UPS Weapons Policy?

[dilligaf]

I have an interesting side thought on the issue of parking on UPS property. At our center UPS does not own the property. We are on a lease. Our center sits in the middle of a storage business. We park on property but is the property technically UPS's or is it part of the storage business? How would UPS define what is within their pervue as far as property rights go and what is not? The storage business is an active business and people come and go from the property all day long.

 

[Old International]

YOWSAHH! Did you actually swing or just wanted to?

I started the swing, but got it stopped in time--just. Then I chewed him out for sneaking up on me at 2 am. He never did it again- he would start calling my name 30 feet away.

 

[bbsam]

I have an interesting side thought on the issue of parking on UPS property. At our center UPS does not own the property. We are on a lease. Our center sits in the middle of a storage business. We park on property but is the property technically UPS's or is it part of the storage business? How would UPS define what is within their pervue as far as property rights go and what is not? The storage business is an active business and people come and go from the property all day long.

Interesting, but I would think irrelevant. UPS could not waive legal rights of to what would be little more than a rent collector. Nor would any leasing agent accept the liability that a UPS operation would pose. What if a center burned to the ground? I would think that whatever the legalities in question, UPS legal has spelled out for the storage business exactly how it is going to be and paid well to have it that way

 

[dilligaf]

Actually Sam I really wasn't thinking along those lines. I was thinking more along the lines of the thread and having a gun in your car on property. Technically it's not UPS's property. I am not sure that UPS would have the right to search our vehicles. AZ laws specifically say that I can possess a weapon on any private property unless banned by the property owner. Just an interesting thought. Not trying to create an argument.

 

[dannyboy]

It is UPS property if they have a legal right to use that property. Just like if you rent a home instead of buy it, you still have a legal right to that property, and can legally say who and what is allowed on your property.

As far as carry while on the job, I do, and so do my employees that work at my shop. And my daughter has proven her marksmanship with a shotgun when threatened. And at the range with her granpa's 308, she put everyone to shame.

But that is now. I dont know of one time in 33 years that I actually feared for my life enough to use a gun for protection. And that includes both times that I was assaulted by customers. While a deadly response would have been justified, they would have been dead wrong looking back after the fact. Once the trigger is pulled, its too late for a clearer look at the facts of the situation.

One thing is certain. In the four plus minutes the fort hood shooter had, he did a lot of damage that could have been prevented. And yes, they could have stopped it with intervention like NE said. But someone else in the room that went armed could have at least bought time for the others.

The banning of weapons for law abiding citizens is just like the restrictions on sinus meds. It has no effect on those that the law intends to target. But what it does is restrict the law abiding citizen.

d

 

[tieguy]

UPS is a company that frequently promotes myths and often lives in a parallel, fantasy universe.

Consider the "weapons-free workplace" rule.

Our "security" consists of an unarmed guard, earning minimum wage to sit behind a malfunctioning metal detector that screeches and beeps every time the door to the guard shack opens. There is also a piece of paper taped to the wall that proclaims our facility to be a "weapons-free zone".

What it really is...is a corporate-sanctioned killing zone chock full of unarmed and helpless victims for any nutcase who decided to go in there with a weapon.

The metal detector, unarmed guard and the "no weapons" sign are a great way for the company to get that warm, fuzzy feeling of safety....but God help us when someone down there decides to go postal. The unarmed guard will simply be the first one to die, and by the time the cops showed up there is no telling how many unarmed employees will have been shot and killed while in the safety of their "weapons-free workplace".

Psycho murderers have been known to disregard signs that forbid weapons in the areas they intend to kill people. They have also been known to disregard laws that prohibit murder. The accused Fort Hood murderer is but one example...the only thing he couldnt disregard is the armed guard that shot him 4 times with her weapon and forced him to stop the killing.

All good points . Though I feel better about trusting upers then the general public.

What pisses me off is that there are no armed guards at the grocery, clothing, sporting goods stores or the local car wash. How can we possibly hope to survive those places without guards armed to the teeth doing full body cavity searchs on anyone and everyone entering and exiting those places. Once we all get used to the enjoyable sensation of having someones gloved fingers stuck up our rears I'm sure we can quickly convince ups to do the same.

 

[dilligaf]

I would not push the issue as far as carrying a weapon on property. I don't feel I have any need to. There have been times at night that I have been nervous about delivery areas but mostly because I was unfamiliar with the area. Now that I have alot more knowledge of the areas that I deliver in I rarely get nervous about delivering at night. I definately don't like it but handle it better now. Having a big flashlight helps too.


And good for your daughter, Daniel. That is really great.

 

[jennie]

I am in shock over all that I have read, really! I am a woman and go to work in the dark, park far from the facility and have dealt with plenty, but NEVER once thought of bringing a knife or gun. The guy who is talking about a wepon, get a can of Mace!

This discussion is making me worry about working for UPS??

 

[AKCoverMan]

I am not a gun owner, but I often cover routes in rural areas of Alaska's MatSu Valley. In the winter it gets dark around 4pm so I spend a lot of time delivering in the dark, down many tree lined one lane driveways. Wildlife encounters (moose, bear) are not remarkable here. I have often thought I would like to be armed in case of a close encounter of the bear kind!

 

[TearsInRain]

I am in shock over all that I have read, really! I am a woman and go to work in the dark, park far from the facility and have dealt with plenty, but NEVER once thought of bringing a knife or gun. The guy who is talking about a wepon, get a can of Mace!

This discussion is making me worry about working for UPS??

chance of overcoming mace: decent

chance of overcoming a bullet: low

 

[rod]

When seconds count- a cop is only minutes away

I carry a gun because a cop is too heavy

If you find youself in a "fair" fight- your tactics suck

Don't pick a fight with an old guy- If he is too old to fight he will just kill you.

 

[JonFrum]

Well said SoberUPS.

My building doesn't have guards or metal detectors. All criminals in the area are apparently on the "Honor System."

UPS policy is:
When an employee is confronted by an armed assailant, "Die Now. Grieve Later."
- - - - -
Jennie, Mace is not very effective. First, you have to have the courage to use it up close while panicing, and without being otherwise armed. Then you have to hit the criminal in the face with the stream. That's hard to do because he will duck, or block with his hand, or the wind will blow the stream off course. Sometimes the wind blows the mist back in your face! Finally, some people don't get incapacitated by Mace, especially people high on drugs or adrenalin. Then they are really furious with you for spraying them.

 

[JonFrum]

When seconds count- a cop is only minutes away

I carry a gun because a cop is too heavy

If you find youself in a "fair" fight- your tactics suck

Don't pick a fight with an old guy- If he is too old to fight he will just kill you.

So very true. All those donuts go right to their waistline.

"An armed society is a polite society."

 

[trplnkl]

Actually Sam I really wasn't thinking along those lines. I was thinking more along the lines of the thread and having a gun in your car on property. Technically it's not UPS's property. I am not sure that UPS would have the right to search our vehicles. AZ laws specifically say that I can possess a weapon on any private property unless banned by the property owner. Just an interesting thought. Not trying to create an argument.

If there are designated parking places for UPS employees and you are parked in one, I would say that is UPS property. If it is a place that anyone using the storage facilities can use, then it would not be UPS property.

 

[trplnkl]

chance of overcoming mace: decent

chance of overcoming a bullet: low

Wasp spray, effective at 20 feet, lasts longer, higher volume of contents and a better deterrent.

 

[dannyboy]

chance of overcoming a bullet: low

Funny you should say that. The interesting part you left out was being hit by a bullet fired by the average gun owner: low. Even at 10 feet or so.

A robber I ended up befriending while he was put up told me one time: If he broke into a home, and the owner was armed with a pistol, he would take his chances, as 90-95% of the time, they could not hit him. Now, with a shotgun on the other hand.........

The average gun owner would have a hard time hitting a car at 50 feet while under stress.

Interesting though, the "security guard" here would for sure be the first shot, as he basically assaults anyone that comes on the lot at least verbally, and they dont stop by his hut first. So he would be sort of an early warning device.

Rod, can you imagine the terror of the minutes, while he was shooting by the seconds? There was absolutely NOTHING to thwart the terrorist, or make him defend himself.

The last time we called the cops was when my wife thought there was an intruder in the house. I was 45 miles away. I beat the cops to my place by a good 15 minutes. And that is why we rely on protection for ourselves, and let the cops come clean up the mess.

d

 

[dilligaf]

If there are designated parking places for UPS employees and you are parked in one, I would say that is UPS property. If it is a place that anyone using the storage facilities can use, then it would not be UPS property.

Just a dirt lot with no specific parking, and 1 really long row of storage sheds. No parking in front of the gates otherwise it's pretty much a free for all.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Wasp spray, effective at 20 feet, lasts longer, higher volume of contents and a better deterrent.

Wouldn't that sting?

 

[bad company]

I am in shock over all that I have read, really! I am a woman and go to work in the dark, park far from the facility and have dealt with plenty, but NEVER once thought of bringing a knife or gun. The guy who is talking about a wepon, get a can of Mace!

This discussion is making me worry about working for UPS??

You know what worries me about working for UPS? Inconsistent, irrational, and unpredictable behavior; and/or poor decisions made without thinking and in haste. In UPS' case, it is usually a bad add/cut or stupid dispatch decision. I can live with that...

What scares me even more is that there are perps out in the real world who are inconsistent, irrational, and unpredictable that use guns, knives, and any other means necessary in order to commit their crimes and accomplish their goal. They will quickly take a human life for a meager amount of money or property.

I do not know about Jersey (your state has some silly gun laws in my opinion), but in Georgia, there are people carrying weapons all over the place. They can be found at the grocery store, home improvement warehouse, and local restaurant amongst other places. Most carry concealed, and some choose to openly carry. Most will never have to draw their weapon, yet alone use it for actual self-defense.

You can pass laws that ban guns or incredibly limit their usage, but criminals don't exactly follow the laws now do they? The only thing those laws accomplish is prohibiting the honest, good-natured citizen from owning a firearm and exercising the second amendment.

You shouldn’t be worried about working for UPS because some people have made an educated and informed decision. From the posts I have read, it seems like most have done their homework, and are abiding by the law. You should be worried about people who are willing to break the law and take your life.

 

[dilligaf]

Wouldn't that sting?

Hopefully!