Ron Carey Speaks On How Hoffa Is Trying To Sell Us Out

[tieguy]

So, Carey alone is at fault? That's what you keep saying.

Please show the numbers explaining the dire financial straits that CS was in in 1997.

Those were shown to you ten years ago but the fact remains that you chose to ignore that information and follow half crazy carey off on his hunt for glory.

 

[govols019]

I seem to have forgotten. Please refresh my memory since you keep saying it's all Carey's fault.

Please also explain to me how the effects of the downturn in the stock market after 9-11 on our pension plan was also Carey's fault.

 

[Why We Off?]

Hey Tie-goof .... did you get your ballot yet? I didn't think so. I am curious as to why you feel the need to "sell " us this contract. I would NEVER accept the companies first offer! Thats what negotiations are all about, they have until August to get it right. Tell me whats so good about this contract if you're not in the Central States? The yearly raises are merely OK, but totally crap if you divide them in half. How much are they saving each Xmas with this? I'm full-time, but why the increases in part-timers progression and probation? Again, how much are they saving by making workers wait an additional 6 months more before they reach top rate? The 6 billion buyout is great for those in the CS that are close to retirement, but what about a part-timer with 29 yrs. to go? Whats his retirement look like? Retention of new hires is a joke, and who can blame them for not staying .... and lest you think this unimportant, just remember that reguardless of all those fancy numbers you throw out, pensions are for the most part just pyramid schemes.
So lets just call this contract what it is ..... UPS gets out of a failing pension fund, gets deferred raises, and longer progression times for full timers ...... and the Teamsters basically get to save face by saying that they saved the CS fund and patting themselves on the back for unionizing UPS Freight. Yipee!! You tell me who did better. Vote No x 2

 

[area43]

Again, I have posted this before. The FAULT LIES(penion mess) with the Late(or maybe he's still alive) James Hoffa SR. Hey More, the next time your driving to Vegas on interstate 15 keep your eye out for a pop up camper at the KOA campground right before you get to the Calico ext.(Yermo, CA) I believe that is where Hoffa SR. and Elvis are hanging out. Ol Ron Carey drops in every once and a while to smoke a dube with the Trailor park Boyzzzzzzzs. Cary's the HEAD leaf roller. Turning over a new leaf, perphaps, RO(the desert)FL LMAO, Peace out. Anyhow I used to ride my bycycle to that KOA when I was a kid. There used to be Hoble/Hippy homesteads on the left before KOA. Check out Elephant mountian on the right(across from koa) going to vegas. That was our playground. I sure do miss those rock fights. LMAO Maybe thats my problem. Too, many HEAD shots. Wink, Wink. If you know what I mean. Im just messin with you guys and gals, UPSER's Google Calico Ghost Town. 85 million dollars of silver, and millions $$ more in borax came out of that hole. We used to ride our dirt bikes in the caves. HEAD lights of course. Wouldn't want to fall down a mine shaft.

Sorry, about the rabbit trail. HOP, HOP. Anyhow back to Hoffa Sr. We have to go back in history. Hoffa SR. and his boys created the CS Mep so he could skim off it. Corruption. The Mep, A Communistic and Socialistic way of doing pensions. The Teamsters should have set up an INDIVIDUAL(his own) pension account to represent the individual common laborer. This would have PREVENT/kept all those nappy little hands off our Cashola. A fund set up like the 401k with that Employees name on it and don't tell me they couldn't set up something like that in the past. All the Companies(the company you worked for) weekly pension contributions would be placed in that Individuals account. I could go on and on. I believe you know where Im going with this. Sorry, UPSer's we must now bare the brunt of our Fathers(Hoffa's) past sins. Brutal honesty. He might have thought about us, but he thought about himself more. Was Hoffa SR more sorry about the fact he got caught or was he more sorry about the fact he hurt the ones(common laborer) he was supposed to help. Temptation. Is sure tempting.

Oh and one other thing. Remember the UPS thrift plan. Wasn't that a great idea. Boy, some of those old timers(hourlies) sure made out like bandits on that. Only $5 or $10 a week if Im not mistaken that was taken out of your check. This money would Multiply into $100,000 to $300,000 dollars over a 25 or 30 year period. No Joke, folks. If some of the old timers(hourlies) on this site would like to tell more about the UPS thrift plan, please do. It was a Great, possible, side nest egg. So in a sense UPS did control a pension plan on our behalf. The "UPS THRIFT PLAN". I believe they discontunied it because of the 401k.

 

[one of the few]

roger i remember the thrift plan man what 6 bucks a week will do when the pople that invest it do the right thing,but it was doing good so what did we have to do,ummm take a chk or roll it over or buy stocks...all of wich do not give the return like the thrift.i also brought that up at one of these meetings they r askn us to go to ,to let us know what a great deal this is,also the anuity plan what a joke,i think i get 25 an hour to that ,ask the boys why it sux theu say well we have to vote on it,last vote was 20 yrs ago..its time to let the old boys go and bring in some new blood..some one to look out for the15 to 20 yr guys the majority of the work force ,wich in return we will look out for the noobies as some one looked out for me 25yrs ago,this contracts screws the"unborn"as the title was put on them

 

[one of the few]

this new law my brothers and sisters is the begining of the end to pensions in america..in my life time im sorry to say might see it,i hope not for our childrens sake,its all leading to the 401 k and the stock market wich the gov lovesand as for the gent that says i need to grow a brain yea rt i wont argue with you its not worth my sunday morn got football game in 1 hr gonna go see mr sullivan a feedr dr from yrs ago about 70 and still is pissed at the company ups..our local told us due to 911 they made bad investments and wall st isnt doing as well,well im a **** house investor and i move my monies around evey sun morn on my 401 an im kickn ass...wow high school grad an im investn bettr than a plan admin

 

[sawdusttv]

and tie guy talk about solidarity...camon man...i seen supervision cut each others throats over bs....divide and conquere that is the company way..they will not divide us..only try to fill us with false info and trick members that do not know better..like the new guys,which is our...the unions fault...for not gettn the word out for how evil the company was...and how evil the company still is.it is a shame but it is the truth

Few,
You are missing one major point here.
Theunion and the company are in bed together on this one.

 

[Mystakilla]

No the system locked up when I posted my response.

Maybe you should use the dell discount we all get from ups and buy a new one?

Anyhow, the CS problem didnt start with Carey, it started its downfall back in the days of Hoffa Sr! It was corrupt then and why would you think any different today coming from the SAME blood?!

 

[tieguy]

Hey Tie-goof .... did you get your ballot yet? I didn't think so. I am curious as to why you feel the need to "sell " us this contract. I would NEVER accept the companies first offer!

Actually if you read my posts I'm not selling the contract. I have not told anyone to vote for it. I have not told anyone to vote against it.

I'm having too much fun commenting on the lack of union soladarity in this whole process and answering some of the hysterical ravings that get posted here.

 

[tieguy]

I seem to have forgotten. Please refresh my memory since you keep saying it's all Carey's fault.

A waste of effort. You can find information on the web that tells you that the CS pension plan was generating concerns as far back as the 70's. Carey did not create that but he chose to walk away from the companys efforts to fix all plans in 97. So now its going to cost me 6 billion to fix one plan when we could have fixed all plans for less back in 97. You chose to ignore that information back then and think I'm going to waste my time reeducating you now.

 

[tieguy]

Few,
You are missing one major point here.
Theunion and the company are in bed together on this one.

Duh is that right?

The union accepted a contract offer from the company. what did you want them to say? well we accepted the offer but we still hate the company? You guys are too much.

 

[local804]

Where can we reaad all these nice things UPS suits are saying about Hoffa? I haven't seen or heard any, other than what tie said. Do you have some proof of this I


I'm not sure I really said anything nice about Hoffa. I might have but I doubt it. I just find it hilarious watching you guys try try to seperate yourselves from the union now that the contract offer is out. Here you pay all these BA's to go out and negotiate specific things you asked them to fight for and when they bring you what you asked them for you try to disown them. Management can learn alot about cut throat tactics from you guys.

Mr Tieguy,
Did they go out and negotiate for us with the take backs in the request load language? The competition committe where they now can contactually lay off drivers and sub out work will do wonders for our union also. The 25 and out that we had for years is all but now a fairy tale for the younger guy and gals and the 35 cents now 35 cents later raise is pathetic. I could go on but I think you get my point. Hoffa will never get our vote and he never did per the election. If you want to talk about seperation from a President, I will talk about Bush and we will talk for hours. BTW you were a Raven fan, correct?

 

[sawdusttv]

Duh is that right?

The union accepted a contract offer from the company. what did you want them to say? well we accepted the offer but we still hate the company? You guys are too much.

The union has accepted a contract offer but the rank and file has not, and until the rank and file accepts the union leaders should stay neutral not be up under the CEOs' desk. JR. come out from under there!!!!!!

 

[tieguy]

Mr Tieguy,
Did they go out and negotiate for us with the take backs in the request load language? The competition committe where they now can contactually lay off drivers and sub out work will do wonders for our union also.

804 everyone thinks that language was put in for the company, I think its in there for the union to protect jobs. Read the wording. we are not putting loads on trains we are taking them off to speed up delivery times.

The 25 and out that we had for years is all but now a fairy tale for the younger guy and gals and the 35 cents now 35 cents later raise is pathetic. I could go on but I think you get my point. Hoffa will never get our vote and he never did per the election.

I can't imagine hoffa ever getting your locals vote.

If you want to talk about seperation from a President, I will talk about Bush and we will talk for hours. BTW you were a Raven fan, correct?

yep love the ravens even when they stink as they are doing this year.

 

[tieguy]

The union has accepted a contract offer but the rank and file has not, and until the rank and file accepts the union leaders should stay neutral not be up under the CEOs' desk. JR. come out from under there!!!!!!

you kidding me? If you accept an offer why wouldn't you go back to the grass roots and sell why you accepted the offer?

 

[Cole]

Alot of the problems we have are the facts that the union did not involve the members at all in the negotiations, and this looks to be largely written by the company, based on the amount of money put into CS.

As far as mob ties, quite a lot of Hoffa's top peeps were booted for that, not to mention he never did a days work in any of our trades, neither did Hall! How amazing is that a "Parcel Director" who never worked for the "Parcel Service"!

Great ingrediants for a sell out contract etc...

 

[TheVoice]

you kidding me? If you accept an offer why wouldn't you go back to the grass roots and sell why you accepted the offer?

This is true, we can’t expect the international to do anything other than sell what they have tentatively agreed on. Anything other than that would be admitting that they came up short...

 

[tieguy]

Alot of the problems we have are the facts that the union did not involve the members at all in the negotiations, and this looks to be largely written by the company, based on the amount of money put into CS.

to me some of the big ticket items may haveout initiated with the company while most of the overall changes were initiated by the union.

As far as mob ties, quite a lot of Hoffa's top peeps were booted for that, not to mention he never did a days work in any of our trades, neither did Hall! How amazing is that a "Parcel Director" who never worked for the "Parcel Service"!

Hoffa junior is an interesting anamoly to normal union politics.

Great ingrediants for a sell out contract etc...

Thats the point I don't understand. Its not just Hoffa negotiating the contract. You also have many reps from many different functions of the union representing you. Many sections are negotiated by sub committees. To call it a sell out you have to be willing to discredit everyones involvement in the process?

 

[FIST]

I think satell and tieguy are management

 

[RockyRogue]

I think satell and tieguy are management

You're an idiot, you know that? You're demonstrating your ignorance with that comment about Satellite. He's a package driver that quit the union during the strike in August of '97. And Tie.....he's actually a pretty decent poster. Get to know our community before you go off half-cocked. -Rocky