Expensive Three Dollar Mirror

[soberups]

That tactic may work in feeders, but it would never fly in pkg.

I beg to differ.

Our building was designed to park 124 cars and we currently have almost 200 routes forced into it. The cars are parked so close as to be almost touching each other. Since any contact with another car while pulling out can result in being "charged" with an accident, a lot of drivers refuse to even try and we wind up with a lot of management people moving them out of the building for us every morning.

Its really annoying and kind of a pain in the ass. A lot of times there will be 10 or 15 drivers who are stuck in the building, sitting there and waiting for one car to get moved out of the way. The amount of time and money wasted is ridiculous. It would make a lot more sense for the company to just agree that "incidental" contact between two parked cars that are touching each other will not be considered an accident or result in discipline against the driver. It takes the mechanic about 2 minutes to touch up a scratch with his can of brown paint and a Q-tip, versus 15 drivers waiting 5 minutes in the AM to get the car moved. Do the math.

 

[bad company]

I beg to differ.

Our building was designed to park 124 cars and we currently have almost 200 routes forced into it. The cars are parked so close as to be almost touching each other. Since any contact with another car while pulling out can result in being "charged" with an accident, a lot of drivers refuse to even try and we wind up with a lot of management people moving them out of the building for us every morning.

Its really annoying and kind of a pain in the ass. A lot of times there will be 10 or 15 drivers who are stuck in the building, sitting there and waiting for one car to get moved out of the way. The amount of time and money wasted is ridiculous. It would make a lot more sense for the company to just agree that "incidental" contact between two parked cars that are touching each other will not be considered an accident or result in discipline against the driver. It takes the mechanic about 2 minutes to touch up a scratch with his can of brown paint and a Q-tip, versus 15 drivers waiting 5 minutes in the AM to get the car moved. Do the math.

What about AM time!?!? Will some one for the love of Brown think about the AM time! Only 10 Minutes AM time! Or else NO employee of the month award for you!

 

[brownman15]

I beg to differ.

Our building was designed to park 124 cars and we currently have almost 200 routes forced into it. The cars are parked so close as to be almost touching each other. Since any contact with another car while pulling out can result in being "charged" with an accident, a lot of drivers refuse to even try and we wind up with a lot of management people moving them out of the building for us every morning.

same here have had drivers disciplined for damage while pulling cars out in the morning

Its really annoying and kind of a pain in the ass. A lot of times there will be 10 or 15 drivers who are stuck in the building, sitting there and waiting for one car to get moved out of the way. The amount of time and money wasted is ridiculous. It would make a lot more sense for the company to just agree that "incidental" contact between two parked cars that are touching each other will not be considered an accident or result in discipline against the driver. It takes the mechanic about 2 minutes to touch up a scratch with his can of brown paint and a Q-tip, versus 15 drivers waiting 5 minutes in the AM to get the car moved. Do the math.

 

[fxdwg]

$1500 is for the taxes. Huge losses, huge deductions!! We call that "Big Business"

 

[Raw]

I beg to differ.

Our building was designed to park 124 cars and we currently have almost 200 routes forced into it. The cars are parked so close as to be almost touching each other. Since any contact with another car while pulling out can result in being "charged" with an accident, a lot of drivers refuse to even try and we wind up with a lot of management people moving them out of the building for us every morning.

Its really annoying and kind of a pain in the ass. A lot of times there will be 10 or 15 drivers who are stuck in the building, sitting there and waiting for one car to get moved out of the way. The amount of time and money wasted is ridiculous. It would make a lot more sense for the company to just agree that "incidental" contact between two parked cars that are touching each other will not be considered an accident or result in discipline against the driver. It takes the mechanic about 2 minutes to touch up a scratch with his can of brown paint and a Q-tip, versus 15 drivers waiting 5 minutes in the AM to get the car moved. Do the math.

Yup! Last summer I had to pull my car out because I was facing straight out the bay door, my car was bigger than the 2 cars parked 3 inches away on both sides of me so my mirrors cleared but my silver door handle sticking out 1/4 inch tapped the fully retracted mirror on the car next to me after I moved 4 inches and it cracked. I was treated as if I was the worst driver ever, was charged with an accident,( had over 20 years safe driving), got a warning letter, and had a safety ride the next day. I asked what about leaving me "space on all sides" to start my day as we have all memorized and was told I didn`t check to see if handle would clear. Yes I wrote a protest letter to the union on their request. I had the supes pull out my car the next 2 days but after that they refused to pull it out anymore saying I can do it as I`m a proffesional driver but I do make them stand in front of me when tight and guide me.

 

[bigbrownhen]

This is so over the top.

Most of us have new upper management now, wonder how many others will get this kind of surprise for something so common.? There is a reason they designed those brackets to fold in anyway. Its a design flaw that the mirror sits low enough for the handle to break the glass.

So what are we to do now? Slow down and crawl around every single branch or limb that could possibly scratch or hit our trucks?? Im not talking big ones that could give the truck a dent, the little ones we scrape by on a daily basis. Well, then we will all be over allowed, that 3 dollar mirror will cost a heck of alot more than that!

Scratch, I hope you can fight being charged with an avoidable, common sense should prevail here.

As for the $1500.00 number, its is a saftey thing. Its all on paper, not actual money. Every level of accident is assigned a number as to what on average cost is, and the center is charged, again on paper only. Another number they use to evaluate how well we do our job. This is my understanding of how it works anyway, I may be wrong.

Sounds to me like this DM didn't spend too much time on car. Anyone who does, understands how this happens all the time.

 

[browniehound]

I beg to differ.

Our building was designed to park 124 cars and we currently have almost 200 routes forced into it. The cars are parked so close as to be almost touching each other. Since any contact with another car while pulling out can result in being "charged" with an accident, a lot of drivers refuse to even try and we wind up with a lot of management people moving them out of the building for us every morning.

Its really annoying and kind of a pain in the ass. A lot of times there will be 10 or 15 drivers who are stuck in the building, sitting there and waiting for one car to get moved out of the way. The amount of time and money wasted is ridiculous. It would make a lot more sense for the company to just agree that "incidental" contact between two parked cars that are touching each other will not be considered an accident or result in discipline against the driver. It takes the mechanic about 2 minutes to touch up a scratch with his can of brown paint and a Q-tip, versus 15 drivers waiting 5 minutes in the AM to get the car moved. Do the math.

Bingo! Wow! Its not rocket science. Sober has it right. A scratch to one car will cause an accident report and an entire days ride with management. Since you asked, I will do the math Sober, LOL. The mechanic can spend 30 seconds buffing or painting the scratch which will cost about 57 cents.

If the accident is reported because you scratched the rear part of the package car will cost $1500 for a tier 1 an one day wasted pay for the sup. riding with you the next day, so say we are at $1700. Then I have to call in the accident on the clock which costs another $20 bucks for my labor. Then think of all the AM time wasted for drivers affraid to move their trucks.

Its truly anbelievable and unacceptable for a business that actually WANTS TO MAKE MONEY? Good Grief!

 

[trickpony1]

Raw-
You are a professional driver and, as such, you should know when not to drive.
Surgeons arre professional too and, as such, they know when not to perform surgery.

 

[Highwayman]

Just make sure you punch in early and get on the clock before they start talking. That 50 cents a minute adds up fast!

 

[Just Numbers]

After reading 4 pages of opinions, condolences, avoidable, unavoidable, cost , ect., nobody has discussed the bottom line (if I get flamed for it so be it). Bottom line...the tree did not hit the pkg car, it is a stationary object, the person driving the pkg car hit a apart of the tree. Even though I agree with many about mirrors as I have broken and cracked a few in my lifetime, I also understand the view from the other side. If they eliminate mirrors from being an accident, what's next....scratches less than 6 inches, windshields with a crack of less than 50% of total area? I guess you see where I'm going. If all these broken mirrors occurred on our own personal vehicles would we take it so lightly?

 

[bad company]

After reading 4 pages of opinions, condolences, avoidable, unavoidable, cost , ect., nobody has discussed the bottom line (if I get flamed for it so be it). Bottom line...the tree did not hit the pkg car, it is a stationary object, the person driving the pkg car hit a apart of the tree. Even though I agree with many about mirrors as I have broken and cracked a few in my lifetime, I also understand the view from the other side. If they eliminate mirrors from being an accident, what's next....scratches less than 6 inches, windshields with a crack of less than 50% of total area? I guess you see where I'm going. If all these broken mirrors occurred on our own personal vehicles would we take it so lightly?

We don't drive our own personal vehicles for 8-14 hours a day, every day. If we did, I am sure we would expect more wear and tear on our vehicles as a result of such use. Kind of like a professional landscaper will probably go through more blade sharpenings and engine tune-ups on their equipment compared to the weekend DIY guy like myself.

The line has to be drawn some where. There has to be common sense used in determining what should legitimately be considered the difference between an accident and an incident. You make it sound as if UPS is completely white or black on all issues. If that's the case, then I probably have several accidents a day from the large over hanging tree limbs that scratch the sides of my package car regularly. I may occasional rub a tire on a curb too! What about all the package cars we have driving around that leak oil like the BP spill in the gulf? Love how we leave nice oil marks in parking lots and drive ways on a daily basis... should we call those in too?

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

JN, you do make a valid point. I would like to offer a differing point of view for your consideration. What if UPS simply made minor incidents, such as a broken mirror, a cost of doing business and budgeted accordingly? As you know, most drivers take pride in their safe driving records and to have one tarnished over such a minor incident as this can greatly diminish that pride. BTW, even though there is no longer a safe driving award program, your years of safe driving are still being tracked and recognized. I received a very nice certificate for my 19 years in April. True, it wasn't a mountain bike or set of golf clubs, but...

Stuff happens and I think minor stuff not a result of negligence or carelessness should be taken care of quietly and in house.

I did not see it mentioned but Scratch should be commended for doing what he thought at the time was the right thing by reporting it immediately.

 

[Old International]

Gee, ya'll get EOTM's? We don't get a thing extra. No parking spot, no atta boy, no dinners, breakfasts, lunches, nadda. Breaking mirrors? I broke a mirror about once a quarter. I ran a rural route with lots of dirt roads and over hanging trees, so the center manager's never said a word about it. Now, rub two 28' together with the LP man watching, and it becomes a federal case, with titantic implacations. District Safety man got involved, feeder Mangers, CMs, it was a real hoot over who was gonna take the hit for the accident.

 

[sosocal]

And make sure you grieve being charged with an accident. You have "Past practice" on your side.

there is no grievance for being "charged with an accident"....There is no grievance for mgt determining it is "avoidable".... these are administrative doings that have no consequence on you. HOWEVER, if they discipline you, then over9five;s advice may come in handy. In my centers we have called in broken mirrors. That is what the company has asked me to do. Discipline is a different story.

 

[soberups]

After reading 4 pages of opinions, condolences, avoidable, unavoidable, cost , ect., nobody has discussed the bottom line (if I get flamed for it so be it). Bottom line...the tree did not hit the pkg car, it is a stationary object, the person driving the pkg car hit a apart of the tree. Even though I agree with many about mirrors as I have broken and cracked a few in my lifetime, I also understand the view from the other side. If they eliminate mirrors from being an accident, what's next....scratches less than 6 inches, windshields with a crack of less than 50% of total area? I guess you see where I'm going. If all these broken mirrors occurred on our own personal vehicles would we take it so lightly?

UPS has made a business decision to provide delivery service to rural areas with narrow, tree lined driveways in package cars that are 10' tall and considerably wider than a normal vehicle.

A natural consequence of this decision is that the mirrors on these vehicles will get broken from time to time. Thats why the glass is designed to be cheap and easily replaceable. Mirrors are a "wear" item, much like tires or break pads or wiper blades. Its part of the cost of doing business.

I have a nice, new car that I like very much....so I avoid driving it on gravel roads or tree-lined driveways whenever possible. I also own a 34 year-old 4X4 pickup truck that I haul firewood, make dump runs, and go hunting in. I stand on its roof to clean my gutters and I use its tailgate for a work bench. Its already old and beat up and rusty and it has plenty of dents, so I dont get my panties in a knot and spend 2 hrs on a conference call with a "Safety Manager" every time I crack one of the mirrors or put another scratch in what is left of the paint.

I think what it all boils down to is common sense, and the fact that UPS doesnt seem to have any.

 

[FracusBrown]

I'm still learning, but I have yet to see a glass mirror wear out. Somehow the carwash keep wearing out the bumpers too.

 

[SignificantOwner]

All this discussion makes me wonder...what is the safety department's reporting requirement when a broken mirror on our vehicle is the extent of the damage? I would expect that there would be a standard reporting guideline across the corporation since it's a fairly common occurrence. Safety department help us out here?

 

[Coldworld]

All this discussion makes me wonder...what is the safety department's reporting requirement when a broken mirror on our vehicle is the extent of the damage? I would expect that there would be a standard reporting guideline across the corporation since it's a fairly common occurrence. Safety department help us out here?

Significant, are you saying that ups went overboard with charging someone with an accident over a mirror??

 

[Coldworld]

We don't drive our own personal vehicles for 8-14 hours a day, every day. If we did, I am sure we would expect more wear and tear on our vehicles as a result of such use. Kind of like a professional landscaper will probably go through more blade sharpenings and engine tune-ups on their equipment compared to the weekend DIY guy like myself.

The line has to be drawn some where. There has to be common sense used in determining what should legitimately be considered the difference between an accident and an incident. You make it sound as if UPS is completely white or black on all issues. If that's the case, then I probably have several accidents a day from the large over hanging tree limbs that scratch the sides of my package car regularly. I may occasional rub a tire on a curb too! What about all the package cars we have driving around that leak oil like the BP spill in the gulf? Love how we leave nice oil marks in parking lots and drive ways on a daily basis... should we call those in too?

It all boils down to one thing, having something in scratches file so if something ever happens where ups wants to can him then the file shows other instances where scratch was a worthless employee and deserves to be fired..if he had a pretty clean record then ups would have a tougher fight. Havent anyone noticed the huge surge of warning letters happening now days, theres a reason for this. Its not to get your mind thinking about safety or anything like that. BTW ups should be honored to have an employee as dedicated as scratch, Im sure he is a great representative of ups to his customers!!!!

 

[satellitedriver]

I beg to differ.

Our building was designed to park 124 cars and we currently have almost 200 routes forced into it. The cars are parked so close as to be almost touching each other. Since any contact with another car while pulling out can result in being "charged" with an accident, a lot of drivers refuse to even try and we wind up with a lot of management people moving them out of the building for us every morning.
I understand and agree.
I had to park backwards into a sardine can for many years.
But, my on road supe ,which is the PDS, has never driven a pkg car and does not even know how to use a DIAD.

Its really annoying and kind of a pain in the ass. A lot of times there will be 10 or 15 drivers who are stuck in the building, sitting there and waiting for one car to get moved out of the way. The amount of time and money wasted is ridiculous. It would make a lot more sense for the company to just agree that "incidental" contact between two parked cars that are touching each other will not be considered an accident or result in discipline against the driver. It takes the mechanic about 2 minutes to touch up a scratch with his can of brown paint and a Q-tip, versus 15 drivers waiting 5 minutes in the AM to get the car moved. Do the math.