

Seriously, Van???
The elimination of slavery caused their struggles???

 

[vantexan]

Seriously, Van???
The elimination of slavery caused their struggles???

No, was just making point that the only time in history we've had millions out out of work by automation was when slavery ended. Yes Makaveli I'm aware it was forced labor. And was said in jest so sorry if it got your hackles up. The point is in no time in our history have 10's of millions of people had their jobs eliminated in a relatively short period and it's highly doubtful that they'll all, or even most of them, find new opportunities. That's the point of this new automation, to get rid of people and be more profitable.

 

[Preventable]

The only time in our history that automation released millions from their jobs was when the invention of the cotton gin made it no longer economically viable to keep millions of blacks as slaves. And they've been struggling ever since. Seriously, when have we ever seen the extinction of tens of millions of jobs at any time in our history? I don't think the research labs and universities developing all this stuff are just doing it for the fun of it. A lot of people are going to be on the outside looking in but you don't care as long as you've got yours.

You may want to reread that page in history.

 

[Fred's Myth]

Cotton gin was patented in 1794.

“With the gin (short for engine), raw cotton could be quickly cleaned; Suddenly cotton became a profitable crop, transforming the southern economy and changing the dynamics of slavery. The first federal census of 1790 counted 697,897 slaves; by 1810, there were 1.2 million slaves, a 70 percent increase.”

Blows up your theory, Van.

 

[bacha29]

We used to have a $100 annual deductible with FedEx paying everything else for the employee. It got more expensive over time, but exploded under Obamacare.

It exploded when hospitals were getting stiffed with unpaid bills saw their charity reserves exhausted and had to raise rates to compensate and pass it it off to health insurers and their subscribers. Then again, non profit public hospitals cannot by means of their license and charter refuse treatment on the basis of a patients inability to pay. Obamacare had many objectives. Among them was preventative care and the elimination of low premium near zero coverage policies and returning ER's to just that ER's Not the trauma centers they were becoming due to very sick people coming in with a host of conditions that could have been easily and cheaply treated through preventative care.