And while we are on the subject of Unions

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by dannyboy, Jul 14, 2006.

  1. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    You know, I was working in the garage over the weekend on some display stuff I am re-habbing for the retail store, and I came across several pieces that were "proudly union made".

    That got me to thinking about several things that have been said on this board of late.

    Some of you think of me as a throwback to Mayberry. I take that as a compliment. So thank you.

    Maybe if the world had more people that were in tune to others, there would not be the problems we have today. Like the young man that parked his car at the gas pumps, leaving the stereo blasting to where the bass was shaking the pump I was using. Never did get any gas, but blocked the island while he picked up a couple of sixpacs, and added greatly to the noise pollution. Mind you, I enjoy music and at times loudly, but the whomp whomp whomp is not music unless there is something that goes with it. And some poor guy that cant carry a tune screaming over the whomp whomp whomp ............

    Anyway, back to the union thing.

    There was a time when union anything was a thing of pride. Union made was the best you could buy, both in quality and price. It was the best of the best. People that had union jobs were looked up to and respected, it was a thing to rejoice over when a family member had a union job. And while there were times that were tough, that never dimmed the pride people had for being a union member.

    Fast forward to today. The union is there to get you out of trouble because you screwed up. You lied, stole, what ever. You did things that you knew you could get fired for and you did it anyway, and whine when the steward gets you a 2 week suspension instead of termination.

    There is no pride in what you do, all you are interested in is a paycheck. The fact that you have one of the best, most respected jobs in the country does not mean a thing. You are only interested in screwing the company that you think is screwing you.

    As for customer satisfaction, who cares, that is the companies problem, not yours. You will shaft the customer to make a statement to the company that you are over worked. The customer that pays your paycheck. Oh I know, what the heck, If I loose a couple, that much less work, right? Really? And UPS does not cut out routes because the volume is down?

    Horse apples!

    Maybe my kind is not ready for what UPS is becoming. Maybe we need to be turned out like the old gas package cars. And maybe what are the up and coming service providers are what this company will be like in a few years. I sure as heck hope not. But from what I have seen lately, and it would seem from some of the posters here, it sure looks like it will.

    I only hope that Fedex and DHL et al have the same problems, but worse.

    Otherwise it will become like one of my ex sups used to answer the phone with....United Partial Service.

    End of Rant!

  2. mittam

    mittam Member

    Restore Union Pride, Take Control of Your Union Job, Bring Back The Days That YOU Were Proud To Say "I'm a Union Member" Restore The Days That The Union Worked For You, Not You Working For Them And Paying An Inflated Dues Amount For Poor Representation........ VOTE APWA
  3. 30andout

    30andout New Member

    Mittam I think that is what we need is a union that is by UPS people I feel that the employees care more about the customers than the company does, at least the older employees. Maybe the company would stop counting beans and get back to good service.
  4. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    I agree with the idea of a UPS only union but whether it comes to past or not is an extreme longshot IMO. APWA still has a long way to go IMO before that can even start to become a reality but I'm hopeful they get an honest shot at it and I encourage anyone to hear them out whether you agree with the idea or not.

    As for the comment about the employees caring more, in the case of the older employee I think in the majority of the cases that is true. I also find that generally speaking the older hourly and the older ground level management have a lot of similar thinking for the most part across the board. It's truly amazing what you will learn from a UPS management person about their own feeling especially once that manager has entered retirement and you and he share a steak dinner together. Even when he was a manager and you were the steward, it was surprising how much in common you had on the things you couldn't talk about at the time. To this day one of the things my wife and I enjoy the most it attending NASCAR races with my former supervisor and his wife who got out in 95'. We have a very good friendship that I treasure and I've learned alot through his eyes about UPS. I also don't look at the ground level management as all enemy either but like the hourly ranks, you've got some sorry asses mixed in with a large bunch of good people. I can only imagine how great we would be if all the junk and politics got out of the way so that all of us could work together and just do our jobs. FedEx wouldn't have a prayer and yes I really do believe that!

    Problem is that level of management has had the ability and authority to manage their operations stripped from them and they are nothing more than enforcement arms for the high powers who in many cases have never worked a day in the real world and wouldn't know it if they saw it. Their concern is nothing but what I got to do, who or what do I have to manipulate to look good in order to move up to a cushier and more powerful job. And to compound it all are the bean counters who are chasing a number in order to make a stock holder happy. At one time the means to a good stock price was servicing the customer and being the absolute best we can be. That is not the case anymore IMO. United Partial Service is the new name of this company!

    Oh, and one last thing to consider. Much worry is being expressed about APWA or the concern over the company taking over our pension. Now I'll agree that a company only pension would need some language in it to make me more comfortable but all this talk about UPS not being able to be trusted. I do understand some of that but last night in discussing the pension with another feeder driver of some years he gave me 2 words when it came to trusting the company and what the return on investment might be if we did. Those 2 words?

    Thrift Plan! And like you I couldn't argue with that either.

  5. susiedriver

    susiedriver New Member

    As I recall, (too lazy to lookup) the thrift plan was based solely on the value of UPS. If that were the case today, the return wouldn't be as good. Certainly not those 20+% years I fondly remember.

    The result of the IPO, IMO, was that you got about 7-10 years of earnings up front, instead of a nice 15% return every year. UPS will be flat to down for a few more years. I don't think we'll see $90 until the Teamsters and Pilots are settled in their contracts. JMO,

    Keep cool
  6. ups79

    ups79 Active Member

    the pilots have a tentative agreement.
  7. 1980

    1980 Member

    Amen!!!! Well said.My definition of a union worker is someone who works hard and proud and is fairly compensated for their work.Too many feel like you said that the union is there to let them do as little as possible.NOT TRUE. If we take out more than we put in we will wind up like the UAW. IN DEEP SH#T!!! Contract says it best, fair days pay for a fair days work.I feel that these problems are not confined to that company but are just society in general today,its a damm shame.We can learn alot from history and history will tell us that the OLD union values are what made this country great, not the ones shared by some today.I hope we wake up before its too late. If the Roman Empire fell,we could too!!
  8. susiedriver

    susiedriver New Member

    I think you meant to say "the pilots have a TENTATIVE agreement.:wink:
  9. over9five

    over9five Moderator Staff Member

    There are no union workers anywhere that work harder than a UPSer.

    Think about it. Steel workers? Construction workers? Sure, they work hard, but certainly not at the pace we do.

    I don't think the general public knows we are Union. (Maybe during the strike, but people quickly forget). We are well liked, and the Teamsters would improve their image to align themselves with us. You know, advertise the fact that your local UPSer is a Teamster.
  10. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    Seems like that was said at one point wasn't it!
  11. susiedriver

    susiedriver New Member

    Et tu, Keith?
  12. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    Gee Ceasar, make a promise and aren't willing to see the deal through?

  13. tieguy

    tieguy Banned

    You lovebirds are so cute.:thumbup1:
  14. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    It is pretty bad when you lose in a one man race!

    Ever notice that these two have so much in common. Maybe they really ought to leave and start their own chat. Call it I hate;)

    As for union issues, I lost all my respect for the teamsters when several high ranking officials made the statement while recruiting that basically we all would not be making a really good living if it were not for the teamsters union. So we are totally dependent on them, in their minds. We are nothing without them, and they know it. In their minds, its not the other way around. If for no other reason, this could be a real wakeup call for the high and mighty at the teamsters as to who really needs who. And who is working for whom


  15. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    Well, they're correct in one aspect of this, without them we wouldn't have Central States!
  16. ja4079

    ja4079 ja4079

    wkmac great last post, truer words were never spoken!!:thumbup1:
  17. sendagain

    sendagain Member

    I think the union just became one more huge, self-seeking organization, very similar to a political party. They gear up for the big contract talks, spout a lot of breast-beating rhetoric, pat a lot of guys on the back and brag about having our interests in mind. When all is said and the contract is resolved, they disappear and concentrate on making things great for themselves. They find ways to get paid from multiple locals and make little effort to really address problems. On the other hand, corporations only are as good as the people running them. When the moral compass of an organization is sacrificed for greed, the decline and destruction of that entity is inevitable.
  18. wkmac

    wkmac Well-Known Member

    Thanks ja4079 but pass those thanks on to sendagain as IMO that was the more excellent post!

    Well said Send!
  19. diadlover

    diadlover New Member

    WTF danny? Yeah, I'm not your #1 fan but come on now. Comparing me to SUSIEDRIVER? That hurts.
  20. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    I find it interesting that the AFLCIO went to California to meet with and direct the illegals there that are tired of working for 15 bucks an hour. They are holding out for 17-18 an hour, and the AFLCIO went out there to help in the process.

    So the union is supporting illegals in the quest for wages that are getting close to $20 an hour. Why are they supporting the illegals anyway? Are they not here illegally? Why would they want to organize people that are here illegally?

    Maybe if they spent some of that energy on higher wages for their membership, working with manufacturing to make our home grown products more competitive in the worlds economy? After all, we do pay THEIR wages.

    d PS, you are right. That was totally uncalled for by me. I publicly apologize for the correlation between the two of you.;)
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2006