Is anyone following Wisconsin?

Lue C Fur

Evil member
"At the eighth-grade level, Wisconsin scored an average of 266, beating the national average by four points." Apparently better than most of the non-union states. I have twin Valedictorians heading to The University of Wisconsin next fall. Thanks for your concern.:peaceful:

Congrats on your kids...you did well. Do you think it was the teachers or maybe that you cared for you kids to make sure they were doing their homework and you helped them when they were having problems with homework? Most teachers in public schools these are just glorified babysitters and if the parents dont get involved then the kids are doomed. Throwing more money at crappy schools and teachers is like pissing on a housefire.
 

804brown

Well-Known Member
CAUGHT ON TAPE: Former SEIU Official Reveals Secret Plan To Destroy JP Morgan, Crash The Stock Market, And Redistribute Wealth In America

A former official of one of the country's most-powerful unions, SEIU, is detailing a secret plan to "destabilize" the country.
The former SEIU official, Steven Lerner said that unions and community organizations are, for all intents and purposes, dead.
Lerner's plan is to organize a mass, coordinated "strike" on mortgage, student loan, and local government debt payments--thus bringing the banks to the edge of insolvency and forcing them to renegotiate the terms of the loans. This destabilization and turmoil, Lerner hopes, will also crash the stock market, isolating the banking class and allowing for a transfer of power.
Lerner's plan starts by attacking JP Morgan Chase in early May, with demonstrations on Wall Street, protests at the annual shareholder meeting, and then calls for a coordinated mortgage strike.
Lerner also says explicitly that, although the attack will benefit labor unions, it cannot be seen as being organized by them. It must therefore be run by community organizations.
Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/seiu-union-plan-to-destroy-jpmorgan#ixzz1HLFJeNMB


Lerner was ousted fro SEIU last year because he was tooradical for mainstream labor. He was speaking at this year's Left Forum. I listened to the entire clip which of course was editted by whoever taped this piece. That forum was open to all who register. It was not closed to anyone. Nothing was being hidden. A matter of fact I agree with much that was said: that labor has to go on the offense. GOOD! we shoukld force the banks to restructure their loans to we the people. GOOD! that labor should lead the way to take back the trillions taken from us by the banks, GOOD! bring down bonuses that ar way too high, GOOD! to JP Morgan, I agree , :censored2: them!

This was sold as someone's "secret" plan. LOL. Remember this guy is a FORMER official. He is an activist without much power at the moment, like much of the left in this country. Here is a piece by Stephen Lerner:
AN INJURY TO ALL

Going Beyond Collective Bargaining as We Have Known It

THE HOPE AND OPTIMISM OF THE 2008 ELECTION IS BEING DERAILED BY ECONOMIC meltdown and a legislative process seemingly incapable of producing real change. We entered 2010 with workers having lost trillions in income, homes, and retirement funds while the banks and corporations that crashed the economy continue to use taxpayer subsidies to further consolidate their economic control. The majority of union members are in the public sector at the very time when states are drowning in hundreds of billions of dollars of budget deficits. And if labor and other progressives don't offer an alternative, there is a real danger of the right-wing capturing the growing populist anger and using it to attack government's ability to limit corporate power, and regulate and repair the economy.
This is the time to offer a moral voice for those devastated by the economic crisis, and to have the courage and passion to liberate ourselves from the straitjacket of limited expectations. Unions, and their members, must join with communities long mired in poverty—and the tens of millions of people being forced out of the middle class—to imagine and articulate a vision of a better world, and to help lead the battle to win it. We have the opportunity to work with a growing group of potential allies to develop a plan and strategy to achieve that vision—but, to do so, we have to question and challenge long held assumptions and ideas.
The labor movement in the United States suffers from a version of “the Stockholm Syndrome.” We have been held hostage for so long by a messianic free market ideology that we have come to empathize with it and adopt the views of our “kidnappers.” We have been on the defensive and losing for so long that we have internalized the idea that the economic system we currently have is the only one possible, and that the only progress we can make is modest and incremental at best. Instead, we have no choice but to chart a fundamentally different course grounded in the idea that the concentration of wealth and power in the hands of a small economic elite and giant corporations is warping democracy and undermining the ability of the vast majority of the people in this country—including workers, unions, and progressives—to organize, bargain, pass legislation, and make substantive change.
Although we missed an opportunity last year—offered by the economic collapse to organize against Wall Street, the banks, and giant multinational corporations—the ongoing economic crisis and recession continues to create the conditions to organize on a far grander scale. It is precisely in times of economic and political turmoil that movements have been born, and the radical redistribution of wealth and power becomes possible.
The economic collapse exposed the failure of the labor movement's approach to the economy and the shortcomings of our approaches to organizing and bargaining.
Just as the economic collapse exposed the fundamental flaws of how our economic system is governed, it also exposed the failure of the labor movement's approach to the economy and the shortcomings of our approaches to organizing and bargaining. In the post-World War II era, labor accepted that corporations managed their companies and the country's economy. Corporations produced profits and jobs, and unions played the role of a very junior partner negotiating narrowly on issues of wages and benefits for unionized workers. Labor's job was to negotiate for a “fair” share of an expanding economic pie for union workers and to leave the rest to corporate America. During bargaining, unions didn't demand a role in determining how corporations managed companies, what products they made, or the quality of the services they provided. Nor did they consider the impact of their decisions on the health of specific communities or the overall economy. Unions accepted the cliché that what was good for business was good for America. While this produced real gains for unionized workers in the booming post-World War II industrial economy, it's clear that this model doesn't work; it is broken and it isn't repairable.
Any effort to address this requires a common understanding of why the current model isn't repairable—we have to figure out and develop a visionary and transformative way to replace it. For unions to play a role in reshaping how the economy is organized, we need to figure out how to make collective bargaining relevant, launch organizing campaigns that build movements that unite workers with the needs of their communities, and—in so doing—challenge the dominance of corporate power and money.
 

804brown

Well-Known Member
That could certainly explain why the pres. of SEIU made 52 trips to the White House in a year !!

Again, this guy was too radical for mainstream labor so he was ousted. Believe me Obama is no radical. He is just a more multi-ethnic, friendlier face of capital. He is in no way a threat to the staus quo. Look at the recent decision to attack Libya without Congressional approval. This is impeachable. He is continuing Bush's second term, foreign policy wise anyway.
 

804brown

Well-Known Member
Congrats on your kids...you did well. Do you think it was the teachers or maybe that you cared for you kids to make sure they were doing their homework and you helped them when they were having problems with homework? Most teachers in public schools these are just glorified babysitters and if the parents dont get involved then the kids are doomed. Throwing more money at crappy schools and teachers is like pissing on a housefire.

You talk of "throwing more money" at schools. So your idea is spending less on schools, that'll do it!! Oh, we "have no money" for schools or health care or jobs or alternative fuels,etc but we continue to finance our unsustainable wars abroad: Afghanistan, iraq, Pakistan, and now Libya. We need to have bake sales to help fund schools but the military-industrial complex moves on and on. Oh look an F15 went down in Libya, oh well there goes another $31 million down the drain!! That's ok, we will build more and more, even if the Pentagon doesn't want them. But we will starve the cities and states of funds to maintain a decent society. Good roads, bridges, airports and tunnels?? No but we have the fastest, most modern attack planes !! Well-equipped schools preparing our kids for the future?? NO, but we have military bases in over 100 countries!! Top of the line health care for all our citizens?? NO, but we subsidize Big Business and the wealthy by about $300 BILLION a year !! I could go on here!!

DO NOT speak to me about throwing money AT ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!
 

brownmonster

Man of Great Wisdom
Gratz on the Valedictorians, I don't appreciate the "stupid remark" when 4th grader's scored at 36% reading proficiency, that should be a concern.

Ok, "unfair remark". It is a concern but it is not unique to WI and surely not unique to states that allow teachers to bargain. Lets pay all teachers 20K a year after 4 or 5 years of college. That should increase the quality of education. Lumping all WI teachers as useless because of 1 metric is like calling all UPS drivers lazy because you can't run scratch.
 

Lue C Fur

Evil member
You talk of "throwing more money" at schools. So your idea is spending less on schools, that'll do it!! Oh, we "have no money" for schools or health care or jobs or alternative fuels,etc but we continue to finance our unsustainable wars abroad: Afghanistan, iraq, Pakistan, and now Libya. We need to have bake sales to help fund schools but the military-industrial complex moves on and on. Oh look an F15 went down in Libya, oh well there goes another $31 million down the drain!! That's ok, we will build more and more, even if the Pentagon doesn't want them. But we will starve the cities and states of funds to maintain a decent society. Good roads, bridges, airports and tunnels?? No but we have the fastest, most modern attack planes !! Well-equipped schools preparing our kids for the future?? NO, but we have military bases in over 100 countries!! Top of the line health care for all our citizens?? NO, but we subsidize Big Business and the wealthy by about $300 BILLION a year !! I could go on here!!

DO NOT speak to me about throwing money AT ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!

Calm down tex...you will blow a gasket and Obamacare aint in full force yet. Maybe you can protest the Messiah bombing Libya and he will listen and 'throw more money" at the black hole called "public schools".:rofl:

 

804brown

Well-Known Member
Calm down tex...you will blow a gasket and Obamacare aint in full force yet. Maybe you can protest the Messiah bombing Libya and he will listen and 'throw more money" at the black hole called "public schools".:rofl:


The Obama health law was to get the 30 million without health care into the system which I am already covered! Im fine, I blow a gasket at least once a day, so far so good, heh heh. As for protesting Obama's new war, absolutely!
 

804brown

Well-Known Member
Wisconsin's Radical Break
By WILLIAM CRONON


NOW that a Wisconsin judge has temporarily blocked a state law that would strip public employee unions of most collective bargaining rights, it’s worth stepping back to place these events in larger historical context.
Republicans in Wisconsin are seeking to reverse civic traditions that for more than a century have been among the most celebrated achievements not just of their state, but of their own party as well.

Wisconsin was at the forefront of the progressive reform movement in the early 20th century, when the policies of Gov. Robert M. La Follette prompted a fellow Republican, Theodore Roosevelt, to call the state a “laboratory of democracy.” The state pioneered many social reforms: It was the first to introduce workers’ compensation, in 1911; unemployment insurance, in 1932; and public employee bargaining, in 1959.

University of Wisconsin professors helped design Social Security and were responsible for founding the union that eventually became the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees. Wisconsin reformers were equally active in promoting workplace safety, and often led the nation in natural resource conservation and environmental protection.

But while Americans are aware of this progressive tradition, they probably don’t know that many of the innovations on behalf of working people were at least as much the work of Republicans as of Democrats.

Although Wisconsin has a Democratic reputation these days — it backed the party’s presidential candidates in 2000, 2004 and 2008 — the state was dominated by Republicans for a full century after the Civil War. The Democratic Party was so ineffective that Wisconsin politics were largely conducted as debates between the progressive and conservative wings of the Republican Party.

When the Wisconsin Democratic Party finally revived itself in the 1950s, it did so in a context where members of both parties were unusually open to bipartisan policy approaches. Many of the new Democrats had in fact been progressive Republicans just a few years earlier, having left the party in revulsion against the reactionary politics of their own senator, Joseph R. McCarthy, and in sympathy with postwar liberalizing forces like the growing civil rights movement.

The demonizing of government at all levels that has become such a reflexive impulse for conservatives in the early 21st century would have mystified most elected officials in Wisconsin just a few decades ago.

When Gov. Gaylord A. Nelson, a Democrat, sought to extend collective bargaining rights to municipal workers in 1959, he did so in partnership with a Legislature in which one house was controlled by the Republicans. Both sides believed the normalization of labor-management relations would increase efficiency and avoid crippling strikes like those of the Milwaukee garbage collectors during the 1950s. Later, in 1967, when collective bargaining was extended to state workers for the same reasons, the reform was promoted by a Republican governor, Warren P. Knowles, with a Republican Legislature.

The policies that the current governor, Scott Walker, has sought to overturn, in other words, are legacies of his own party.
But Mr. Walker’s assault on collective bargaining rights breaks with Wisconsin history in two much deeper ways as well. Among the state’s proudest traditions is a passion for transparent government that often strikes outsiders as extreme. Its open meetings law, open records law and public comment procedures are among the strongest in the nation. Indeed, the basis for the restraining order blocking the collective bargaining law is that Republicans may have violated open meetings rules in passing it. The legislation they have enacted turns out to be radical not just in its content, but in its blunt ends-justify-the-means disregard for openness and transparency.

This in turn points to what is perhaps Mr. Walker’s greatest break from the political traditions of his state. Wisconsinites have long believed that common problems deserve common solutions, and that when something needs fixing, we should roll up our sleeves and work together — no matter what our politics — to achieve the common good.

Mr. Walker’s conduct has provoked a level of divisiveness and bitter partisan hostility the likes of which have not been seen in this state since at least the Vietnam War. Many citizens are furious at their governor and his party, not only because of profound policy differences, but because these particular Republicans have exercised power in abusively nontransparent ways that represent such a radical break from the state’s tradition of open government.
Perhaps that is why — as a centrist and a lifelong independent — I have found myself returning over the past few weeks to the question posed by the lawyer Joseph N. Welch during the hearings that finally helped bring down another Wisconsin Republican, Joe McCarthy, in 1954: “Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? Have you left no sense of decency?”

Scott Walker is not Joe McCarthy. Their political convictions and the two moments in history are quite different. But there is something about the style of the two men — their aggressiveness, their self-certainty, their seeming indifference to contrary views — that may help explain the extreme partisan reactions they triggered. McCarthy helped create the modern Democratic Party in Wisconsin by infuriating progressive Republicans, imagining that he could build a national platform by cultivating an image as a sternly uncompromising leader willing to attack anyone who stood in his way. Mr. Walker appears to be provoking some of the same ire from adversaries and from advocates of good government by acting with a similar contempt for those who disagree with him.
The turmoil in Wisconsin is not only about bargaining rights or the pension payments of public employees. It is about transparency and openness. It is about neighborliness, decency and mutual respect. Joe McCarthy forgot these lessons of good government, and so, I fear, has Mr. Walker. Wisconsin’s citizens have not.


William Cronon is a professor of history, geography and environmental studies at the University of Wisconsin–Madison.
 

brownmonster

Man of Great Wisdom
Calm down tex...you will blow a gasket and Obamacare aint in full force yet. Maybe you can protest the Messiah bombing Libya and he will listen and 'throw more money" at the black hole called "public schools".:rofl:


Please list an alternative to the guy making 10 bucks an hour which is the max your party thinks someone should make. (see all the retail jobs created under 8 years of W). Private school?
 

TechGrrl

Space Cadet
Wisconsin's Radical Break
By WILLIAM CRONON

NOW that a Wisconsin judge has temporarily blocked a state law that would strip public employee unions of most collective bargaining rights, it’s worth stepping back to place these events in larger historical context.
.......

William Cronon is a professor of history, geography and environmental studies at the University of Wisconsin–Madison.

The State GOP is now on a witch hunt to see all of his emails in his university account to attempt to show that he has done politics on university time.

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/news/118654904.html

For Prof. Cronon's viewpoint, please check out his blog:

http://scholarcitizen.williamcronon.net/

His real sin was to point out that all of the laws being proposed across the states this year have eerie simularities, in no small part because they are 'model legislation' written and deseminated by ALEC.

But go read the professor's blog, and here's a quote to get you started:

"As a result, last Tuesday night, March 15, I launched my first-ever entry for a blog I had long been planning on the theme of “Scholar as Citizen,” about how thoughtful scholarship can contribute to better understandings of issues and debates in the public realm.

In my first blog entry, I published a study guide exploring the question “Who’s Really Behind Recent Republican Legislation in Wisconsin and Elsewhere?” I by no means had all the answers to this question, but I thought I had found enough useful leads that it was worth sharing them to help others investigate the American Legislative Exchange Council further. So I posted the link for the blog on Facebook and Twitter, sat back, and hoped that viral communication would bring the blog to people who might find it useful.

My little ALEC study guide succeeded beyond my wildest dreams. Within two days, the blog had received over half a million hits, had been read by tens of thousands of people, had been linked by newspapers all over the United States, and had been visited by people from more than two dozen foreign countries. Many readers expressed considerable interest in the activities of the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC), and said they were grateful for the guidance I had tried to provide for people wishing to learn more about it. (A smaller number of readers were much more hostile, and you can read their comments on the blog.)"

 

wkmac

Well-Known Member
Don't believe all of FOX news lies! I attended three protests in Madison over the last few weeks & I have yet to see any of the palm trees they show in their footage!
Have a look!
www.youtube.com/watch?v=RClJ6vK9x_4

Not that all media outlets don't do this at various levels but thanks for the heads up on this. Canned footage is used a lot more than we even realize. Edward Bernays would be most proud!

Where it becomes more interesting is that it seems a "false Flag" operation may have been cooking up at some level in regards to Gov. Walker. But then do we really care if they "Fly the Flag and Fake the news" anyway? And if you need to find a similar rightwing version, look no further than Leo Strauss and Plato's Noble Lie.


As Mendax sez, "Crush the Bastards!" and I would add, "All of Them!"
 

wkmac

Well-Known Member
Lerner was ousted fro SEIU last year because he was tooradical for mainstream labor. He was speaking at this year's Left Forum. I listened to the entire clip which of course was editted by whoever taped this piece. That forum was open to all who register. It was not closed to anyone. Nothing was being hidden. A matter of fact I agree with much that was said: that labor has to go on the offense. GOOD! we shoukld force the banks to restructure their loans to we the people. GOOD! that labor should lead the way to take back the trillions taken from us by the banks, GOOD! bring down bonuses that ar way too high, GOOD! to JP Morgan, I agree , friend@#K them!

Here is audio of Lerner's comments as posted on YouTube. Take from it what you will but this is from the horse's mouth so to speak.

[video=youtube;GgOEraouhxU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgOEraouhxU&feature=player_embedded#at=494[/video]
 
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