Strike Rumors

[pretzel_man]

The company makes specific wage proposals during negotiations. In 1997 for example the "last best and final offer" included 70 cent raise every other year. This notion that the company hands the union a big bag of money and says "Here, you figure it out" is just what John said, a convenient mythology.

Of course it doesn't work just like that but....

If the union during negotiations said we need a larger increas in H&W, don't you think UPS says then you have to reduce somewhere else? Like Hoax, I have never been at the table, but have spoken with those there. The financial portion is seen as a package. A % of revenue UPS is willing to spend. I think it has been between 65% and 69% historically. Again, Jim Casey spoke of this....

You don't think the financial pieces are negotiated one by one do you?

P-Man

 

[Jones]

Of course it doesn't work just like that but....

If the union during negotiations said we need a larger increas in H&W, don't you think UPS says then you have to reduce somewhere else? Like Hoax, I have never been at the table, but have spoken with those there. The financial portion is seen as a package. A % of revenue UPS is willing to spend. I think it has been between 65% and 69% historically. Again, Jim Casey spoke of this....

You don't think the financial pieces are negotiated one by one do you?

P-Man

Obviously the company has a total amount that they are willing to spend, my point is that they make specific proposals regarding raises and H&W contributions, ie, they don't just offer a total amount and leave it to the union to divide it up. The reason that Hoax in particular pushes this bit of mythology is so that he can tell people it's all the union's fault that the part timers don't get more generous wage increases. That's simply not true. The company and the union are both complicit.

 

[Catatonic]

Obviously the company has a total amount that they are willing to spend, my point is that they make specific proposals regarding raises and H&W contributions, ie, they don't just offer a total amount and leave it to the union to divide it up. The reason that Hoax in particular pushes this bit of mythology is so that he can tell people it's all the union's fault that the part timers don't get more generous wage increases. That's simply not true. The company and the union are both complicit.

I never said it was all the Union.

 

[Jones]

I never said it was all the Union.

Didn't you once start a thread with a title something like "Why doesn't the union care about part timers?", wherein you proceeded to blame it entirely on the union that the part timers didn't get more pay raises? And wasn't your reasoning based on the "company hands the union a bag 'o money and how they split it up is entirely up to them" theory?

 

[JonFrum]

I just reviewed the written National Master Union Proposal (10-3-2006) and the Company Proposal (10-10-2006) that the negotiating parties initially exchanged. As in past negotiations, the Union Proposal stated that an Economic Proposal would be submitted at a later date. Only non-money issues and issues involving relatively small amounts of money were included in the initial proposal. However the very mention of a forthcoming Economic Proposal suggests that such a document exists. I just don't have a copy of it.

The Company Proposal contained no economic language. However that doesn't mean they weren't free to submit some later.

Both Proposals available here:
http://tdu.org/node/436

[Sorry if the link no longer works.]

 

[hypocrisy]

Of course it doesn't work just like that but....

If the union during negotiations said we need a larger increas in H&W, don't you think UPS says then you have to reduce somewhere else? Like Hoax, I have never been at the table, but have spoken with those there. The financial portion is seen as a package. A % of revenue UPS is willing to spend. I think it has been between 65% and 69% historically. Again, Jim Casey spoke of this....

You don't think the financial pieces are negotiated one by one do you?

P-Man

Every part is negotiated separately, printed and signed off at the table one by one so there are no discrepancies.

 

[Catatonic]

Didn't you once start a thread with a title something like "Why doesn't the union care about part timers?", wherein you proceeded to blame it entirely on the union that the part timers didn't get more pay raises?
That was mainly just messing with 705red but I did start that thread and follow up posting ... never blamed it entirely on the Union but said the Union did not pursue raising P/T wages. Still believe that.

And wasn't your reasoning based on the "company hands the union a bag 'o money and how they split it up is entirely up to them" theory?
No ... the company comes up with a financial package and the Union and UPS go back and forth in "behind the scene" negotiations. From that process the company presents a "financial package" to the Union and it goes back and forth. I don't think the company will fight it if the Union comes back and says, "The Teamsters desire to raise the P/T employee wages and we will take a reduction in friend/T wages to do so". Of course, these Union leaders are elected and they know who votes and who cares ... the Full-timers. And therefore we are where we are.

But the real reason I replied with "I never said it was all the Union" is because I never said those words. I was having a little fun. May have been interpreted as such but I never said those words. This is an example of the literal way that some people try to skate around the spirit of an agreement by quoting technicalities. Hmmm .... who could that be?

 

[thelus]

No one is going on strike. Both the company and the union are too afraid of the consequences. 1 the company will give into reasonable requests to stop a strike. 2 A strike will destroy this company and that's not good for the union. Yes us union guys have a great power and if need we could destroy this company.but here is the thing, there are alternatives for dealing with contract issues, I would love to see the union start filing unfair labor practices with the NLRB. I mean there are rules here. I'm expected to follow the companies dress code when im in my browns and the company is expected to follow whats in the contract. Basically I'm expected not to come in with a beard and long hair and I expect a supervisor not to touch a box.

 

[UPSSOCKS]

No one is going on strike. Both the company and the union are too afraid of the consequences. 1 the company will give into reasonable requests to stop a strike. 2 A strike will destroy this company and that's not good for the union. Yes us union guys have a great power and if need we could destroy this company.but here is the thing, there are alternatives for dealing with contract issues, I would love to see the union start filing unfair labor practices with the NLRB. I mean there are rules here. I'm expected to follow the companies dress code when im in my browns and the company is expected to follow whats in the contract. Basically I'm expected not to come in with a beard and long hair and I expect a supervisor not to touch a box.

The only thing you can destroy is your own career.. Your union is powerless..

 

[bham brown]

The only thing you can destroy is your own career.. Your union is powerless..

If you think that a strike would not destroy UPS, then you have been staring into the bright lights too long..

 

[ja4079]

bham brown I agree with you totally.

 

[hellfire]

america would have zero sympathy for us Working Stiffed - The Daily Show with Jon Stewart - 9/20/2010 - Video Clip | Comedy Central

 

[bigblu 2 you]

The only thing you can destroy is your own career.. Your union is powerless..

i am willing togive it a shot,how bout you? if the next proposal does not protect us from methods{the new hidden agenda to keep from saying production}and production discipline among other and including the' new 'age intimidation ,then i will gladly vote no and sit on a picket line and dare you to deliver in my area.

 

[UPSSOCKS]

i am willing togive it a shot,how bout you? if the next proposal does not protect us from methods{the new hidden agenda to keep from saying production}and production discipline among other and including the' new 'age intimidation ,then i will gladly vote no and sit on a picket line and dare you to deliver in my area.

And when someone does deliver in your area you won't do anything about it. Typical union, all talk no action... Keep paying your dues to a weak union. I guarantee you that if you do strike, it will be a union member delivering in your area. You guys are not united anymore.

 

[JonFrum]

And when someone does deliver in your area you won't do anything about it. Typical union, all talk no action... Keep paying your dues to a weak union. I guarantee you that if you do strike, it will be a union member delivering in your area. You guys are not united anymore.

When a union member works during an authorized strike, standard procedure is for the Local to fine the member for doing so. The fine is traditionally equal to the amount of money the union member makes during the strike. Thus the union member knows in advance that if he works during a legal strike, he is working for free. All the grief he will get for working is a kind of Bonus.

The fine could be higher than the amount of money earned, of course. This is all quite legal. A member who doesn't pay his fine will be take to Court and ordered by a Judge to pay his fine.

 

[UPSSOCKS]

When a union member works during an authorized strike, standard procedure is for the Local to fine the member for doing so. The fine is traditionally equal to the amount of money the union member makes during the strike. Thus the union member knows in advance that if he works during a legal strike, he is working for free. All the grief he will get for working is a kind of Bonus.

The fine could be higher than the amount of money earned, of course. This is all quite legal. A member who doesn't pay his fine will be take to Court and ordered by a Judge to pay his fine.

The point i am making is that the union is done. It is weak and pathetic. they are not organized enough to strike..

 

[Signature Only]

upssocks....more lives than a cockroach.

And when someone does deliver in your area you won't do anything about it. Typical union, all talk no action... Keep paying your dues to a weak union. I guarantee you that if you do strike, it will be a union member delivering in your area. You guys are not united anymore.

 

[over9five]

The point i am making is that the union is done. It is weak and pathetic. they are not organized enough to strike..

Is this UPS's position, strategy, or opinion?

 

[brownIEman]

Is this UPS's position, strategy, or opinion?

It was in '97.

Diiiidn't really work out so well for us.

Just sayin...

 

[bigblu 2 you]

The point i am making is that the union is done. It is weak and pathetic. they are not organized enough to strike..

had three managers try to take trucks out at last strike and they never made it out of the lot. just give me the chance to prove what i will or will not do and you will see a TYPICAL union members organization skills.now go back to eating your doughnut and reading the paper in your cubicle and dreaming of being a union member yourself.