Teamsters keep defending the same ol Grievences year after year !

[wildgoose]

This just doesn`t make any sense to me but you could have identical violations in the same year but they have to go back to the local like its a brand new violation ? This might not make sense to the teamsters cause it would cut out repeat problems. Have it set up maybe just like the lawyers where they know that case was tried and won you wouldn`t have to go to court to win the case because it was already done . Now if they were as effiecent in this process as they were is finding ways not to pay out on our pension this would be one knock out teamsters but i don`t have to put up mirrors or blow smoke up your a#* for the smart ones to understand. What do you folks think about streamlining the process of Grienvences ?

 

[badpas]

I say we start by voting out the teamsters and then fix all of the little things like this. Make it simple to follow so when they screw up they pay, no grey areas to fall into for inturpretation because thats exactly the way it is now. By keeping it simple it takes away there chances of screwing up over and over perpetiating the cycle. I agree whole heartedly but this maybe just my oppinion.

 

[raceanoncr]

This just doesn`t make any sense to me but you could have identical violations in the same year but they have to go back to the local like its a brand new violation ? This might not make sense to the teamsters cause it would cut out repeat problems. Have it set up maybe just like the lawyers where they know that case was tried and won you wouldn`t have to go to court to win the case because it was already done . Now if they were as effiecent in this process as they were is finding ways not to pay out on our pension this would be one knock out teamsters but i don`t have to put up mirrors or blow smoke up your a#* for the smart ones to understand. What do you folks think about streamlining the process of Grienvences ?

Try pulling that reasoning on the Company. You know how many times I, personally, have filed on the same issue because the company refuses to remember past wins?

The union most definately has a record of all grievances filed, won or lost, the Art, the nuances of each case but still the Company will chose to ignore. Our local even brings this up when trying to reason with the mgr, labor mgr, all involved and they "blank out".

Exam:
Two yrs ago, we (my partner and me, sleeper team) won a grievance on whatever, can't remember at the time and it's irrelevant here. Last yr, the same issue came up, the local supe said they couldn't pay this. I said that the grievance was won and paid last yr on this but he couldn't remember. (go figger!) I reminded him of exact same circumstances and times and $ paid out. Still can't 'member. Mgr said same thing. Local pointed out and even printed out 2-yr old grievance with win highlighted! What do you think happened?

I had to file AGAIN! On same issue, only one yr later! Is that the union's fault? Figure it out! Oh, by the way, we won again.

You want to talk about efficient? I'd be glad to talk about Company efficiency in this one area alone. Want to hear about how I had to work up the latest figures for our last grievance because the Company "lost" the figures? They didn't know what to pay!

As I stated before in this forum, my win-loss ratio for this last yr alone, is 9-1, with the 1 being withdrawn for the time being.

OK, now, turn this into a Teamster-APWA bash! To me, it ain't got nuttin to do with Teamster-TDU-APWA-Scabs-whatever! It's got to do with Company!

You wanna compare it to a court case with lawyers and defendants? OK, how about when the evidence is clear that the defendant is HOLDING a smoking gun over a victim and the procecutor clearly presents that but the defense attorny says, "No, he's not". Geez, how many times have we seen THAT?

 

[Cole]

It shows they have no fear of the union or respect, but thaat's the way they operate, and of course they are not above tieing up the grievance machine with frivolous grievances.

 

[trickpony1]

The company also seems to take great pride in not letting anything (grievances, court cases etc.) establish a precedent so the next time the very same issue is heard, the company can act dumb which raises the chances they will win the case.
Would this be a gauge of how arrogant and cavalier the company is?

 

[Hangingon]

I wonder how many times a grievance has been filed for supes out delivering or picking up packages? Has to be at least a million. I wonder how many UPS has won? Probably zero when it comes to the egregious ones, but every center manager I know still tries to fight it every time it's grieved.

 

[705red]

It shows they have no fear of the union or respect, but thaat's the way they operate, and of course they are not above tieing up the grievance machine with frivolous grievances.

I wouldnt say its no rear or lack of respect. I think its more about they think they saving the company money, Say a sup is working everyday but only gets grieved for 1 its a win win for the company. Thats why it is important to grieve every occurance of sups working. I personally believe they enjoy dragging out the cases especially over terminations to attempt to bleed the member out of his savings, so he will agree to take his job back without any backpay if the company was wrong!!

 

[mittam]

I wouldnt say its no rear or lack of respect. I think its more about they think they saving the company money, Say a sup is working everyday but only gets grieved for 1 its a win win for the company. Thats why it is important to grieve every occurance of sups working. I personally believe they enjoy dragging out the cases especially over terminations to attempt to bleed the member out of his savings, so he will agree to take his job back without any backpay if the company was wrong!!

You are right there red but we should not let this happen if something was won in same building or else where it needn't go to another hearing

 

[705red]

You are right there red but we should not let this happen if something was won in same building or else where it needn't go to another hearing

I hear what your saying and agree, but the fact is the company is the one that is being unreasonable. The best the union can do is to deadlock at panel and arbitrate the case, usually the company will buckle right before the arbitration, but by that time they have dragged it out 1 to 2 years. We just had a porter put back after 2 years of being off with all lost wages and benefits, but the company will keep playing there games, and no union can change that, its the grievance procedure, no matter who represents you, but thank god we have it!

 

[Braveheart]

This just doesn`t make any sense to me but you could have identical violations in the same year but they have to go back to the local like its a brand new violation ? This might not make sense to the teamsters cause it would cut out repeat problems. Have it set up maybe just like the lawyers where they know that case was tried and won you wouldn`t have to go to court to win the case because it was already done . Now if they were as effiecent in this process as they were is finding ways not to pay out on our pension this would be one knock out teamsters but i don`t have to put up mirrors or blow smoke up your a#* for the smart ones to understand. What do you folks think about streamlining the process of Grienvences ?

How about we do this. We win first time they pay grievance. We win same one a 2nd time they pay double. We win 3rd they pay triple. 4th time manager pays triple time out of his own pocket. 5th time manager is fired. Next question.

 

[RockyRogue]

How about we do this. We win first time they pay grievance. We win same one a 2nd time they pay double. We win 3rd they pay triple. 4th time manager pays triple time out of his own pocket. 5th time manager is fired. Next question.

That's a little cruel in terms of taking the money from the manager's pocket, let alone terminating him. I think that's a little heavy-handed, let alone allowing the union to write UPS company policy. I'd be against that one--from a reasonable person's perspective. I'm sure I'll be in the minority with this opinion. I'll go further: I don't think the union should be allowed to dictate company policy to UPS! The union isn't the employer, UPS is! -Rocky

 

[Braveheart]

That's a little cruel in terms of taking the money from the manager's pocket, let alone terminating him. I think that's a little heavy-handed, let alone allowing the union to write UPS company policy. I'd be against that one--from a reasonable person's perspective. I'm sure I'll be in the minority with this opinion. I'll go further: I don't think the union should be allowed to dictate company policy to UPS! The union isn't the employer, UPS is! -Rocky

It is called satire. But a DUI conviction gets more severe for every time one is caught repeating it AND is repeatedly convicted. All I am saying is that if we face progessive punishment like being suspended, which takes money out OUR pocket by the way, there needs to be progressive reprocutions for a manager like mine who repeatedly works managers and part timers doing full time work all while circumventing the contract to eliminate full time jobs. We only catch a fraction of the violations that occur so when they do pay in full it really is only a fraction. That is why the pay penalties for repeat offenders is needed here like it is in the legal system of every level of government. If a company illegally dumps untreated waste they get fined say $5,000. The second time they get caught it is raised to $10,000, and then $20,000, and so on. Why is UPS immune from this. They have $13 an hour part time air drivers doing full time work. Stealing is stealing no matter how you slice it.
Besides if I come accross a decent manager who is really willing to fix the error on his part I reduce the grievance to a lower amount. I am as reasonable as the next guy, but the pompous ones who play GOD and act like they answer to no one are the ones I am talking about.

 

[BCFan]

so what would/could the penalty be for multiable won grievances that had no monetary penalty but included a "company will comply" clause? i.e. 2nd or 3rd 8 hour day request1BC

 

[Braveheart]

so what would/could the penalty be for multiable won grievances that had no monetary penalty but included a "company will comply" clause? i.e. 2nd or 3rd 8 hour day request1BC

How about new contract clause DOUBLE TIME FOR EXCESSIVE TIME OVER 8 HOURS FOR 1ST COUPLE OFFENSES PLUS ADDITIONAL 8 HOUR DAYS GRANTED TO REPLENISH THE 8 HOUR DAYS THEY NEVER GOT THEN IF IT CONTINUES 3 OR MORE TIMES THEN DOUBLE TIME FOR THE ENTIRE DAY OR EXTRA PAID DAYS OFF SO ONE CAN ACTUALLY SPEND TIME WITH THEIR FAMILIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[satellitedriver]

How about new contract clause DOUBLE TIME FOR EXCESSIVE TIME OVER 8 HOURS FOR 1ST COUPLE OFFENSES PLUS ADDITIONAL 8 HOUR DAYS GRANTED TO REPLENISH THE 8 HOUR DAYS THEY NEVER GOT THEN IF IT CONTINUES 3 OR MORE TIMES THEN DOUBLE TIME FOR THE ENTIRE DAY OR EXTRA PAID DAYS OFF SO ONE CAN ACTUALLY SPEND TIME WITH THEIR FAMILIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What is the definition of, "EXCESSIVE TIME OVER 8 HOURS"? If your main concern is spending more time with your family, then work some where else. The teamsters have been the sole bargaining agent with UPS for alot longer than you have been around. Your complaint should be with the teamsters, not the one who pays you.

 

[tieguy]

This just doesn`t make any sense to me but you could have identical violations in the same year but they have to go back to the local like its a brand new violation ? This might not make sense to the teamsters cause it would cut out repeat problems. Have it set up maybe just like the lawyers where they know that case was tried and won you wouldn`t have to go to court to win the case because it was already done . Now if they were as effiecent in this process as they were is finding ways not to pay out on our pension this would be one knock out teamsters but i don`t have to put up mirrors or blow smoke up your a#* for the smart ones to understand. What do you folks think about streamlining the process of Grienvences ?

Great idea. Streamline discharges too. Why should the company have to keep going back every 9 months to refresh a warning letter on a problem employee?

Oh I'm sorry the company is the only one that drags their feet isn't it? You guys crack me up.

 

[tieguy]

How about we do this. We win first time they pay grievance. We win same one a 2nd time they pay double. We win 3rd they pay triple. 4th time manager pays triple time out of his own pocket. 5th time manager is fired. Next question.

what steward or Business agent do we fire when you lose the grievance?

 

[tieguy]

How about new contract clause DOUBLE TIME FOR EXCESSIVE TIME OVER 8 HOURS FOR 1ST COUPLE OFFENSES PLUS ADDITIONAL 8 HOUR DAYS GRANTED TO REPLENISH THE 8 HOUR DAYS THEY NEVER GOT THEN IF IT CONTINUES 3 OR MORE TIMES THEN DOUBLE TIME FOR THE ENTIRE DAY OR EXTRA PAID DAYS OFF SO ONE CAN ACTUALLY SPEND TIME WITH THEIR FAMILIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

young , dumb and full of ....... the union loves guys like you. So easy to brainwash...so so easy.

 

[705red]

What is the definition of, "EXCESSIVE TIME OVER 8 HOURS"? If your main concern is spending more time with your family, then work some where else. The teamsters have been the sole bargaining agent with UPS for alot longer than you have been around. Your complaint should be with the teamsters, not the one who pays you.

1 Minute over 8 hours on an 8 hour request day is a violation! When you withdrew from the teamsters did you go into management? Sure sounds like it! You have to remember the company agreed to these terms and conditions of the contract. In some parts of the country there is no penalty for violating this article. In 710 to my understanding is you are allowed to bring back deliveries you cannot get to because you ran out of time and have to be off the clock in 8. Its the company that continues to violate the agreement that they bargained in good faith, and by the way you make $27 plus an hour from ups because of the TEAMSTERS!

 

[pkgdriver]

and by the way you make $27 plus an hour from ups because of the TEAMSTERS!

Customers,UPS,Teamsters, and myself able me to make that wage