Stupid arguments about the Ground business model

bacha29

Well-Known Member
To get a route contracted you had to run it as a supplemental for a while. I did it several times, taking work from contractors like you. The routes eventually were contracted making me money. Only a fool wouldn’t see the opportunity.
And how long was for "awhile"? And so tell me WHY would Fat Freddy put on a contracted route when he could get YOU to send out a so called "supplemental" on a continuous daily basis for a fraction of the cost and pocket the savings? Or is this another one of your many examples of your courting the favoritism of management ? " Business decisions" and designated corporate bodily orifice vacuumizer are not the same thing.
 

It will be fine

Well-Known Member
And how long was for "awhile"? And so tell me WHY would Fat Freddy put on a contracted route when he could get YOU to send out a so called "supplemental" on a continuous daily basis for a fraction of the cost and pocket the savings? Or is this another one of your many examples of your courting the favoritism of management ? " Business decisions" and designated corporate bodily orifice vacuumizer are not the same thing.
That’s how the system worked back then. You ran a supplemental and kept submitting for a PSA and eventually you’d get one. Sometimes it was a few months, sometimes a year or more. That’s also a system that hasn’t been around in over ten years.
 

oldrps

Well-Known Member
!. You already know that contractors run under Fat Freddy's numbers. Show me someone outside of perhaps a trip lease would be permitted to haul Fat Freddy's freight. if you actually at one time did work for the company you would automatically know that which casts serious doubt on whether you actually did work for the company.
2. On Saturday I would deliver all the "G" freight I could deliver rather than on Monday allowing me to deliver the ton of "H" freight brought back Saturday night.
3. And this is the dead giveaway that your claims of having worked for the company are not true. In 1993 only under the threat of an Internal Revenue Lawsuit did Dan Sullivan ( a guy you never heard of because you neve worked for the company) grudgingly grant contractors goodwill and proprietary rights. Furthermore if you actually did work for the company you would have been well away of the many lawsuits certified as class actions that Fat Freddy either lost of had to settle out of court costing him hundreds of millions Not to mention the court cases DMAC won .
4. Right if the contract doesn't contain language spelling out the specific disciplinary rules and protocols and the limitations therein they are then free to do whatever they choose. It's like a California federal judge describing the contract once said. "Vague and ambiguous and cleverly written" when describing his ruling declaring that RPS/FXG contractors are being employees which marked the beginning of the multi route format and requiring that everyone become S Corps as a way to counter the ruling. It wasn't the creation and promotion of the "small trucking company" (Fat Freddy's words) but rather in response to the Ca ruling . BTW the judge used a simple analogy to back his ruling. " if it looks like a duck. walks like a duck, quacks like a duck....it's a duck"

5. Given that I never was afforded the opportunity to choose who I wanted and did not want as a customer how in the hell can you stand there and say with a straight face that they were MY customers.? If I walked into your car dealership to buy one of your cars I was your customer only if you CHOSE to sell me one of your cars.
  1. Ok, now you don't think I worked there, sorry you are incorrect. I attached an image of the Employee Manual that we were given back in the 90's. You said that RPS/FedEx had no say, but you are using their DOT number so yes, they have a say.
  2. Ok, thanks for making it more clear. What was the reason that the management of your terminal held you accountable for another contractor's route?
  3. Read your own statement, I answered it. You said "If the government does not get involved in every contract .. then why did it get involved in this one?" Why didn't you simply state what you just stated, that they got involved because was a lawsuit, it would have made more since. Your statement implied that the government gets involved without reason. Someone had to bring it to their attention which was done by a lawsuit. Quit being purposely vague with your statements. How was I supposed to know what you meant when you don't state it.
  4. "...disciplinary rules and protocols" I feel there is more to this statement than you are providing. Are you saying if a contractor stole or damaged a package while in the terminal, nothing should happen to them? What discipline did you receive and what protocols did you have to follow?
  5. What is your point with this statement. Your customer was RPS/FedEx, the one that paid you for your services. Remember they are the one you signed an agreement with to provide a service. How are they not your customer, no one else pays you for you service? Were you really a business person? I can't believe you didn't know that RPS/FedEx was your customer.

    Wikipedia says a customer is: In sales, commerce and economics, a customer is the recipient of a good, service, product or an idea - obtained from a seller, vendor, or supplier via a financial transaction or exchange for money or some other valuable consideration.
After all this back and forth, when are you going to realize that if you give more details in your statements/questions, it makes things more clear. I think you purposely are being vague to hide information.

I was there in the 90's and the early 2000's. Yes, the agreement has been modified over the years, I know that. I have never disputed or questioned that. The addendum was changed almost every year, sometimes a couple of times. I bet the agreement is modified more over the next few years as regulatory/business needs change. Maybe someday the government may rule contractors illegal and they might have employee drivers. I haven't worked there in almost 20 years so I don't know what the current or past 20 years agreements says or nor do I care. I do know what was in the agreement while I was there though.

As a business owner since 2004, I can assure you I am versed in running a business. A lot of things you say are misleading when it comes to running a business. You keep talking about getting cash against depreciated assets that you are forced to purchase. Nearly all assets depreciate over time. I have invested over $120,000 in equipment since 2004 and guess what, it ain't worth that much today. You better believe that I counted the depreciation for tax purposes though. If I went out of business, I would not expect to get much for my equipment. I have had to get loans to purchase equipment and later to repair them. I had to get a loan and use my house as collateral because I had a piece of equipment go down. I needed a loan for to fix it and it was not worth much, but the replacement cost was too high. I bet you never had to chase RPS/FedEx down to get money owed to you. Nearly run out of cash because your RPS/FedEx did not pay you for 60 - 90 days. Have a competitor undercut your price, steal customers away and spread false information about your company. You really have no idea what is like to run a business.
 

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bacha29

Well-Known Member
  1. Ok, now you don't think I worked there, sorry you are incorrect. I attached an image of the Employee Manual that we were given back in the 90's. You said that RPS/FedEx had no say, but you are using their DOT number so yes, they have a say.
  2. Ok, thanks for making it more clear. What was the reason that the management of your terminal held you accountable for another contractor's route?
  3. Read your own statement, I answered it. You said "If the government does not get involved in every contract .. then why did it get involved in this one?" Why didn't you simply state what you just stated, that they got involved because was a lawsuit, it would have made more since. Your statement implied that the government gets involved without reason. Someone had to bring it to their attention which was done by a lawsuit. Quit being purposely vague with your statements. How was I supposed to know what you meant when you don't state it.
  4. "...disciplinary rules and protocols" I feel there is more to this statement than you are providing. Are you saying if a contractor stole or damaged a package while in the terminal, nothing should happen to them? What discipline did you receive and what protocols did you have to follow?
  5. What is your point with this statement. Your customer was RPS/FedEx, the one that paid you for your services. Remember they are the one you signed an agreement with to provide a service. How are they not your customer, no one else pays you for you service? Were you really a business person? I can't believe you didn't know that RPS/FedEx was your customer.

    Wikipedia says a customer is: In sales, commerce and economics, a customer is the recipient of a good, service, product or an idea - obtained from a seller, vendor, or supplier via a financial transaction or exchange for money or some other valuable consideration.
After all this back and forth, when are you going to realize that if you give more details in your statements/questions, it makes things more clear. I think you purposely are being vague to hide information.

I was there in the 90's and the early 2000's. Yes, the agreement has been modified over the years, I know that. I have never disputed or questioned that. The addendum was changed almost every year, sometimes a couple of times. I bet the agreement is modified more over the next few years as regulatory/business needs change. Maybe someday the government may rule contractors illegal and they might have employee drivers. I haven't worked there in almost 20 years so I don't know what the current or past 20 years agreements says or nor do I care. I do know what was in the agreement while I was there though.

As a business owner since 2004, I can assure you I am versed in running a business. A lot of things you say are misleading when it comes to running a business. You keep talking about getting cash against depreciated assets that you are forced to purchase. Nearly all assets depreciate over time. I have invested over $120,000 in equipment since 2004 and guess what, it ain't worth that much today. You better believe that I counted the depreciation for tax purposes though. If I went out of business, I would not expect to get much for my equipment. I have had to get loans to purchase equipment and later to repair them. I had to get a loan and use my house as collateral because I had a piece of equipment go down. I needed a loan for to fix it and it was not worth much, but the replacement cost was too high. I bet you never had to chase RPS/FedEx down to get money owed to you. Nearly run out of cash because your RPS/FedEx did not pay you for 60 - 90 days. Have a competitor undercut your price, steal customers away and spread false information about your company. You really have no idea what is like to run a business.
"You really have no idea of what it's like to run a business". That's the entire point of this thread. If you are a FXG "independent contractor" you don't have a business. If you are an independent show me where the independence lies. Where's the separation that makes that "independent contractor" independent? As long as Fat Freddy's DOT numbers and his brand are on the side of your bank financed truck and the only thing going them is Fat Freddy bar coded freight making him your only customer and your one only revenue stream what independence do you have outside of the right to decide when you've had enough being cuffed around in manner as bad if not worse than a traditional employee?

Furthermore, in this business you say you now have and the money you have invested in it, did you do it for one customer only? Is that one customer your only revenue stream? And does that one and only customer as a condition of doing business requires you to turn over the privileged financial records of your corporation for their "audit" and "review "in direct violation of US privacy laws ?
 

oldrps

Well-Known Member
"You really have no idea of what it's like to run a business". That's the entire point of this thread. If you are a FXG "independent contractor" you don't have a business. If you are an independent show me where the independence lies. Where's the separation that makes that "independent contractor" independent? As long as Fat Freddy's DOT numbers and his brand are on the side of your bank financed truck and the only thing going them is Fat Freddy bar coded freight making him your only customer and your one only revenue stream what independence do you have outside of the right to decide when you've had enough being cuffed around in manner as bad if not worse than a traditional employee?

Furthermore, in this business you say you now have and the money you have invested in it, did you do it for one customer only? Is that one customer your only revenue stream? And does that one and only customer as a condition of doing business requires you to turn over the privileged financial records of your corporation for their "audit" and "review "in direct violation of US privacy laws ?
You made the choice over and over through the years to stay. You could have left at any time with a 30 day notice or when the agreement came up for renewal. How many times did you make the decision to renew the agreement? Why did you stay? It is hard to comprehend why someone, who despises this setup so much, would stay for 20 years. If you completed your obligation of the agreement, didn't renew and left, I wouldn't question you. You renewed many times knowing what you knew. If it was so bad, why did you stay? Please answer this simple question.

In my business, I made the decision not to have one customer like you did. If a customer required that that they audit my financial records, I would not do business with them.
 

bacha29

Well-Known Member

You made the choice over and over through the years to stay. You could have left at any time with a 30 day notice or when the agreement came up for renewal. How many times did you make the decision to renew the agreement? Why did you stay? It is hard to comprehend why someone, who despises this setup so much, would stay for 20 years. If you completed your obligation of the agreement, didn't renew and left, I wouldn't question you. You renewed many times knowing what you knew. If it was so bad, why did you stay? Please answer this simple question.

In my business, I made the decision not to have one customer like you did. If a customer required that that they audit my financial records, I would not do business with them.
By your own admission and plainly stated that you personally would find these terms unacceptable. So what makes you think that I or anyone for that matter would find them acceptable and not seek to improve upon them in an effort to make them more balanced more acceptable and to create the necessary separation normally associated with the word 'Independent"?

So what's the point in continuing to defend a set of terms that you by your own admission found unacceptable other than the fact that in your professional opinion what isn't good enough for you is good enough for somebody else? Let's see you try spinning that one.


Now tell me something . What was your point in posting an image of your EMPLOYEE manual? We're not talking about employees. We're talking about a group of people who are without employee status and the rights to due process . The only thing that manual accomplishes is to state for the record the conduct rules and disciplines for EMPLOYEES. For contractors without the benefit of a stated discipline and the limits of that discipline the company is free to do whatever it damn well pleases which is to this day a source of disdain for contractor employees who are not Fedex employees but still subjected to whatever discipline and penalties terminal management feels like dealing out including termination without cause even though the driver is not the employee of Fedex. Let's see you spin that one. What would your response be if your customer (your only one) demanded the termination of your employee even though it's YOUR EMPLOYEE NOT HIS and in your estimation didn't deserve to be fired but you're given no choice because your one and only customer refuses to do business with you which would ruin you unless you allowed yourself to be blackmailed in this manner? Would you allow yourself to be blackmailed in that fashion? This happens to Ground contractors all the time.
 

dmac1

Well-Known Member
By your own admission and plainly stated that you personally would find these terms unacceptable. So what makes you think that I or anyone for that matter would find them acceptable and not seek to improve upon them in an effort to make them more balanced more acceptable and to create the necessary separation normally associated with the word 'Independent"?

So what's the point in continuing to defend a set of terms that you by your own admission found unacceptable other than the fact that in your professional opinion what isn't good enough for you is good enough for somebody else? Let's see you try spinning that one.


Now tell me something . What was your point in posting an image of your EMPLOYEE manual? We're not talking about employees. We're talking about a group of people who are without employee status and the rights to due process . The only thing that manual accomplishes is to state for the record the conduct rules and disciplines for EMPLOYEES. For contractors without the benefit of a stated discipline and the limits of that discipline the company is free to do whatever it damn well pleases which is to this day a source of disdain for contractor employees who are not Fedex employees but still subjected to whatever discipline and penalties terminal management feels like dealing out including termination without cause even though the driver is not the employee of Fedex. Let's see you spin that one. What would your response be if your customer (your only one) demanded the termination of your employee even though it's YOUR EMPLOYEE NOT HIS and in your estimation didn't deserve to be fired but you're given no choice because your one and only customer refuses to do business with you which would ruin you unless you allowed yourself to be blackmailed in this manner? Would you allow yourself to be blackmailed in that fashion? This happens to Ground contractors all the time.
Providing an employee manual in a discussion about stupid arguments supporting the claim of independence. Definitely stupid. And that may qualify him to be a republican congressional member.
 

oldrps

Well-Known Member
By your own admission and plainly stated that you personally would find these terms unacceptable. So what makes you think that I or anyone for that matter would find them acceptable and not seek to improve upon them in an effort to make them more balanced more acceptable and to create the necessary separation normally associated with the word 'Independent"?

So what's the point in continuing to defend a set of terms that you by your own admission found unacceptable other than the fact that in your professional opinion what isn't good enough for you is good enough for somebody else? Let's see you try spinning that one.


Now tell me something . What was your point in posting an image of your EMPLOYEE manual? We're not talking about employees. We're talking about a group of people who are without employee status and the rights to due process . The only thing that manual accomplishes is to state for the record the conduct rules and disciplines for EMPLOYEES. For contractors without the benefit of a stated discipline and the limits of that discipline the company is free to do whatever it damn well pleases which is to this day a source of disdain for contractor employees who are not Fedex employees but still subjected to whatever discipline and penalties terminal management feels like dealing out including termination without cause even though the driver is not the employee of Fedex. Let's see you spin that one. What would your response be if your customer (your only one) demanded the termination of your employee even though it's YOUR EMPLOYEE NOT HIS and in your estimation didn't deserve to be fired but you're given no choice because your one and only customer refuses to do business with you which would ruin you unless you allowed yourself to be blackmailed in this manner? Would you allow yourself to be blackmailed in that fashion? This happens to Ground contractors all the time.
Where did I say I found the terms unacceptable?

You still have not answered my question, if it was so bad, why did you keep renewing your agreement.

Now tell me something . What was your point in posting an image of your EMPLOYEE manual?
I was responding to your post doubting I was an employee. You seem to have doubts I was employed by RPS/Ground, I wanted you to know I did work there.

So what's the point in continuing to defend a set of terms that you by your own admission found unacceptable other than the fact that in your professional opinion what isn't good enough for you is good enough for somebody else? Let's see you try spinning that one.

I never said they were unacceptable. How is that for spinning!

What would your response be if your customer (your only one) demanded the termination of your employee even though it's YOUR EMPLOYEE NOT HIS and in your estimation didn't deserve to be fired but you're given no choice because your one and only customer refuses to do business with you which would ruin you unless you allowed yourself to be blackmailed in this manner? Would you allow yourself to be blackmailed in that fashion? This happens to Ground contractors all the time.

One, I would never own a business with only one customer. Would I fire an employee if a customer demanded; depends on the circumstance, what did the employee do? If I didn't fire the employee, I would expect the customer to stop doing business with me.

My business has nothing in common with a Ground contractor, never said it did. So in your words "Let's see you try spinning that one.".

I gotta go, I am getting dizzy from all the spinning.
 

oldrps

Well-Known Member
Providing an employee manual in a discussion about stupid arguments supporting the claim of independence. Definitely stupid. And that may qualify him to be a republican congressional member.
Very first line of my post:
Ok, now you don't think I worked there, sorry you are incorrect. I attached an image of the Employee Manual that we were given back in the 90's.

Read his post I was replying to, he was doubting I was an employee. I posted my old employee manual to show I worked there. I have never said a contractor was employee.
 

bacha29

Well-Known Member
Where did I say I found the terms unacceptable?

You still have not answered my question, if it was so bad, why did you keep renewing your agreement.

Now tell me something . What was your point in posting an image of your EMPLOYEE manual?
I was responding to your post doubting I was an employee. You seem to have doubts I was employed by RPS/Ground, I wanted you to know I did work there.

So what's the point in continuing to defend a set of terms that you by your own admission found unacceptable other than the fact that in your professional opinion what isn't good enough for you is good enough for somebody else? Let's see you try spinning that one.

I never said they were unacceptable. How is that for spinning!

What would your response be if your customer (your only one) demanded the termination of your employee even though it's YOUR EMPLOYEE NOT HIS and in your estimation didn't deserve to be fired but you're given no choice because your one and only customer refuses to do business with you which would ruin you unless you allowed yourself to be blackmailed in this manner? Would you allow yourself to be blackmailed in that fashion? This happens to Ground contractors all the time.

One, I would never own a business with only one customer. Would I fire an employee if a customer demanded; depends on the circumstance, what did the employee do? If I didn't fire the employee, I would expect the customer to stop doing business with me.

My business has nothing in common with a Ground contractor, never said it did. So in your words "Let's see you try spinning that one.".

I gotta go, I am getting dizzy from all the spinning.
I was one of a 4 man (3 contractors 1 TM) Day1 terminal start up operation team charged with task of making it a viable concern not just for myself but for those who wanted to try it. It was a terminal that was designated for closing twice in it's first 3 years of operation . After gaining a modest measure of growth the opportunity arose for a few more contracting opportunities. For those who were interested we made it quite clear that we preferred that they not take the offer but if they insisted we made it abundantly clear that the and daily work experience would be completely different and not to their benefit from what the company told them. None lasted more than a couple of years but when leaving expressed their appreciation for our never lying to them about they would be confronted with.

During that time 11 entry level terminal mangers went through there on their first TM assignments. Each one moved on to new and elevated company assignments. They expressed their appreciation for our efforts to get them to a better place. I reminded them that we got them a ticket to the show but could do no more. Today only 2 of the 11 remain with FXG.

Today it's a viable operation inbounding 9-10K and 900-1K outbound . Unfortunately it's reputation of not being a good place to work for a plethora of legitimate remains leaving contractors with the same headache of having to maintain 3 drivers on every truck One coming, one driving and one leaving. Wouldn't be necessary if they could offer a competitive wage and benefit package And often completely running out of them leaving them short handed and no choice but to dump even more freight onto the overworked few who reman. I still get calls from them wanting me to go up and help them. My response was to borrow a lyric from a song by Sugarlof. .." Don't call us child...We'll call you".
 

59 Dano

I just want to make friends!
You still have not answered my question, if it was so bad, why did you keep renewing your agreement.

I was one of a 4 man (3 contractors 1 TM) Day1 terminal start up operation team charged with task of making it a viable concern not just for myself but for those who wanted to try it. It was a terminal that was designated for closing twice in it's first 3 years of operation . After gaining a modest measure of growth the opportunity arose for a few more contracting opportunities. For those who were interested we made it quite clear that we preferred that they not take the offer but if they insisted we made it abundantly clear that the and daily work experience would be completely different and not to their benefit from what the company told them. None lasted more than a couple of years but when leaving expressed their appreciation for our never lying to them about they would be confronted with.

During that time 11 entry level terminal mangers went through there on their first TM assignments. Each one moved on to new and elevated company assignments. They expressed their appreciation for our efforts to get them to a better place. I reminded them that we got them a ticket to the show but could do no more. Today only 2 of the 11 remain with FXG.

Today it's a viable operation inbounding 9-10K and 900-1K outbound . Unfortunately it's reputation of not being a good place to work for a plethora of legitimate remains leaving contractors with the same headache of having to maintain 3 drivers on every truck One coming, one driving and one leaving. Wouldn't be necessary if they could offer a competitive wage and benefit package And often completely running out of them leaving them short handed and no choice but to dump even more freight onto the overworked few who reman. I still get calls from them wanting me to go up and help them. My response was to borrow a lyric from a song by Sugarlof. .." Don't call us child...We'll call you".

And he still has not answered the question. So many words, so little said.
 

bacha29

Well-Known Member
I was one of a 4 man (3 contractors 1 TM) Day1 terminal start up operation team charged with task of making it a viable concern not just for myself but for those who wanted to try it. It was a terminal that was designated for closing twice in it's first 3 years of operation . After gaining a modest measure of growth the opportunity arose for a few more contracting opportunities. For those who were interested we made it quite clear that we preferred that they not take the offer but if they insisted we made it abundantly clear that the and daily work experience would be completely different and not to their benefit from what the company told them. None lasted more than a couple of years but when leaving expressed their appreciation for our never lying to them about they would be confronted with.

During that time 11 entry level terminal mangers went through there on their first TM assignments. Each one moved on to new and elevated company assignments. They expressed their appreciation for our efforts to get them to a better place. I reminded them that we got them a ticket to the show but could do no more. Today only 2 of the 11 remain with FXG.

Today it's a viable operation inbounding 9-10K and 900-1K outbound . Unfortunately it's reputation of not being a good place to work for a plethora of legitimate remains leaving contractors with the same headache of having to maintain 3 drivers on every truck One coming, one driving and one leaving. Wouldn't be necessary if they could offer a competitive wage and benefit package And often completely running out of them leaving them short handed and no choice but to dump even more freight onto the overworked few who reman. I still get calls from them wanting me to go up and help them. My response was to borrow a lyric from a song by Sugarlof. .." Don't call us child...We'll call you".
Oh, I answered the question alright. Just because you didn't like the answer doesn't mean that I didn't answer the question.
 

dmac1

Well-Known Member
  1. Ok, now you don't think I worked there, sorry you are incorrect. I attached an image of the Employee Manual that we were given back in the 90's. You said that RPS/FedEx had no say, but you are using their DOT number so yes, they have a say.
  2. Ok, thanks for making it more clear. What was the reason that the management of your terminal held you accountable for another contractor's route?
  3. Read your own statement, I answered it. You said "If the government does not get involved in every contract .. then why did it get involved in this one?" Why didn't you simply state what you just stated, that they got involved because was a lawsuit, it would have made more since. Your statement implied that the government gets involved without reason. Someone had to bring it to their attention which was done by a lawsuit. Quit being purposely vague with your statements. How was I supposed to know what you meant when you don't state it.
  4. "...disciplinary rules and protocols" I feel there is more to this statement than you are providing. Are you saying if a contractor stole or damaged a package while in the terminal, nothing should happen to them? What discipline did you receive and what protocols did you have to follow?
  5. What is your point with this statement. Your customer was RPS/FedEx, the one that paid you for your services. Remember they are the one you signed an agreement with to provide a service. How are they not your customer, no one else pays you for you service? Were you really a business person? I can't believe you didn't know that RPS/FedEx was your customer.

    Wikipedia says a customer is: In sales, commerce and economics, a customer is the recipient of a good, service, product or an idea - obtained from a seller, vendor, or supplier via a financial transaction or exchange for money or some other valuable consideration.
After all this back and forth, when are you going to realize that if you give more details in your statements/questions, it makes things more clear. I think you purposely are being vague to hide information.

I was there in the 90's and the early 2000's. Yes, the agreement has been modified over the years, I know that. I have never disputed or questioned that. The addendum was changed almost every year, sometimes a couple of times. I bet the agreement is modified more over the next few years as regulatory/business needs change. Maybe someday the government may rule contractors illegal and they might have employee drivers. I haven't worked there in almost 20 years so I don't know what the current or past 20 years agreements says or nor do I care. I do know what was in the agreement while I was there though.

As a business owner since 2004, I can assure you I am versed in running a business. A lot of things you say are misleading when it comes to running a business. You keep talking about getting cash against depreciated assets that you are forced to purchase. Nearly all assets depreciate over time. I have invested over $120,000 in equipment since 2004 and guess what, it ain't worth that much today. You better believe that I counted the depreciation for tax purposes though. If I went out of business, I would not expect to get much for my equipment. I have had to get loans to purchase equipment and later to repair them. I had to get a loan and use my house as collateral because I had a piece of equipment go down. I needed a loan for to fix it and it was not worth much, but the replacement cost was too high. I bet you never had to chase RPS/FedEx down to get money owed to you. Nearly run out of cash because your RPS/FedEx did not pay you for 60 - 90 days. Have a competitor undercut your price, steal customers away and spread false information about your company. You really have no idea what is like to run a business.
You do know that if you sell fully depreciated assets, it counts as income and you need to pay taxes on the sale? So if you have fully depreciated a vehicle, and sell it, and don't declare the income, you are violating tax laws. And if tax laws change- as they do- you could owe 25% or moreof your sale price as tax. So you might need to sell your 'business' for at least 25% more than you paid just to break even.

Just a reminder for prospective purchasers. And if you buy a business that made good cash flow in large part due to generous depreciation tables, once your assets are fully depreciated, you will see a drop in cash flow. Cash flow is not always an indication of true income and you should not value a purchase based on cash flow without fully understanding tax law. If you have an asset you depreciate over 7 years, with the cost being $70000, and have 6 of those assets, depending on your tax bracket, after 7 years, your income could suddenly drop by $15,000 per year. Hopefully, the assets would still have some useful life left, and you won't be making payments any longer.For a buyer, knowing the depreciation already taken could be an important consideration when a contractor claims a 'positive cash flow' of a cetain amount, even if the positive cash flow is provable. Cash flow can be manipulated- just like statistics.
 

Ashcat12

New Member
You made the choice over and over through the years to stay. You could have left at any time with a 30 day notice or when the agreement came up for renewal. How many times did you make the decision to renew the agreement? Why did you stay? It is hard to comprehend why someone, who despises this setup so much, would stay for 20 years. If you completed your obligation of the agreement, didn't renew and left, I wouldn't question you. You renewed many times knowing what you knew. If it was so bad, why did you stay? Please answer this simple question.

In my business, I made the decision not to have one customer like you did. If a customer required that that they audit my financial records, I would not do business with them.
Simple - probably can't walk out and pick up another job off the "JOB" tree. Believe it or not, simply walking away isn't financially an option. To think it is is silly. It's called being trapped with to much invested. You can take this anyway you want- If RPS would have started in Md, my entity number would have been 1. I would have been the first contractor over to Fedex.My number is 37. When bacha29says statement that your only independent when Fedex decides is non-argumentively the truth. Don't dilude yourself that your running "YOUR" company. Anyone want to swap horror stories? Let me just give you one. My driver is in a line of traffic and stopped Get rear-ended on pushed into car in front of him. Fedex comes backand says it was your driver's responsibility to maintain a certain distance and the cause was on him. WTF-You kidding me? Cost me 1600 in CCS money- Un fkin real. So, what is your recourse. NOTHING because they will retaliate. Point being, you don't control YOUR business.
Anyway, I retired last year and handed over to my son. I now work at a golf course and Fedex. Geezus, retired and got two jobs!!!!!!!!!!!
Son works me to death. On the other side-It has supplied me with a wonderful life and will for my son. It's the day-to-day operations BECAUSE of management (We got a junior manger who has a "I AM GOD" complex who is a major *) that makes you wnna leave the whole scenario. But as to the point. Too much invested and limited options in todays economy.
 

bacha29

Well-Known Member
Simple - probably can't walk out and pick up another job off the "JOB" tree. Believe it or not, simply walking away isn't financially an option. To think it is is silly. It's called being trapped with to much invested. You can take this anyway you want- If RPS would have started in Md, my entity number would have been 1. I would have been the first contractor over to Fedex.My number is 37. When bacha29says statement that your only independent when Fedex decides is non-argumentively the truth. Don't dilude yourself that your running "YOUR" company. Anyone want to swap horror stories? Let me just give you one. My driver is in a line of traffic and stopped Get rear-ended on pushed into car in front of him. Fedex comes backand says it was your driver's responsibility to maintain a certain distance and the cause was on him. WTF-You kidding me? Cost me 1600 in CCS money- Un fkin real. So, what is your recourse. NOTHING because they will retaliate. Point being, you don't control YOUR business.
Anyway, I retired last year and handed over to my son. I now work at a golf course and Fedex. Geezus, retired and got two jobs!!!!!!!!!!!
Son works me to death. On the other side-It has supplied me with a wonderful life and will for my son. It's the day-to-day operations BECAUSE of management (We got a junior manger who has a "I AM GOD" complex who is a major *) that makes you wnna leave the whole scenario. But as to the point. Too much invested and limited options in todays economy.
Spot on. The more money you have at risk the more beholding you are to Fat Freddy and the hope that he'll do right by you. It's just hope nothing more. You're investment is completely unsecured. Now why would you're son work you to death other than the fact that he can't get anybody else?

As I've said before. There's not a single move a so called "independent contractor" can make that is not subjected to FXG command control and oversight This is when you start. This is when you stop. This is what you drive. This is what you wear. This is where you go. This is how you do it, etc,....Is no embellishment whatsoever. And it's YOUR business....yeah right.

And so if you're son still has you out there dragging Fat Freddy's junk just remember a verse from the Eagles song "Hotel California" .
"You can check out any time you like but you can never leave" And if he keeps working you like this , it should at least be comforting to know that your final trip back to the terminal will be in a hearse.
 

It will be fine

Well-Known Member
Spot on. The more money you have at risk the more beholding you are to Fat Freddy and the hope that he'll do right by you. It's just hope nothing more. You're investment is completely unsecured. Now why would you're son work you to death other than the fact that he can't get anybody else?

As I've said before. There's not a single move a so called "independent contractor" can make that is not subjected to FXG command control and oversight This is when you start. This is when you stop. This is what you drive. This is what you wear. This is where you go. This is how you do it, etc,....Is no embellishment whatsoever. And it's YOUR business....yeah right.

And so if you're son still has you out there dragging Fat Freddy's junk just remember a verse from the Eagles song "Hotel California" .
"You can check out any time you like but you can never leave" And if he keeps working you like this , it should at least be comforting to know that your final trip back to the terminal will be in a hearse.
He had a truck note, nothing more. That’s not really enough to continue contracting with Ground if it was so awful.
 

dmac1

Well-Known Member
Simple - probably can't walk out and pick up another job off the "JOB" tree. Believe it or not, simply walking away isn't financially an option. To think it is is silly. It's called being trapped with to much invested. You can take this anyway you want- If RPS would have started in Md, my entity number would have been 1. I would have been the first contractor over to Fedex.My number is 37. When bacha29says statement that your only independent when Fedex decides is non-argumentively the truth. Don't dilude yourself that your running "YOUR" company. Anyone want to swap horror stories? Let me just give you one. My driver is in a line of traffic and stopped Get rear-ended on pushed into car in front of him. Fedex comes backand says it was your driver's responsibility to maintain a certain distance and the cause was on him. WTF-You kidding me? Cost me 1600 in CCS money- Un fkin real. So, what is your recourse. NOTHING because they will retaliate. Point being, you don't control YOUR business.
Anyway, I retired last year and handed over to my son. I now work at a golf course and Fedex. Geezus, retired and got two jobs!!!!!!!!!!!
Son works me to death. On the other side-It has supplied me with a wonderful life and will for my son. It's the day-to-day operations BECAUSE of management (We got a junior manger who has a "I AM GOD" complex who is a major *) that makes you wnna leave the whole scenario. But as to the point. Too much invested and limited options in todays economy.
I was able to walk away. The 'investors' who have their family's financial security tied up in the scam are trapped. Talk about eggs in baskets- remember they can all be broken if you aren't extremely careful. None of them can honestly even criticize fedex for fear of not being renewed, so of course when they post here they flaunt their brown noses.
 

oldrps

Well-Known Member
Spot on. The more money you have at risk the more beholding you are to Fat Freddy and the hope that he'll do right by you. It's just hope nothing more. You're investment is completely unsecured. Now why would you're son work you to death other than the fact that he can't get anybody else?

As I've said before. There's not a single move a so called "independent contractor" can make that is not subjected to FXG command control and oversight This is when you start. This is when you stop. This is what you drive. This is what you wear. This is where you go. This is how you do it, etc,....Is no embellishment whatsoever. And it's YOUR business....yeah right.

And so if you're son still has you out there dragging Fat Freddy's junk just remember a verse from the Eagles song "Hotel California" .
"You can check out any time you like but you can never leave" And if he keeps working you like this , it should at least be comforting to know that your final trip back to the terminal will be in a hearse.
Spot on. The more money you have at risk the more beholding you are to Fat Freddy and the hope that he'll do right by you. It's just hope nothing more. You're investment is completely unsecured. Now why would you're son work you to death other than the fact that he can't get anybody else?

As far as I have seen, you never ran more than one vehicle. How hard would it for a single vehicle owner to leave when they pay it off? I had many contractors that did this.

As I've said before. There's not a single move a so called "independent contractor" can make that is not subjected to FXG command control and oversight This is when you start. This is when you stop. This is what you drive. This is what you wear. This is where you go. This is how you do it, etc,....Is no embellishment whatsoever. And it's YOUR business....yeah right.

Your telling everyone that RPS/FedEx told you everyday how to run your route? You never ever ever made a single move without calling FedEx. Major BS in this paragraph. You could have expanded on what you said with examples to make it more clear, but again you didn't. My favorite statement in this paragraph is "This is where you go.". Did the terminal management have to tell you to look at the label on the package so you knew where to go or did you not know that?

And so if you're son still has you out there dragging Fat Freddy's junk just remember a verse from the Eagles song "Hotel California" .
"You can check out any time you like but you can never leave" And if he keeps working you like this , it should at least be comforting to know that your final trip back to the terminal will be in a hearse.


His choice, why do you care?

So why did you do this for 20 years?? You have never answered this. You owe it to this forum to explain why. You can't say something was so bad and I mean real bad, but stay for so long and not explain why you stayed. Fool me for a few years, shame on RPS/FedEx; fool me for 20 years, shame on bacha29.
 
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