Boeing votes no to union

[IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U]

I know--I'm out of touch with what goes on now. Upstate keeps me informed about that. You don't need to chime in.

I didn't mean it that way. I know you have been retired for awhile. You wouldn't believe the crap that fly's here now

 

[rod]

I didn't mean it that way. I know you have been retired for awhile. You wouldn't believe the crap that fly's here now

Oh--I believe it. Remember I spent 30 years there--I saw it building up every year. Nothing UPS does surprises me. I take that back---I was surprised when UPS gave up washing their trucks every night. That was one thing they were always noted for-clean shinny trucks. There was never a day went by that customers didn't comment on how clean the trucks always were.

 

[IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U]

Oh--I believe it. Remember I spent 30 years there--I saw it building up every year. Nothing UPS does surprises me. I take that back---I was surprised when UPS gave up washing their trucks every night. That was one thing they were always noted for-clean shinny trucks. There was never a day went by that customers didn't comment on how clean the trucks always were.

It's getting worse by the day. If online sales weren't in the rise, we would be in serious trouble

 

[542thruNthru]

Yes , but as much as you would think for what it really cost

I think there is only maybe a 50 cents different across the us, right now in Cali we make 36.03

I believe we don't get paid more because of where we live. I think its because most places put a portion of their raises into their pension. Our pension is doing great so we get the full raise every year.

 

[trickpony1]

We'll never know but if the 1997 strike had not occurred, UPS may have not gone public.

Going public benefited two groups of people:
1) the descendants of the founding fathers who were already filthy rich and;
2) the "old school" managers who were awarded the stock (as incentive) when it split like rabbits and who hypo' ed everything they owned to buy stock right after it split.

Going public doesn't benefit the lowly hourly worker who has $20-$30 taken out of his check each week.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

I know--I'm out of touch with what goes on now. Upstate keeps me informed about that. You don't need to chime in.

Perhaps you should take the hint.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Going public benefited two groups of people:
1) the descendants of the founding fathers who were already filthy rich and;
2) the "old school" managers who were awarded the stock (as incentive) when it split like rabbits and who hypo' ed everything they owned to buy stock right after it split.

Going public doesn't benefit the lowly hourly worker who has $20-$30 taken out of his check each week.

We had several old timers who made out quite well during the IPO.

 

[rod]

Perhaps you should take the hint.

No way---I'm in it for the long haul. Isn't it about time you disappeared again?

 

[refineryworker05]

If you vote no, things must be good there, or the Union failed to sell it, maybe both.

I don't think that is necessarily the only reasons. Boeing put on an all out blitz.

Employers have a huge amount of power. Supervision/Company leadership knows more about the company's information than most rank and file employee's. So this gives the company the advantage to lie and mislead employee's about what a union would mean for the company.

Basically, people may be afraid to unionize if the company hints that bringing in the union will cause them to lose their jobs because the union will be bad for business.

 

[MAKAVELI]

I don't think that is necessarily the only reasons. Boeing put on an all out blitz.

Employers have a huge amount of power. Supervision/Company leadership knows more about the company's information than most rank and file employee's. So this gives the company the advantage to lie and mislead employee's about what a union would mean for the company.

Basically, people may be afraid to unionize if the company hints that bringing in the union will cause them to lose their jobs because the union will be bad for business.

Taken straight out of the Fred S anti Union handbook.

 

[Scuba Steve]

Going public benefited two groups of people:
1) the descendants of the founding fathers who were already filthy rich and;
2) the "old school" managers who were awarded the stock (as incentive) when it split like rabbits and who hypo' ed everything they owned to buy stock right after it split.

Going public doesn't benefit the lowly hourly worker who has $20-$30 taken out of his check each week.

This post hit it exactly. Remember how many of the good old school managers called it a day after the IPO?

I'm a descendant, I was against the IPO. I still am. It was a much better company then. We had multiple stock splits over the years and never had a loss that I could remember. The stock hasn't split since the IPO. We have had growth but a lot of those years was extremely slow. Someone posted about washing the trucks daily before going public. The clean feeders and PC's were UPS. I remember my dad saying UPS didn't need to advertise because the drivers and trucks did all the advertising UPS needed. In those days drivers and managers use to have beers together. There was more company pride and teamwork to get things done.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

...and the drivers and on-cars joined hands during the PCM and sang Kumbaya...

 

[Wally]

I don't think that is necessarily the only reasons. Boeing put on an all out blitz.

Employers have a huge amount of power. Supervision/Company leadership knows more about the company's information than most rank and file employee's. So this gives the company the advantage to lie and mislead employee's about what a union would mean for the company.

Basically, people may be afraid to unionize if the company hints that bringing in the union will cause them to lose their jobs because the union will be bad for business.

I wonder how the Union tried to sell this? Were the organizers local folks or outsiders?

It would seem to me, establishing a union is a lot like a political campaign. The first set of order would be to know everything about these workers and their motivations. I would have consulted with some political/psychology experts from Clemson. Maybe they did?

 

[feeder05]

to be honest I live in the PNW Boeing country, the only reason the employees need the Union is during contract time. They get 3x on Sunday's and two weeks paid off between Christmas and New Year's. The South Carolina employees are living large
even if the per hour wage is $25

 

[MrFedEx]

If you vote no, things must be good there, or the Union failed to sell it, maybe both.

Boeing put the hard sell on and took out a lot of local ad time. These people are really dumb for not going IAM.

 

[MrFedEx]

That's pretty much how it works for those guys. The workers at the SC plant are making 36% less than the workers at the unionized plant in Washington state. Not sure how their health benefits and pension compare but I assume those are less generous as well.

This. Too dumb in SC to know they would have a better deal in a union. They do the exact same work because it's basically an assembly plant. The 787 is largely internationally sourced.

 

[refineryworker05]

I wonder how the Union tried to sell this? Were the organizers local folks or outsiders?

It would seem to me, establishing a union is a lot like a political campaign. The first set of order would be to know everything about these workers and their motivations. I would have consulted with some political/psychology experts from Clemson. Maybe they did?

Yeah, I think unions generally go with better pay, better benefits, more say in safety, more say in how your job is performed, and a measure of job protection if you stand up for safety to a supervisor.

I'd think that would be a winning formula for most employees, but it's usually not.

I think the fear factor and stereotypes about unions destroying Detroit/the auto industry and public unions bankrupting cities and states with generous benefits....

To me that's what unions have to overcome. I don't know how they do that unless the conditions at a particular employer are just deplorable and dangerous.

 

[MrFedEx]

to be honest I live in the PNW Boeing country, the only reason the employees need the Union is during contract time. They get 3x on Sunday's and two weeks paid off between Christmas and New Year's. The South Carolina employees are living large
even if the per hour wage is $25

Maybe. But I hear the first flight most SC-built 787s make is to Washington, where the union workers fix them. For awhile, some airlines would not accept a 787 built in SC.

Very reliable source.

 

[MrFedEx]

Taken straight out of the Fred S anti Union handbook.

Yep.

 

[MrFedEx]

Scared more like. The company absolutely bombarded them with anti union propaganda, they had videos, billboards, you name it. Also SC is about the most anti union state in the US so the whole establishment was against the union as well. Very tough for a union to succeed in that kind of environment.

This. Plus,Trump shows up Friday for the 787-10 rollout, ignorantly claiming "made in America", which is really "assembled in America, using mainly foreign sourced parts".

The IAM workers in the Seattle area make better planes...simple fact.