Just finished a 3 day ride from my sup bcause I filed a greivance for excessive hours and being too over allowed.They wont fix my loop in pas and my route changes constantly.now I'm told based on this ride I must perform accordingly or face warning letters and/ or suspension.Has anyone else had this done to them?Any tips before my meeting on monday?This is a bunch of crap!
driver
- Thread starter anarchy
- Start date
brown67
Well-Known Member
anarchy said:
How did you do on the ride along? Drivers get in trouble for being 1 1/2 hours over everyday and then on the ride along they run even. Were all three days the same. If they change your route daily make a note of it. They can't ride with you and set a number only to change the route and have you run the same numbers.
Another one they pull is to have the pre-load put together a perfect load. Bulk together, no misloads, everthing in the correct order. You go out with a supp. and run a great day and then they want you to do that everyday. Ask your pre-loader if they gave you a "set up" load. If they did then tell them you'll run better numbers if they set up a perfect load everyday.
Best advice is have your supervisor run it. Play dumb and ask him to go out with you again and have him run it and you'll watch to see how he does it. Most on cars don't like going out on route and they really don't like delivering.
I had a supervisor all over me about my numbers a few years ago and I just played innocent and said " I don't know what I'm doing wrong. Could you run my route and I'll watch you." Never bothered me again. Turning tables is the best. Go to your steward and have him ask the center manager to have the on car run your route while you observe. Make sure he follows the methods and takes a full lunch break.
disneyworld
Well-Known Member
My sup did my route one day while I was on vacation and he got in about 9:30.That's a shame!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
S
speeddemon
Guest
You CANNOT be fired for poor performance.
Lots of questions need to be answered for anyone to really give you the correct answer.
Did you have the same areas on your car each day?
Were you overallowed or scratch each day?
What was the sporh each day?
Did the sup help you in any fashion?Opening doors, helping carry pakages to doors, etc.?
Was you total milage the same each day?
Was the truck loaded stop for stop each day?
Were you scratch on the ride days but way over on the days by yourself?
Most rides create a picture of a drivers habits. If your numbers were in line with your performance on a regular basis then you don't have a problem. If you were running and gunning all day while with the supervisor then you have a problem. If, however, you delivered at the same pace as you use when you are on road by yourself then I can't understand how you could have a problem. Most rides will show the company if you are working the same way by yourself as you do when with a sup on an OJS ride. They know that they can never get rid of a driver based solely on OJS numbers. Why, you may ask? Because they know every day is different. Stops with signatures, COD's collected, number of pieces delivered and picked up, total miles driven, etc. change on a daily basis. These things also change your SPORH on a daily basis. What they can expect from you is to do the best you can on a daily basis, and contractually give a fair days work for a fair days pay. Do your best everyday and they don't have much to complain about. This tactic, OJS rides after 9.5 grievances are filed, is just that, a tactic, to try and scare you off filing these grievances. Don't let them scare you into not asking them to complay with the contract. Do your best every day and continue to seek relieve from the 9.5 days. If you are doing your best every day your numbers shouldn't be much different from your numbers during the ride. If they are you need to ask yourself why or what you did different. The suggestion above to speek with your preloader is a valid suggestion. The on car sups have also been know to go on your car after the preload raps and straighten out your load. Find out if this may have happened. Do follow the suggestion of speaking with your steward and file the grievance for harrassment, if that's what you think they are doing. I've never heard of asking to have your sup show you how to do your route, but it sounds like an interesting idea. I'm not sure a sup, with limited knowledge of your area, as opposed to a driver that's been on a route for a while could possibly reach the same numbers as the driver, unless he runs his nuts of all day, which wouldn't be a good barrometer of your daily performance. I would be interested to see if he/she could achieve your numbers.
Has your numbers on route been the same now as when you had the sup on car, if not, what's different now.
Good luck.
Did you have the same areas on your car each day?
Were you overallowed or scratch each day?
What was the sporh each day?
Did the sup help you in any fashion?Opening doors, helping carry pakages to doors, etc.?
Was you total milage the same each day?
Was the truck loaded stop for stop each day?
Were you scratch on the ride days but way over on the days by yourself?
Most rides create a picture of a drivers habits. If your numbers were in line with your performance on a regular basis then you don't have a problem. If you were running and gunning all day while with the supervisor then you have a problem. If, however, you delivered at the same pace as you use when you are on road by yourself then I can't understand how you could have a problem. Most rides will show the company if you are working the same way by yourself as you do when with a sup on an OJS ride. They know that they can never get rid of a driver based solely on OJS numbers. Why, you may ask? Because they know every day is different. Stops with signatures, COD's collected, number of pieces delivered and picked up, total miles driven, etc. change on a daily basis. These things also change your SPORH on a daily basis. What they can expect from you is to do the best you can on a daily basis, and contractually give a fair days work for a fair days pay. Do your best everyday and they don't have much to complain about. This tactic, OJS rides after 9.5 grievances are filed, is just that, a tactic, to try and scare you off filing these grievances. Don't let them scare you into not asking them to complay with the contract. Do your best every day and continue to seek relieve from the 9.5 days. If you are doing your best every day your numbers shouldn't be much different from your numbers during the ride. If they are you need to ask yourself why or what you did different. The suggestion above to speek with your preloader is a valid suggestion. The on car sups have also been know to go on your car after the preload raps and straighten out your load. Find out if this may have happened. Do follow the suggestion of speaking with your steward and file the grievance for harrassment, if that's what you think they are doing. I've never heard of asking to have your sup show you how to do your route, but it sounds like an interesting idea. I'm not sure a sup, with limited knowledge of your area, as opposed to a driver that's been on a route for a while could possibly reach the same numbers as the driver, unless he runs his nuts of all day, which wouldn't be a good barrometer of your daily performance. I would be interested to see if he/she could achieve your numbers.
Has your numbers on route been the same now as when you had the sup on car, if not, what's different now.
Good luck.
cassidy182
Member
i agree to document everything. File more grievances for harassment. This is the only way they will learn. Dont wait for someone else to stick up for you. Do it yourself. I know one of my personal favorites is the ups helpline. You can file a complaint either by giving your name or not. Here is the # if your interested 18002204126. They will look into any issue or concern that you call them for.
N
nkprescott
Guest
I suggest that you refer the supervisor to Article 6 - Section 1,
National Master Agreement, Extra Contractual Agreements. Over-
allowed hours and stops per hour are not recognized elements by
the contract relating to the principle of a fair day's work. If you sign
any agreement forthcoming in ragards to you 3 day OJS, it shoud be
considered an extra contractual agreement, don't sign or agree to
their absurd version of how you should perform on your route.
National Master Agreement, Extra Contractual Agreements. Over-
allowed hours and stops per hour are not recognized elements by
the contract relating to the principle of a fair day's work. If you sign
any agreement forthcoming in ragards to you 3 day OJS, it shoud be
considered an extra contractual agreement, don't sign or agree to
their absurd version of how you should perform on your route.
Brownnblue
Well-Known Member
disneyworld said:
Same thing happened to the guy next to me, except the sup came in at 8:30 and "didn't clean."
I got a hassle ride many years ago, the one thing that stands out in my mind is some of the "methods" that I was told to employ:
1) DR at Multi-family dwelling, no problem
2) DR at neighbors house, OK as long as it is a relative
3) DR in a mailbox, yeah that's OK
There were other issues, but it was a long time ago. I think you get the point.
thanks for all the advice on the 3 day method rides(over 91/2 greivance ride).I"ve driven for 18 yrs. and have been ridden w/ alot. when they rode w/ me this time,the first 2 days my truck looked like a UPS commercial!PERFECT!I wasn't allowed to help anyone or p/u anyones air,when we got to the center at nite my sup rushed everyone in front of me at the air station,it was pitiful!Note: I have been writing all this down.those 2 days we ran 75 over and 98 over.The last day was normal,my truck wasn't loaded out,we left the building late,pretty much a normal day.We ran 120 over and was over 91/2 hours.My meeting is tomorrow.I will let y'all know how it goes.The drivers are the ones that make this company what it is and it's a damn shame that they treat us like criminals!ARGHHHHHH!
trickpony1
Well-Known Member
anarchy,
"my meeting is tomorrow."
I don't know what meeting you are talking about but I would have a witness with me, namely the union steward since that's his job, especially if you anticipate discipilinary (sp?) action.
I would avoid one-on-one meetings with management at all costs because veiled threats are made as well as misunderstandings popping up. People tend to speak differently when there is a witness involved.
If asked why you have a witness simply respond with "so there's no misunderstandings as to what was said and by whom.". Also, don't sign anything.
Being an old-timer I suspect you already knew all this.
"my meeting is tomorrow."
I don't know what meeting you are talking about but I would have a witness with me, namely the union steward since that's his job, especially if you anticipate discipilinary (sp?) action.
I would avoid one-on-one meetings with management at all costs because veiled threats are made as well as misunderstandings popping up. People tend to speak differently when there is a witness involved.
If asked why you have a witness simply respond with "so there's no misunderstandings as to what was said and by whom.". Also, don't sign anything.
Being an old-timer I suspect you already knew all this.
I got a msg on my diad one day, "you only had X and you were in at X, so today you should be in at x", and I just wrote back that today isnt a xerox of yesterday. da da done, never heard no more.
Except I got in later and was less overallowed. They try to use it as a measure, but they know it isnt accurate anymore, it used to be a decent tool to measure by, but now its like a shot in the dark, you never know which way its going.
Oh yeah over nive five is correct, no more one on one, they cannot be your friend anymore, its not allowed.
Except I got in later and was less overallowed. They try to use it as a measure, but they know it isnt accurate anymore, it used to be a decent tool to measure by, but now its like a shot in the dark, you never know which way its going.
Oh yeah over nive five is correct, no more one on one, they cannot be your friend anymore, its not allowed.
helenofcalifornia
Well-Known Member
Hey Anarchy, what happened?
dave_socal
PACKAGE/FEEDER
Hang tough my brother hope your local is strong please update ASAP.anarchy said:
For every letter they give file a grievance in return, even more if possible, better yet have all drivers grieve everything they can. Management gets their asses reamed for all the grievances. It will reflect negatively on their evaluations and their chance for advancement. Use the power of our union to your advantage. Always have your steward there with every conversation. Stick it to your boss harder than he's doing it to you. You can't get fired for performance, but you can have fun making their life hell. Based on the latest stock fiasco their jobs are in jeopardy already, the writings on the wall!!!! Enjoy the payback.
OK,I'm back!My 3 day ride went alright,but the meeting following it was the worst I have experienced in my 18 years at UPS!Center mgr threatened to suspend me on the spot and then called me a thief,pointing his finger in my face!He yelled the whole meeting.Even my shop steward was shocked.Breifly,my numbers were only a little better,and I dont have to tell y'all they can manipulate them to their liking.anyway,I called the UPS helpline and filed a complaint,we are filing 2 grievances today and I am in the process of writing a letter to some bigwig at UPS by the reccomendation of the union business agent.I am so pissed off!I am keeping a daily log now bcause this is one vindictive man.I am worried,but not afraid of him.Will keep you posted and thanks for the support!
trickpony1
Well-Known Member
anarchy-
Now would be a good time to stop getting on your truck an hour early to groom the load. Be sure to do a good pre-trip and post-trip inspection of your vehicle. Also take your full meal at the prescribed time and wait until you get into the "turn-in" room to count your money, stuff envelopes and make your entry on the CCR.
Document everything. Let them see you carrying around your diary. We have several feeder drivers that do this and no one messes with them.
MOST IMPORTANT: avoid ANY situations that might have you and ANY element of management alone together. If something were to happen it would be your word against theirs (like they never lie).
If the harassment continues file on it even if it means filing one every day. They are building a case on you, you have the right (and obligation) to build a case on them.
Godspeed.
Now would be a good time to stop getting on your truck an hour early to groom the load. Be sure to do a good pre-trip and post-trip inspection of your vehicle. Also take your full meal at the prescribed time and wait until you get into the "turn-in" room to count your money, stuff envelopes and make your entry on the CCR.
Document everything. Let them see you carrying around your diary. We have several feeder drivers that do this and no one messes with them.
MOST IMPORTANT: avoid ANY situations that might have you and ANY element of management alone together. If something were to happen it would be your word against theirs (like they never lie).
If the harassment continues file on it even if it means filing one every day. They are building a case on you, you have the right (and obligation) to build a case on them.
Godspeed.
tieguy
Banned
Must be a great center if they have time to do a three day ride with every driver that files a grievance.
You're not getting good advice here. You're in a pissing contest and realistically you could lose if you're not carefull.
Is there any chance you did your part in starting this pissing contest?
You now have to decide if keeping this thing going is in your best interest?
It sounds like you would like to get back to a point where you can come in and do the job without all the extra curricular activities. You need a mediator not a BA who tells you to throw more gasoline on the fire.
Realistically there are drivers that purpuselly do a crappy job and you have to try to prove you're not one of them and that you actually try to do the best job you can.
Realistically you're now caught in the methods game. Every time you fail to follow a method or do anything wrong you will see discipline.
If you get someone to talk to you about your calls to the helpline then you need to be prepared to sell yourself as a victim who just wants to do the job and go home. seek mediation don't feed the flames.
The more you do to follow the feed the flames advice you get here the more heartache you will have. Though I do agree I would document everything.
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